Has anybody actually voted "No" in North Korea?
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  Has anybody actually voted "No" in North Korea?
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Author Topic: Has anybody actually voted "No" in North Korea?  (Read 650 times)
Greedo punched first
ERM64man
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« on: September 28, 2023, 05:20:06 PM »

Has anyone ever taken the risk of voting against incumbent North Korean officials?
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CumbrianLefty
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« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2023, 07:25:44 AM »

Going from memory, I think a handful may have done in its earlier years.

But in the most recent "elections", KJU won his seat with 100% of the vote in a 100% turnout!

Beat that Smiley
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oldtimer
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« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2023, 03:09:24 PM »

Has anyone ever taken the risk of voting against incumbent North Korean officials?
Has anyone even voted in reality ?
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Vosem
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« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2023, 03:16:57 PM »

Has anyone ever taken the risk of voting against incumbent North Korean officials?
Has anyone even voted in reality ?

Yes, in many dictatorships it's dangerous not to vote, particularly if you're pursuing certain particular professions. My grandparents were regular CPSU voters once upon a time. Of course the North Koreans come out and "vote" for the regime.
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oldtimer
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« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2023, 03:24:34 PM »

Has anyone ever taken the risk of voting against incumbent North Korean officials?
Has anyone even voted in reality ?

Yes, in many dictatorships it's dangerous not to vote, particularly if you're pursuing certain particular professions. My grandparents were regular CPSU voters once upon a time. Of course the North Koreans come out and "vote" for the regime.

What's the point of Dictators giving people fake ballots to cast in fake ballot boxes when they can just make up the whole thing anyway ?

Just have the Dictator go on TV and announce an election took place which they won, without  all that useless paperwork.
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kyc0705
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« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2023, 03:34:47 PM »
« Edited: September 29, 2023, 03:40:47 PM by kyc0705 »

Has anyone ever taken the risk of voting against incumbent North Korean officials?
Has anyone even voted in reality ?

Yes, in many dictatorships it's dangerous not to vote, particularly if you're pursuing certain particular professions. My grandparents were regular CPSU voters once upon a time. Of course the North Koreans come out and "vote" for the regime.

What's the point of Dictators giving people fake ballots to cast in fake ballot boxes when they can just make up the whole thing anyway ?

Just have the Dictator go on TV and announce an election took place which they won, without  all that useless paperwork.

To have the populace universally vote is taken to be a sign of strength for the regime and becomes propaganda. It's also used as a kind of census, to track the number of defectors since the last election.
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« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2023, 04:57:13 PM »

Not every dictatorship does this of course, a lot just keep turnout low so the rigged ballots win it, like Maduro or a lot of African countries. An amusing occurrence in 2016 was the former dictator of The Gambia lost reelection because he basically just forgot to bother to rig it. (or rather his cronies in key areas just didn't bother to rig it.)
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exnaderite
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« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2023, 08:16:00 PM »

What's the point of Dictators giving people fake ballots to cast in fake ballot boxes when they can just make up the whole thing anyway ?

Just have the Dictator go on TV and announce an election took place which they won, without  all that useless paperwork.

It's to demonstrate to the nation and the world that the dictator is able to put on such a show, and therefore isn't in danger of being overthrown.

Not every dictatorship does this of course, a lot just keep turnout low so the rigged ballots win it, like Maduro or a lot of African countries. An amusing occurrence in 2016 was the former dictator of The Gambia lost reelection because he basically just forgot to bother to rig it. (or rather his cronies in key areas just didn't bother to rig it.)

In Russia, which wasn't entirely a dictatorship pre-2022, elections continued to be held, but with local officials fabricating results to prove their loyalty to the Kremlin. The problem was that they were sloppy in doing so. In the 2021 election to the State Duma, the correlation between voter turnout in each polling station and the percentage of the vote for United Russia was a straight line. On the distribution curve for the percentage of the vote for United Russian in each polling station, there were very suspicious spikes around exact numbers like 70%, 75%, and 80%. And smaller polling stations were much more obviously rigged than larger ones. That creates the worst of both worlds: it proves that Putin didn't have such an iron fist, nor did he enjoy democratic legitimacy. Eyeballing the distribution curve, we know that in 2021, the United Russia Party only actually won 30-35% of the vote, and turnout was only actually around 30-35%. And that was after other tricks the Kremlin used to coerce support.

https://www.csh.ac.at/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/CSH-Policy-Brief-5-2021-Russian-Elections.pdf
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oldtimer
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« Reply #8 on: September 30, 2023, 09:11:46 AM »

What's the point of Dictators giving people fake ballots to cast in fake ballot boxes when they can just make up the whole thing anyway ?

Just have the Dictator go on TV and announce an election took place which they won, without  all that useless paperwork.

It's to demonstrate to the nation and the world that the dictator is able to put on such a show, and therefore isn't in danger of being overthrown.

Not every dictatorship does this of course, a lot just keep turnout low so the rigged ballots win it, like Maduro or a lot of African countries. An amusing occurrence in 2016 was the former dictator of The Gambia lost reelection because he basically just forgot to bother to rig it. (or rather his cronies in key areas just didn't bother to rig it.)

In Russia, which wasn't entirely a dictatorship pre-2022, elections continued to be held, but with local officials fabricating results to prove their loyalty to the Kremlin. The problem was that they were sloppy in doing so. In the 2021 election to the State Duma, the correlation between voter turnout in each polling station and the percentage of the vote for United Russia was a straight line. On the distribution curve for the percentage of the vote for United Russian in each polling station, there were very suspicious spikes around exact numbers like 70%, 75%, and 80%. And smaller polling stations were much more obviously rigged than larger ones. That creates the worst of both worlds: it proves that Putin didn't have such an iron fist, nor did he enjoy democratic legitimacy. Eyeballing the distribution curve, we know that in 2021, the United Russia Party only actually won 30-35% of the vote, and turnout was only actually around 30-35%. And that was after other tricks the Kremlin used to coerce support.

https://www.csh.ac.at/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/CSH-Policy-Brief-5-2021-Russian-Elections.pdf
They should do some similar research in Greek elections.
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All Along The Watchtower
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« Reply #9 on: September 30, 2023, 01:34:36 PM »

Going from memory, I think a handful may have done in its earlier years.

But in the most recent "elections", KJU won his seat with 100% of the vote in a 100% turnout!

Beat that Smiley

North Korean elections are a testament to the benefits of Consensus Decision-Making.
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Samof94
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« Reply #10 on: October 02, 2023, 06:09:36 AM »

Not every dictatorship does this of course, a lot just keep turnout low so the rigged ballots win it, like Maduro or a lot of African countries. An amusing occurrence in 2016 was the former dictator of The Gambia lost reelection because he basically just forgot to bother to rig it. (or rather his cronies in key areas just didn't bother to rig it.)
The Saudis being royalty just have no elections anyway.
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