Rashida Tlaib goes after Biden again: "We aren't going to forget in November are we?"

[All Along The Watchtower]

No the “Christian opinion” shouldn’t matter too a

Well there goes US support for Israel then.

[AtorBoltox]

Just saying its weird to see Bangladeshis and Indonesians reject Rohingyas and not care about that but then care so much about Israel/Gaza at a unanimous level.

https://www.thejakartapost.com/opinion/2024/05/25/embracing-humanity-a-call-to-rethink-refugee-policies-in-indonesia.html

First line literally speaks about Aceh which is the most religious province in Indonesia and has Shariah law and shows how they now dislike Rohingyas. Almost certainly still avid supporters of the Palestinian cause.

Because it’s not about ‘solidarity’ with fellow Muslims, it’s about the continued rage at the loss of Jerusalem to the Yahood

[Red Velvet]

It's really unfortunate we can't have a better group of Muslim lawmakers.

Good group of Muslim lawmakers according to liberals = Muslims who agree and are complicit with the genocide of other Muslims like them.

Why would actual Muslims even vote for these imaginary “better Muslims” when the policy you implicitly support is erasing Muslims entirely? It’s not enough to DO ethnic cleansing but you also need the people being killed to congratulate you for doing that in the meantime?

[Brittain33]

It's really unfortunate we can't have a better group of Muslim lawmakers.

Good group of Muslim lawmakers according to liberals = Muslims who agree and are complicit with the genocide of other Muslims like them.

The war with Hamas isn’t a genocide, it’s an ugly urban war that Hamas could end by returning the hostages. If you search the forum, you’ll find this explained in several individual posts. This war is not actually a good thing for either the people of Gaza or the Palestinian cause.

[VBM]

https://twitter.com/DaveAtherton20/status/1795501879230611825

Honestly a perfect metaphor for the situation

[Red Velvet]

It's really unfortunate we can't have a better group of Muslim lawmakers.

Good group of Muslim lawmakers according to liberals = Muslims who agree and are complicit with the genocide of other Muslims like them.

The war with Hamas isn’t a genocide, it’s an ugly urban war that Hamas could end by returning the hostages. If you search the forum, you’ll find this explained in several individual posts. This war is not actually a good thing for either the people of Gaza or the Palestinian cause.

That’s the difference between us, you’re searching only on this forum. If you search literally everywhere else outside the USA or Israel bubbles, leaders will be saying different variations of this:

https://twitter.com/sahouraxo/status/1762878507460239389

People dying in masses aren’t from Hamas if you look outside, but average Palestinians. There’s no correlation between the Hamas terrorist attack and the alleged “counter-reaction” that punishes literally everyone BUT the target of said reaction.

If anything, this war made by Israeli far-right only strengthens Hamas long-term because that’s what radicals always do with each other when fighting.

[Oregon Eagle Politics]

It's really unfortunate we can't have a better group of Muslim lawmakers.

Good group of Muslim lawmakers according to liberals = Muslims who agree and are complicit with the genocide of other Muslims like them.

The war with Hamas isn’t a genocide, it’s an ugly urban war that Hamas could end by returning the hostages. If you search the forum, you’ll find this explained in several individual posts. This war is not actually a good thing for either the people of Gaza or the Palestinian cause.

Returning hostages won’t end the war. Bibi will prolong the war as long as possible to hold on to power.

[Brittain33]

Red Velvet, you’re correct that many leftists and leftist world leaders are using the term “genocide” incorrectly and publicly as a show of support for Gazans, Hamas, or both. I can find other leaders who say otherwise. Neither one changes the fact that it’s a tragic and regrettable urban war that is causing civilian casualties and which should be ended quickly.

[OSR stands with Israel]

It's really unfortunate we can't have a better group of Muslim lawmakers.

Good group of Muslim lawmakers according to liberals = Muslims who agree and are complicit with the genocide of other Muslims like them.

Why would actual Muslims even vote for these imaginary “better Muslims” when the policy you implicitly support is erasing Muslims entirely? It’s not enough to DO ethnic cleansing but you also need the people being killed to congratulate you for doing that in the meantime?

Cause Muslim is not the same as Being an Islamist or an Islamist sympathizer . Omar and Tlaib are the latter so it makes perfect sense why Sir Mohammed is opposed to them and expecting that he supports them because he is Muslim is extremely patronizing .

Also your 2nd paragraph as usual is completely false .

[wnwnwn]

It's really unfortunate we can't have a better group of Muslim lawmakers.

Good group of Muslim lawmakers according to liberals = Muslims who agree and are complicit with the genocide of other Muslims like them.

The war with Hamas isn’t a genocide, it’s an ugly urban war that Hamas could end by returning the hostages. If you search the forum, you’ll find this explained in several individual posts. This war is not actually a good thing for either the people of Gaza or the Palestinian cause.

That’s the difference between us, you’re searching only on this forum. If you search literally everywhere else outside the USA or Israel bubbles, leaders will be saying different variations of this:

https://twitter.com/sahouraxo/status/1762878507460239389
People dying in masses aren’t from Hamas if you look outside, but average Palestinians. There’s no correlation between the Hamas terrorist attack and the alleged “counter-reaction” that punishes literally everyone BUT the target of said reaction.

If anything, this war made by Israeli far-right only strengthens Hamas long-term because that’s what radicals always do with each other when fighting.

That´s Lula. He isn´t the average person, he has an ideology and has to appease his base.
In Peru, there is people in both sides. One side has the anticolonialists (a majority of them) and the antisemitics (yes, antisemitism do is a thing here in LATAM). The other side has the antiterrorists, the evangelicals and the pro-West (my minority).


Also, remmeber who show information about the war in Gaza:
- Israel goverment and agencies
- Hamas and allies

There is no neutral info, the "welll informed" usually only simps one side.
I think both sides have historic bases for their claims, but the palestinians need better hsitory books instead of the current "since 1918/1948" books. The jewish books go back to biblical times.

[Red Velvet]

It's really unfortunate we can't have a better group of Muslim lawmakers.

Good group of Muslim lawmakers according to liberals = Muslims who agree and are complicit with the genocide of other Muslims like them.

The war with Hamas isn’t a genocide, it’s an ugly urban war that Hamas could end by returning the hostages. If you search the forum, you’ll find this explained in several individual posts. This war is not actually a good thing for either the people of Gaza or the Palestinian cause.

That’s the difference between us, you’re searching only on this forum. If you search literally everywhere else outside the USA or Israel bubbles, leaders will be saying different variations of this:

https://twitter.com/sahouraxo/status/1762878507460239389
People dying in masses aren’t from Hamas if you look outside, but average Palestinians. There’s no correlation between the Hamas terrorist attack and the alleged “counter-reaction” that punishes literally everyone BUT the target of said reaction.

If anything, this war made by Israeli far-right only strengthens Hamas long-term because that’s what radicals always do with each other when fighting.

That´s Lula. He isn´t the average person, he has an ideology and has to appease his base.
In Peru, there is people in both sides. One side has the anticolonialists (a majority of them) and the antisemitics (yes, antisemitism do is a thing here in LATAM). The other side has the antiterrorists, the evangelicals and the pro-West (my minority).


Also, remmeber who show information about the war in Gaza:
- Israel goverment and agencies
- Hamas and allies

There is no neutral info, the "welll informed" usually only simps one side.
I think both sides have historic bases for their claims, but the palestinians need better hsitory books instead of the current "since 1918/1948" books. The jewish books go back to biblical times.

If that’s the case, then Joe Biden and the liberal bubble of Atlas forum saying “it’s not a genocide” is ALSO an ideological position as well and far from being “the truth”.

It’s funny how “ideological positions” are only the ones that people disagree with. But whenever it’s something they agree with then they argument about it as if it was a “fact”.

[LAKISYLVANIA]

Red Velvet, you’re correct that many leftists and leftist world leaders are using the term “genocide” incorrectly and publicly as a show of support for Gazans, Hamas, or both. I can find other leaders who say otherwise. Neither one changes the fact that it’s a tragic and regrettable urban war that is causing civilian casualties and which should be ended quickly.

Incorrect is at the very least a subjective definition and many people disagree. This isn't black or white, or right vs wrong at the very least, even if you like to frame it as such.

Based on two posts i made earlier, the following information i'll provide again ->

Your side is definitely in the majority on the forum, just the position of nations alone show that the world by far supports South Africas case.



compared to



including most human rights majority organizations that rightfully classify this is a genocide.

&

While currently highly debated, consensus among academic scholars seems to be more in agreement with that it is genocide, or at the very least ethnic cleansing / cultural genocide. I take more value in academic opinion than in some random forum edgelords who clearly have a motivation why to argue it is not a genocide.

I'll link the following wiki pages.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_genocide_accusation

Israel and the United States have rejected the assertion that Israel is engaging in genocide. While some scholars describe Palestinians as victims of genocide, others argue that they are not victims of genocide, but rather of ethnic cleansing, politicide, spaciocide, cultural genocide or similar

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegations_of_genocide_in_the_2023_Israeli_attack_on_Gaza#Academic_discourse

In the context of the 2023 Hamas attack on Israel, the Israeli counterattacks, and the imposed complete blockade, which included the denial of water and food to the civilian population, Israeli historian Raz Segal described it as a "textbook case of genocide" and connected it to the Nakba, the expulsion of Palestinians during the establishment of Israel in 1948. With other academics also detailing Israel's attacks on infrastructure, food, and water as being genocidal in nature, while others have described these actions as genocidal when Israel previously engaged in them prior to 2023.

Historian Omer Bartov wrote in November 2023 that he believes that "there is no proof that genocide is currently taking place in Gaza", noting the distinctions between ethnic cleansing and genocide. However he called for "stop[ping] Israel from letting its actions become a genocide" and said that "[...] we may be watching an ethnic cleansing operation that could quickly devolve into genocide". In February 2024, Bartov told Anadolu: "There seems to be intentional destruction of housing. There is destruction of places of worship, especially of mosques. There's destruction of universities and schools, which seems to be intentional. They can certainly come under war crimes, it can come under crimes against humanity, and it can come under genocide".

In April 2024, Amos Goldberg, professor of Holocaust History at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem, stated in an essay that: "Yes, it is genocide". He said: “It is so difficult and painful to admit it, but despite all that, and despite all our efforts to think otherwise, after six months of brutal war we can no longer avoid this conclusion.”

[wnwnwn]

Israel shouldn´t about what Third World regimes or people like Petro says.
Yes, Lula isn´t that bad overall, but he isn´t perfect. The same about Boric.

Why Ireland and Slovania supported the case? Can someone give some info.

[President Johnson]

Invoking Lula here seems ridiculous. He also claimed the war in Ukraine was equally on Putin and Zelenskyy. He lost a great deal of credibility for me with that already. The guy is huge disappointment, and it's really unfortunate the only alternative to him was a literal fascist.

[GAinDC]

Invoking Lula here seems ridiculous. He also claimed the war in Ukraine was equally on Putin and Zelenskyy. He lost a great deal of credibility for me with that already. The guy is huge disappointment, and it's really unfortunate the only alternative to him was a literal fascist.

wow he tried to blame Zelenskyy for Putin's attack on his own country? I can't even imagine what kind of mental gymnastics go into that kind of take

[Brittain33]

We agree, there are lots of people alleging incorrectly that the war in Gaza, which Hamas started on October 7 with the invasion and massacre of 1,200 civilians and taking 200+ hostages including babies, is something it isn’t. We also know that Israel will never win a popularity contest at the UN. None of this changes the fact that it’s an urban war where Israel is not committing anything recognizable as genocide except in the eyes of people who accused Israel of genocide before October 7 happened and who excuse Hamas’s atrocities as “resistance.”