Michigan completely bans for marriage for under 18s.

[Ferguson97]

Very few people nowadays marry younger than 18, and those who do mostly have a good reason (i.e., pregnancy.) 

I reject the premise that this is a good reason for minors to get married.

Why not? Every single study shows that children who are raised by married parents have better outcomes than those raised by unmarried parents.

Then what’s the harm in making them wait 2 years to get married?

Yes it’s true that married parents produce better outcomes for kids than unmarried parents — but that has very little to do with marriage itself, and much more to do with the fact that the parents are living together and working together to raise the child.

It’s correlation not causation.

And frankly I’m far less concerned about situations where both parties are under 18, and far more concerned about situations where one party is under 18. A 30-year-old who manipulates and impregnates a teenage girl and then traps her with marriage.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Also, I would like to point out that 9 of these 10 states (including MI!) have ages of consent lower than 18.  So, these states are ok with teens having casual sex with adults, but not marrying?  Seems very sick to me.

Of course, the offending states just so happen to be the most nanny-ish in the country. 

That slapping a 19-year old with a felony and forced sex offender registration for having a 17-year old boyfriend/girlfriend is not good policy does not also mean that said 17-year old should be able to be married (instead of having to wait a whole year, the horror.)

[Ferguson97]

Also, I would like to point out that 9 of these 10 states (including MI!) have ages of consent lower than 18.  So, these states are ok with teens having casual sex with adults, but not marrying?  Seems very sick to me.

Of course, the offending states just so happen to be the most nanny-ish in the country. 

That slapping a 19-year old with a felony and forced sex offender registration for having a 17-year old boyfriend/girlfriend is not good policy does not also mean that said 17-year old should be able to be married (instead of having to wait a whole year, the horror.)

How often does this even happen? Doesn't basically every state have Romeo and Juliet laws?

[Del Tachi]

Very few people nowadays marry younger than 18, and those who do mostly have a good reason (i.e., pregnancy.) 

I reject the premise that this is a good reason for minors to get married.

Why not? Every single study shows that children who are raised by married parents have better outcomes than those raised by unmarried parents.

Then what’s the harm in making them wait 2 years to get married?

Yes it’s true that married parents produce better outcomes for kids than unmarried parents — but that has very little to do with marriage itself, and much more to do with the fact that the parents are living together and working together to raise the child.

It’s correlation not causation.

It's hard to argue that marriage isn't a causal predicate for these improved outcomes, since couples who are married have stronger incentives to stick it out compared to ones who are only cohabiting. 

[Ferguson97]

Very few people nowadays marry younger than 18, and those who do mostly have a good reason (i.e., pregnancy.) 

I reject the premise that this is a good reason for minors to get married.

Why not? Every single study shows that children who are raised by married parents have better outcomes than those raised by unmarried parents.

Then what’s the harm in making them wait 2 years to get married?

Yes it’s true that married parents produce better outcomes for kids than unmarried parents — but that has very little to do with marriage itself, and much more to do with the fact that the parents are living together and working together to raise the child.

It’s correlation not causation.

It's hard to argue that marriage isn't a causal predicate for these improved outcomes, since couples who are married have stronger incentives to stick it out compared to ones who are only cohabiting. 

But we're talking about a hypothetical teenage couple who are inclined to get married. If they change their minds <2 years later, then this probably wasn't going to be a marriage that was built to last anyway.

(And having incentives to "stick it out" is a bad thing. People should not feel pressured to remain in unhappy marriages.)

[Del Tachi]

Very few people nowadays marry younger than 18, and those who do mostly have a good reason (i.e., pregnancy.) 

I reject the premise that this is a good reason for minors to get married.

Why not? Every single study shows that children who are raised by married parents have better outcomes than those raised by unmarried parents.

Then what’s the harm in making them wait 2 years to get married?

Yes it’s true that married parents produce better outcomes for kids than unmarried parents — but that has very little to do with marriage itself, and much more to do with the fact that the parents are living together and working together to raise the child.

It’s correlation not causation.

It's hard to argue that marriage isn't a causal predicate for these improved outcomes, since couples who are married have stronger incentives to stick it out compared to ones who are only cohabiting. 

But we're talking about a hypothetical teenage couple who are inclined to get married. If they change their minds <2 years later, then this probably wasn't going to be a marriage that was built to last anyway.

(And having incentives to "stick it out" is a bad thing. People should not feel pressured to remain in unhappy marriages.)

All relationships are unhappy at one point or another.  They are more easily given up on if getting out looks easy enough, to which marriage often provides a sufficient counterweight.  Marriage gives people an incentive to work on themselves and their relationships. 

I also don't agree with your hypothetical.  If a teenage couple is inclined to be married, then they should do so with haste.  That's because, once married, they'll be able/encouraged to do all sorts of things (i.e., independently live together, buy a house, more easily share domestic responsibilities, etc.) that will strengthen their relationship and commitment to one another, hence the improved outcomes for their children.   

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

So consider that Republicans are more OK with a 16-year old girl marrying a 35-year old man than they are with two 35-year old men or two 35-year old women marrying each other.

[Fight for Trump]

So consider that Republicans are more OK with a 16-year old girl marrying a 35-year old man than they are with two 35-year old men or two 35-year old women marrying each other.

The former has been accepted for far longer in human civilization than the latter.

[Born to Slay. Forced to Work.]

So consider that Republicans are more OK with a 16-year old girl marrying a 35-year old man than they are with two 35-year old men or two 35-year old women marrying each other.

The former has been accepted for far longer in human civilization than the latter.

So was spousal rape and chattel slavery. What’s your point.

[TheReckoning]

Very few people nowadays marry younger than 18, and those who do mostly have a good reason (i.e., pregnancy.) 

I reject the premise that this is a good reason for minors to get married.

Why not? Every single study shows that children who are raised by married parents have better outcomes than those raised by unmarried parents.

And frankly I’m far less concerned about situations where both parties are under 18, and far more concerned about situations where one party is under 18. A 30-year-old who manipulates and impregnates a teenage girl and then traps her with marriage.

This is a valid concern, and I agree with you fully. A 30 year old who has sex with an underage teenager be going to prison, not getting married.

However, what’s wrong with a “Romeo and Juliet” exception?

[LtNOWIS]

https://www.freep.com/story/news/politics/2023/07/11/child-marriage-banned-michigan/70398070007

Here's something pathetic though...this just makes this the current map on this. Underage marriage is still allowed in the green states:

That is way more green than I would have predicted.

It's because the push to change this didn't occur until the past few years. Didn't really occur to anyone. And a lot of those efforts (such as in Virginia) just tightened up the requirements, without instituting a complete ban.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Of course, the offending states just so happen to be the most nanny-ish in the country. 

All of those states except Pennsylvania have legal marijuana.

[Skill and Chance]

Very few people nowadays marry younger than 18, and those who do mostly have a good reason (i.e., pregnancy.) 

I reject the premise that this is a good reason for minors to get married.

Why not? Every single study shows that children who are raised by married parents have better outcomes than those raised by unmarried parents.

And frankly I’m far less concerned about situations where both parties are under 18, and far more concerned about situations where one party is under 18. A 30-year-old who manipulates and impregnates a teenage girl and then traps her with marriage.

This is a valid concern, and I agree with you fully. A 30 year old who has sex with an underage teenager be going to prison, not getting married.

However, what’s wrong with a “Romeo and Juliet” exception?

Teenagers are not mature enough to marry each other.  If it truly works out, they can marry when they are both 18.