Aussie-Sino tensions

[It’s so Joever]

The relations between Australia and China are continuing to deteriorate at an accelerated pace.
China has announced a second probe into Australia’s wine exports.
https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/articles/2020-08-31/china-hits-australian-wine-with-second-probe-as-tensions-mount

Additionally, an Australian news reporter in China, Cheng Lei, has been detained without a charge.
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/08/31/world/asia/china-australia-journalist.amp.html

It will be interesting to watch this situation over the next few weeks.

[brucejoel99]

Time to buy Australian wine.

[jaymichaud]

Time to buy Australian wine.

They do a good shiraz.

[dead0man]

the PRC has been pushing lots of buttons recently.  Taiwan, Japan, Vietnam even the Philippines, which had been inching towards them.  I fear they might start some sh**t if our election goes in a way that causes mass chaos and they think we're too distracted to do anything about it.

Of course that might just be what this country needs.  Almost all Americans know the Red Chinese are the bad guys.  Bikers, Fundies, SJWs, BLMs, SocDems, libertarians, artsy fartsy types, broccoli, ham fisted typists, god fearing chickens, satan worshipers almost everyone except for CEOs that want to sell sh**t in China, 60% of people who came here from China and maybe 35% of people who claim to Communist.

[vitoNova]

For a world superpower, China is actually quite benign.

Name the last country they outright invaded and occupied.

Bueller?  Bueller?  Anyone?

*crickets chirping*

[It’s so Joever]

the PRC has been pushing lots of buttons recently.  Taiwan, Japan, Vietnam even the Philippines, which had been inching towards them.  I fear they might start some sh**t if our election goes in a way that causes mass chaos and they think we're too distracted to do anything about it.

Of course that might just be what this country needs.  Almost all Americans know the Red Chinese are the bad guys.  Bikers, Fundies, SJWs, BLMs, SocDems, libertarians, artsy fartsy types, broccoli, ham fisted typists, god fearing chickens, satan worshipers almost everyone except for CEOs that want to sell sh**t in China, 60% of people who came here from China and maybe 35% of people who claim to Communist.

Depends on what you mean by s**t. If we do have that chaotic an election, I would anticipate them solidifying their territorial claims they have already (possibly with force but only if we are really screwed up) but otherwise mainly focusing on economically pressuring developing countries into their fold (which tbf is what all World superpowers have done)

[It’s so Joever]

For a world superpower, China is actually quite benign.

Name the last country they outright invaded and occupied.

Bueller?  Bueller?  Anyone?

*crickets chirping*

They aren’t benign, they are smart.
China has found a better way to subdue countries without the traditional risks of war.
It isn’t perfect, but I see the appeal from a geopolitical perspective.
Also, I would argue China is about where the US was in the 1880s-1890s (not entirely ofc)
They are a rising power and are being careful now because this is a new position for them. If China continues to grow rapidly in influence, they may become more aggressive like the US did.

[CumbrianLefty]

For a world superpower, China is actually quite benign.

Name the last country they outright invaded and occupied.

Bueller?  Bueller?  Anyone?

*crickets chirping*

Tibet is maybe the fairly obvious answer?

[dead0man]

For a world superpower, China is actually quite benign.

Name the last country they outright invaded and occupied.

Bueller?  Bueller?  Anyone?

*crickets chirping*

Tibet is maybe the fairly obvious answer?

well yeah, but that's different somehow


Then there was that time the PRC's friend, Pol Pot (ya know, one of the top 4 worst leaders in world history (a position he shares with Mao)), got his ass kicked by Vietnam and the PRC thought they'd teach Vietnam a lesson about defeating mass murderers (the PRC is against it) and then proceeded to get their ass kicked by them too.


(not to mention their handful of attempts at taking Indian land)

(also not to mention, ya know, the current genocide)



The only reason they are "benign" is because they lack the ability to NOT act benign.  Ecuador is benign for the same reason.

[Meclazine for Israel]

This is nothing.

Australia's main exports are Iron Ore and Natural Gas to China and Japan respectfully. Gold, nickel, copper, uranium, aluminium, coal. Cattle, sheep, wheat.

China won't cut back on iron ore imports any time soon, and if they do, we will just keep it in the ground and sell it to them at a later date at a higher price.

Wine exports to China are nothing in the larger scheme of things.

[It’s so Joever]

For a world superpower, China is actually quite benign.

Name the last country they outright invaded and occupied.

Bueller?  Bueller?  Anyone?

*crickets chirping*

Tibet is maybe the fairly obvious answer?

well yeah, but that's different somehow


Then there was that time the PRC's friend, Pol Pot (ya know, one of the top 4 worst leaders in world history (a position he shares with Mao)), got his ass kicked by Vietnam and the PRC thought they'd teach Vietnam a lesson about defeating mass murderers (the PRC is against it) and then proceeded to get their ass kicked by them too.


(not to mention their handful of attempts at taking Indian land)

(also not to mention, ya know, the current genocide)



The only reason they are "benign" is because they lack the ability to NOT act benign.  Ecuador is benign for the same reason.

False.
They could totally act more aggressive. The reason they don’t is because they already have an effective strategy of debt trapping neighbors and using economic leverage to get what they want in a lot of places. They have the military, it’s the lack of an incentive that is keeping them from acting aggressively.
 China today is honestly a completely different country in many aspects compared to China in the 80’s.

[Zinneke]

For a world superpower, China is actually quite benign.

Name the last country they outright invaded and occupied.

Bueller?  Bueller?  Anyone?

*crickets chirping*

Tibet is maybe the fairly obvious answer?

well yeah, but that's different somehow


Then there was that time the PRC's friend, Pol Pot (ya know, one of the top 4 worst leaders in world history (a position he shares with Mao)), got his ass kicked by Vietnam and the PRC thought they'd teach Vietnam a lesson about defeating mass murderers (the PRC is against it) and then proceeded to get their ass kicked by them too.


(not to mention their handful of attempts at taking Indian land)

(also not to mention, ya know, the current genocide)



The only reason they are "benign" is because they lack the ability to NOT act benign.  Ecuador is benign for the same reason.

False.
They could totally act more aggressive. The reason they don’t is because they already have an effective strategy of debt trapping neighbors and using economic leverage to get what they want in a lot of places. They have the military, it’s the lack of an incentive that is keeping them from acting aggressively.
 China today is honestly a completely different country in many aspects compared to China in the 80’s.

The Chinese are overestimating the debt trap effect though, in strategic terms. In reality its a military-industrial complex, similar to the one in the USA, that stands to benefit, not Chinese power on the global stage as a whole.

They are buying up all these ports and investing in the Belt and Road Initiative primarily through a regional lens of bypassing India. The more long term process they are engaging is a similar model to what France and the US have been doing for much longer now : bigging up boogeymen in strategic country with resources, qualm it with massive investment, insist that you protect your investment from the boogeymen by getting your military involved and training up the host nation making a massive repressive state apparatus that didn't exist before, and then the "boogeymen" suddenly are very real but not to worry, you have a general who knows all the Counter-Insurgency mumbo jumbo who comes in to assist and an endless stream of Doctor Feel Good reports to the executive and parliament back home (China won't have this problem of having to sell it to elected officials) and of course export your high skilled labour, administrators, to the host country and watch the yuan fly in. 

In the end its a great deal for the PLA top brass and a few other economic actors but nobody else in China, and certainly not some kind of stepping stone to world domination given they will get significantly more blowback. Imperialism has perfected itself as seen above, but a lot of these politicians in developing countries taking in Chinese money will have no qualms double crossing them and kicking them out when all the roads are built and if China starts trying repossess a port or core infrastructure, just send in the national troops the Chinese/US helped train. They've had years of practice playing off big powers against each other by now.

[dead0man]

They could totally act more aggressive. The reason they don’t is because they already have an effective strategy of debt trapping neighbors and using economic leverage to get what they want in a lot of places. They have the military, it’s the lack of an incentive that is keeping them from acting aggressively.
 China today is honestly a completely different country in many aspects compared to China in the 80’s.

well, we'll have to agree to disagree I guess.

[Fight for Trump]

For a world superpower, China is actually quite benign.

Name the last country they outright invaded and occupied.

Bueller?  Bueller?  Anyone?

*crickets chirping*

Tibet is maybe the fairly obvious answer?

Tibet belongs to China. Crimea belongs to Russia. Trump belongs in prison. All true.

[FEMA Camp Administrator]

For a world superpower, China is actually quite benign.

Name the last country they outright invaded and occupied.

Bueller?  Bueller?  Anyone?

*crickets chirping*

Tibet is maybe the fairly obvious answer?

Tibet belongs to China. Crimea belongs to Russia. Trump belongs in prison. All true.

And send the Indo-Europeans back across the Urals!

[The Dowager Mod]

For a world superpower, China is actually quite benign.

Name the last country they outright invaded and occupied.

Bueller?  Bueller?  Anyone?

*crickets chirping*

Tibet is maybe the fairly obvious answer?

Tibet belongs to China. Crimea belongs to Russia. Trump belongs in prison. All true.

And send the Indo-Europeans back across the Urals!

And give Kent back to the Jutes!

[Battista Minola 1616]

For a world superpower, China is actually quite benign.

Name the last country they outright invaded and occupied.

Bueller?  Bueller?  Anyone?

*crickets chirping*

Tibet is maybe the fairly obvious answer?

Tibet belongs to China. Crimea belongs to Russia. Trump belongs in prison. All true.

Crimea belongs to the Tatars.

[CumbrianLefty]

For a world superpower, China is actually quite benign.

Name the last country they outright invaded and occupied.

Bueller?  Bueller?  Anyone?

*crickets chirping*

Tibet is maybe the fairly obvious answer?

Tibet belongs to China. Crimea belongs to Russia. Trump belongs in prison. All true.

Crimea belongs to the Tatars.

Pontic Greeks, shurely?

[Battista Minola 1616]

For a world superpower, China is actually quite benign.

Name the last country they outright invaded and occupied.

Bueller?  Bueller?  Anyone?

*crickets chirping*

Tibet is maybe the fairly obvious answer?

Tibet belongs to China. Crimea belongs to Russia. Trump belongs in prison. All true.

Crimea belongs to the Tatars.

Pontic Greeks, shurely?

Mother Nature, in the end.

[TDAS04]

Pandas vs. Koalas! 

[Meclazine for Israel]

Norway had the same problem 5 years ago.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-09-04/norway-once-felt-chinas-wrath-what-can-australia-learn-from-them/12621056

[It’s so Joever]

Pandas vs. Koalas!  

Koalas easily win. They can spread chlamydia and pandas are dying out faster anyways.

[dead0man]

Pandas vs. Koalas! 

the two most overrated of all mammals.  Pandas clearly do not want to survive as a species, we should let them go.