Hybrid boondoggle?

[opebo]

I was just watching a news story about all the new 'hybrid' cars coming out.  I had to laugh!  Like SUVs coming out a year ago.

How are they ever going to sell all those crackpot hybrid vehicles now that fuel is normalized?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Hopefully some people aren't stupid enough to think "OMG gas prices are down! Now I can go buy a huge gas guzzling SUV and move 50 miles away from my job again."

[Stranger in a strange land]

4 dollar a gallon gas could very well return, and will at some point.

[opebo]

Hopefully some people aren't stupid enough to think "OMG gas prices are down! Now I can go buy a huge gas guzzling SUV and move 50 miles away from my job again."

Well, that's right, but hopefully they don't waste their money on an excessively complex and expensive hybrid when a normal car gets plenty good enough mileage.  In other words the point is that it doesn't make sense to buy something that's going to be with you for 10+ years based on either extreme of the 'market' fuel price swing.

[Matt Damon™]

The car culture is a boondoggle and unworkable in the long run. Ideally the feds would jack up car/gas/license taxes and pump that in building a working rail system.

[Swing low, sweet chariot. Comin' for to carry me home.]

Hopefully some people aren't stupid enough to think "OMG gas prices are down! Now I can go buy a huge gas guzzling SUV and move 50 miles away from my job again."

Actually, I wasn't stupid enough to sell my paid-for SUV and buy an expensive hybrid by thinking "OMG gas will remain $4/gallon forever!  Now I have to go into debt buying an expensive and unsafe hybrid and sell my appreciating home and buy a quickly devaluing home closer than 50 miles away from my job."

[??????????]

The car culture is a boondoggle and unworkable in the long run. Ideally the feds would jack up car/gas/license taxes and pump that in building a working rail system.

Yeah, punish rural citizens!

[Хahar 🤔]

Hybrids are generally uneconomical.

[Person Man]

The car culture is a boondoggle and unworkable in the long run. Ideally the feds would jack up car/gas/license taxes and pump that in building a working rail system.

Yeah, punish rural citizens!

...and people still like to drive their own cars.  Still, though...there needs to be a highspeed rail system for places where driving has grown infeasable....then again, the burden would fall on rural citizens. Perhaps rural governments could subsidize gasoline to offset the increase in gasoline taxes that go towards building the railway systems and what remains of our automotive sector can concentrate on making larger cars more fuel efficient and selling them....the federal government can then assist these rural communities by funneling more of the remaining highway funding to them to offset their expenses.

I mean, there will be a burden for more alternative and hybrid R&D and rail building, but we can spread the costs away from rural citizens, though their housholds and businesses recieve the bulk of federal transfer payments.

...and to answer your question about oil prices being too low to support alternative fuel, there is always the big Global Warming thing that even has the likes of McCain and Gingrich squirming.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Hopefully some people aren't stupid enough to think "OMG gas prices are down! Now I can go buy a huge gas guzzling SUV and move 50 miles away from my job again."

Actually, I wasn't stupid enough to sell my paid-for SUV and buy an expensive hybrid by thinking "OMG gas will remain $4/gallon forever!  Now I have to go into debt buying an expensive and unsafe hybrid and sell my appreciating home and buy a quickly devaluing home closer than 50 miles away from my job."

The smart thing is not getting into those conditions to begin with. I drive a small fuel-economical car and live close enough to my job. When I had to move in June I made sure to look for a place closer to it.

[opebo]

Hopefully some people aren't stupid enough to think "OMG gas prices are down! Now I can go buy a huge gas guzzling SUV and move 50 miles away from my job again."

Actually, I wasn't stupid enough to sell my paid-for SUV and buy an expensive hybrid by thinking "OMG gas will remain $4/gallon forever!  Now I have to go into debt buying an expensive and unsafe hybrid and sell my appreciating home and buy a quickly devaluing home closer than 50 miles away from my job."

The smart thing is not getting into those conditions to begin with. I drive a small fuel-economical car and live close enough to my job. When I had to move in June I made sure to look for a place closer to it.

There's nothing unreasonable about buying say, an ordinary Corolla or even an ordinary small American car (carefully researched and chosen to avoid the many lemon-models).  In fact to defend jmfcst, I think he said he has an old Corolla in addition to his large SUV.  But to buy something very expensive and overly technologically complex like a hybrid is just foolishly asking for trouble and expense to save a small amount on gas (which has of course gone down anyway).  What do they say, 'Penny wise, Pound Foolish'?

As an aside, jmfcst has an excellent point about small cars being very unsafe.  If I were a family man I would probably buy something like a Lincoln Town Car (I dislike most SUVs).  Think about it - even at $4/gallon the fuel cost is not that big a deal between a 22 mpg safe comfortable car and a 45 mpg tiny, buzzy death trap.  And the cost differential would be totally whipped out if you had the sense to buy 5 year old cars.

Even as a single guy only marginally attached to this dirty old globe, I always drive full sized V-8 sedans when in America.

[MODU]

I don't think the issue is cheaper gas prices.  The issue is that many hybrids have mpg ratings similar to their non-hybrid counterparts.  Add on top of that the higher initial costs for these "green" machines, they become unattractive to buyers.  Some hybrids, like Honda's, are quite well designed and practical.  The GM hybrids, on the other hand, aren't.

[Verily]

I don't think the issue is cheaper gas prices.  The issue is that many hybrids have mpg ratings similar to their non-hybrid counterparts.  Add on top of that the higher initial costs for these "green" machines, they become unattractive to buyers.  Some hybrids, like Honda's, are quite well designed and practical.  The GM hybrids, on the other hand, aren't.

Shock... The Big Three "hybrids" aren't really hybrids in the useful sense. They just use the electric part of their engines to generate more horsepower for drivers to not use. And of course people are drawn to buy high horsepower cars they don't need because they're morons (think buying an SUV at any point).

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I don't think the issue is cheaper gas prices.  The issue is that many hybrids have mpg ratings similar to their non-hybrid counterparts.  Add on top of that the higher initial costs for these "green" machines, they become unattractive to buyers.  Some hybrids, like Honda's, are quite well designed and practical.  The GM hybrids, on the other hand, aren't.

Shock... The Big Three "hybrids" aren't really hybrids in the useful sense. They just use the electric part of their engines to generate more horsepower for drivers to not use. And of course people are drawn to buy high horsepower cars they don't need because they're morons (think buying an SUV at any point).

Yeah the question needs to be asked why suburbanites are so big on Sport Utility Vehicles in the first place. You don't need something designed for off-road driving to take the kids to school and football practice.

[opebo]

Shock... The Big Three "hybrids" aren't really hybrids in the useful sense. They just use the electric part of their engines to generate more horsepower for drivers to not use. And of course people are drawn to buy high horsepower cars they don't need because they're morons (think buying an SUV at any point).

People buy SUVs because they like SUVs, Verily - this is usually  because they want a very large vehicle.  Most people, given the choice, would prefer a larger vehicle to a smaller one.  Horsepower doesn't really enter into the decision except that of course a large, heavy vehicle will need more torque to get moving.

The fact is that there is nothing inherently moronic about wanting something better (for example a bigger, more comfortable automobile rather than a smaller, cramped one).. it is just unfortunate that americans can mostly no longer afford this kind of motoring.

[opebo]

Yeah the question needs to be asked why suburbanites are so big on Sport Utility Vehicles in the first place. You don't need something designed for off-road driving to take the kids to school and football practice.

I think it is pretty clear they're big on SUVs because 'real' cars are hardly made any more - big, heavy, full sized, V8 sedans... at least not at reasonable prices.

In 1969 an average american worker could buy a big, comfortable but basic Chevrolet Caprice or Ford LTD for something like 1/3 his years salary.. nowadays a Mercury Grand Marquis or Ford Crown Victoria is more like equal to one years salary...

[??????????]

Hybrids are generally uneconomical.

This is what people don't understand.  They pay out the ass for these things not realizing it will take them decades to make back the extra money in savings on gas.

And with a car, you don't have decades. I know you know that.

[opebo]

Hybrids are generally uneconomical.

This is what people don't understand.  They pay out the ass for these things not realizing it will take them decades to make back the extra money in savings on gas.

And with a car, you don't have decades. I know you know that.

Well, actually I've always kept perfectly servicable cars that are decades old.  Well cared for cars can easily last 25-30 years.  Strange but true.  Of course I only ever drove about 10,000 miles per year.