Who was more responsible for the end of the Cold War and the Soviet collapse?

[Bo]

The soviet union was bound to collapse in 1941 hitler referred to it as a rotting structure and he was right.

Yes socialism was the cause of the collapse because it does not produce enough wealth to keep up with needs and demands. Let that be a lesson to us now.

So what does Reagan have to do with that?

Just the simple fact of cutting taxes to grow the economy. The Soviets collapsed sooner than they would have because they didn't have what it took to compete with us economically.

The economy grew under Reagan roughly under the same pace that it grew before him. Thus, he didn't have anything to do with the rate of economic growth. And no, the U.S.S.R. collapsed sooner than they would have because Gorbachev liberalized the political system of the U.S.S.R. in addition to the economy. Liberalizing the political system allowed people to freely express themselves, which eventually led to massive demonstrations in Eastern Europe, and which led to the collapse of the U.S.S.R.

[cpeeks]

The soviet union was bound to collapse in 1941 hitler referred to it as a rotting structure and he was right.

Yes socialism was the cause of the collapse because it does not produce enough wealth to keep up with needs and demands. Let that be a lesson to us now.

So what does Reagan have to do with that?

Just the simple fact of cutting taxes to grow the economy. The Soviets collapsed sooner than they would have because they didn't have what it took to compete with us economically.

The economy grew under Reagan roughly under the same pace that it grew before him. Thus, he didn't have anything to do with the rate of economic growth. And no, the U.S.S.R. collapsed sooner than they would have because Gorbachev liberalized the political system of the U.S.S.R. in addition to the economy. Liberalizing the political system allowed people to freely express themselves, which eventually led to massive demonstrations in Eastern Europe, and which led to the collapse of the U.S.S.R.

Correct

[Ameriplan]

The collapse of the USSR was the existence of the USSR. No socialistic state ever survives, because there is no work ethic, and thus no production. What with the starvation and the work camps I'm surprised it lasted that long.

[hcallega]

The collapse of the USSR was the existence of the USSR. No socialistic state ever survives, because there is no work ethic, and thus no production. What with the starvation and the work camps I'm surprised it lasted that long.

Absolutely. No true socialist state can survive without compromising it's values. However I give Gorby chops for ending it the way it did. It could have been far worse....far worse indeed!

[Bo]

King Fahd

Not an option, but I see where you're coming from--He greatly helped cause the oil glut of the 1980s.

[Bo]

I want someone out of the 7 posters who voted Reagan to tell me specifically why they voted for him. And please don't mention anything about Reagan telling Gorbachev to tear down the Berlin Wall.

[Roemerista]

http://www.slate.com/id/2102081/#sb2102135

Heres a not horrible article for the Reagan case.

[Bo]

http://www.slate.com/id/2102081/#sb2102135

Heres a not horrible article for the Reagan case.

I seriously doubt Reagan's actions pressured Gorbachev to do much. The U.S.S.R. outspent itself primarily by fighting in Afghanistan. The program for the U.S. to fund the Mujihadeen began under Carter, so Reagan just continued it. As for Reagan spending a lot on missile defense, that probably made the U.S.S.R. a little more cautious and willing to spend a little more, but the war in Afghanistan was the main thing that bankrupted the U.S.S.R. The article itself even says that without Gorbachev, the U.S.S.R. would have probably survived much longer. The Revolutions in Eastern Europe in 1989 which helped bring about the demise of the U.S.S.R. started under Bush Sr., not Reagan. Why didn't Eastern Europeans rebel under Reagan if he was so tough and Bush Sr. was so cautious? Because they didn't care who the U.S. President was. They just wanted to exercise their new political freedoms granted to them by Gorbachev and to protest their regimes. And frankly, I think that Gorbachev would have implemented his reforms regardless of who was President. Gorbachev knew that the U.S.S.R. was collapsing and needed something to be changed if it was to survive. I don't really see Reagan being a large factor in encouraging Gorbachev to do anything.

[SPC]

Neither. It was going to happen eventually.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

Thanks for skipping the Solidarity and all other movements in the Soviet Bloc.

[feeblepizza]

The USSR was bound to collapse for even existing. Socialism doesn't work anywhere. China is only surviving because they have a liberalized economy for the most part

[Bo]

Thanks for skipping the Solidarity and all other movements in the Soviet Bloc.

Sorry Kalwejt.

[Bo]

The USSR was bound to collapse for even existing. Socialism doesn't work anywhere. China is only surviving because they have a liberalized economy for the most part

To be fair, the U.S.S.R. could have just liberalized their economy (without increasing political freedoms) just like China did.

[Beet]

The most obvious choice for the Soviet Union would have been to continue onward and gradually liberalize its economy like China. Second most obvious choice would have been to continue onward without liberalizing its economy, and end up like Cuba. Giving up power was the least obvious choice (except in the context of the democratization wave of 1973-98), but it was the most miraculous one for Eastern Europeans and citizens of the breakaway states such as Ukraine and Kazakhstan.

[MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!]

The Soviet Bloc collapsed due to internal reasons. First of all, system was ineffective and Gorbachev simply comes too late to save it China way. Yet, his great acheivement was softening the process and saving what he could save.

Second of all, the satelite countries gained an independence thanks to process started by Solidarity in 1980.

Soviet Bloc collapsed due to Gorbachev realistic mangement and internal opposition, which started in Gdańsk in August 1980.

Sorry, Reagan fans, but your hero was only a statist in this historical process.