The Guardian/Observer finally pulls it's head out of the sand

[afleitch]

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,1548786,00.html

The trumpet of the left-wing intelligista, the only paper that can actually challenge their opinion without being accused of being anything ending in 'phobic' or 'ist' finally gets to the point with a strong piece of journalism.
 
http://observer.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,6903,1548786,00.html

'But an Observer investigation can reveal that, far from being moderate, the Muslim Council of Britain has its origins in the extreme orthodox politics in Pakistan. And as its influence increases through Whitehall, many within the Muslim community are growing concerned that this self-appointed organisation is crowding out other, genuinely moderate, voices of Muslim Britain.'

Iqbal Sacranie, sorry Sir Iqbal Sacranie is the one who invited Osama to visit the UK as a 'moderate' back in 1996 and if it wasn't for Michael Howards intervention would probably have resulted in very red faces over here after 9/11.

[phk]

You guy should better keep the growth of Wahhabism in check.

[afleitch]

We would like to, but we have allowed ourselves to succumb to an 'any minority is a victim' culture. It means it is very difficult to say someone or something is wrong for so long as it is viewed as a 'minority' issue. Therefore while we all know Muslims and Hindus don't get on, and that the black community is also divided and has turned in on itself in an orgy of gang violence in our inner cities but we are not allowed to legitimately air these concerns, and the moment that we do someone from the Guardian, the MCB, Liberty and various other sources tell us that we are all being 'xenophobic' or 'racist' and therefore they silence the debate. To speak out against forced marriages or homophobia within minority communities is countered with charges to 'mind our own business.'  Our police force is therefore straightjacketed to the extent that a little black girl Victoria Climbie is murdered by her own relatives even though both the police and social work are aware that she is in danger. Why? Because they dont want to be accused of being racist or 'misundertanding African child rearing practices.' It sick, sick right down to the very core from the courts to the government to the media.

More articles
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2088-1734196,00.html
http://observer.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,6903,1548890,00.html

It's time to fight back. And its time for the left to attack the left for creating this grotesque society.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

'But an Observer investigation can reveal that, far from being moderate, the Muslim Council of Britain has its origins in the extreme orthodox politics in Pakistan. And as its influence increases through Whitehall, many within the Muslim community are growing concerned that this self-appointed organisation is crowding out other, genuinely moderate, voices of Muslim Britain.'

I had heard something about them being linked to Jamaat-i-Islami (wasn't sure of the accuracy though) but yes it is suprising, and good, that the Obsever dug it out. MCB is very much a conservative organisation rather than a radical one though; combined with the Biraderi system the influence of the MCB (which is probably a good representative of mainstream opinion... of the people that run the Mosques. Not ordinary Muslims) has caused more than a few problems with local politics in some areas (as always I recommend you all to look at the results in the Manningham and City wards in the 2004 Bradford City Council elections. In case ya don't know where to look... Manningham elected a counciller from each party (Labour won the most votes across the ward... if voting trends were normal they'd have taken 2/3 seats. They weren't. Guess why) and City was even weirder... a decent-ish Labour lead in votes... but we only won 1 out of the 3 seats; the Tories took the other two. Guess why) but to be fair they aren't an organisation to be *worried* about... the people that worry me are the MAB (and I'm sure you know which Egyption organisation they're linked to...)

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Not suprising at all, but Sir Iqbal isn't a bad guy really... not these days at any rate. One of the reasons why MAB, Hizb-ut-Tahir and all that hate him is because he used to be quite the hothead. There's footage of him burning the Satanic Verses IIRC. He's not brilliant (not just for his dodgy past) but as a representative of conservative Deobani opinion he's much better than the alternatives (ie; an 80 year old who can only speak broken English, never gives a sermon in English, has political views that can be best described as "very reactionary" and is totally out of touch with the real world. There are a couple of people like this on Bradford City Council, btw. Pretty much all are Tories, although IIRC there's a Liberal like it as well).

[Filuwaúrdjan]

We would like to, but we have allowed ourselves to succumb to an 'any minority is a victim' culture. It means it is very difficult to say someone or something is wrong for so long as it is viewed as a 'minority' issue.

True. Note that the people that insist on that are whites living in well off suburbs (Crouch End anyone?) with sod all minorities in the neighbourhood...

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Oh I've never got into trouble for saying that. Then again seeing as I'm working class and white, according to The Crouch End View Of The World I'm supposed to be a skinhead, wear a Union Jack t-shirt and go Paki-basing every Friday night

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There is no "black community". Africans and Caribbeans are as different as any two seperate minority groups. (This is not the case according to The Crouch End View Of The World).

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Orgy is an exaggeration and two seperate communities (gangs are usually made up of either just Caribbeans or just Africans) can hardly turn in on themselves. It has been a big problem in parts of Brum though... things cooled down a fair bit after those two girls were murdered actually.

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See "The Crouch End View Of The World"

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Rants involving Liberty are my personal property you hear me?

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True. I'm so very pleased that Cryer increased her majority in Keighley.

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The problem is the patronising Crouch End types.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

You guy should better keep the growth of Wahhabism in check.

The fact that the MAB is still allowed on TV to "represent" Muslim opinion is worrying... but I think that might stop soon.

[afleitch]

When I said that the black community was divided thats exactly what I meant; Afro-Carribeans v African newcomers from Nigeria, Sudan etc. They therefore 'turn in on themselves' because they are different cultures entirely.

[Filuwaúrdjan]

When I said that the black community was divided thats exactly what I meant; Afro-Carribeans v African newcomers from Nigeria, Sudan etc. They therefore 'turn in on themselves' because they are different cultures entirely.

The idea that there is a black community at all in the U.K is a bit of a myth though (and the Nigerians themselves are very divided between Fundamentalists and Traditionalists-with-a-Fundamentalist veil)... as an example (and of how the media tends to ignore it) is the fact that in the big Guardian pullout on "London; the World in One City" (dunno if that were the actually title, but you get the idea. Had some very nice ward maps actually) featured a comment from a Southwark (from one of the two-and-a-half Rotherhithe wards) LibDem counciller (African) that would not have been printed if he'd been white and "white" had replaced "africans" (he as good as said that Africans are racially superior to Caribbeans. All dressed up o/c but not hard to work out...). Won't repeat his name, but he was the LibDem candidate in Deptford last election.

[afleitch]

That wouldn't suprise me. At around the same time the Guardian printed a series of interviews with 3rd generation Carribeans said that Africans were a 'dirty kind of black.' And as you said, if any one of us used that language we'd be hauled up for it. Sadly we have a record of double standards over what constitutes racism here too.