Transgenderism and Transhumanism

[Blue3]

Transgenderism and Transhumanism... how related are these concepts in your mind?

Both are based on the idea of a civil right to "morphological freedom" and "self-ownership of body/mind). A right to one's body/mind, and the right to modify it according to one's desires. Your body, your choice, is what both are based on.



Transgenderism is about gender specifically, particularly for those who experience gender dysphoria (though not necessarily).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender


Transhumanism is more broad, and more about speculative technologies. It tends to go beyond mere designer babies or life extension or mere cloning, which still keep things human, and go beyond that, go beyond the human. The military has active research programs into transhumanism as well, such as trying to find a way to alter humans to work effectively without sleep, or that enhance body and mind, as well as robotic exoskeletons and artificial eyes. There are already some who have undergone extreme body modifications, but transhumanism is also usually thought of in regards to:

1. new safe drugs with great physical or psychological benefits
2. bioprinting to manufacture better and tougher than naturally-possible biological tissues/organs to replace existing ones and still be organic
3. advanced genetic engineering to make "better" (no genetic diseases, more positive traits, improved bodies, improved senses, improved minds... but still considered human)
4. advanced genetic engineering to allow more options beyond what's usually considered human (possibly looking like an animal or mythological creature or fictional extraterrestrial alien, or something of your own imagination)
5. adding cybernetic enhancements (but keeping a completely-human body)
6. replacing biological parts with robotic parts (to be stronger, smarter, etc.), the traditional "cyborg"
7. humans merging with advanced AI and nanotechnology
8. possibly mind-uploading into a computer, having solid-holographic avatars for the real world and godlike presence in cyberspace Virtual Reality universes and social networks, if proven possible one day
9. possibly transcending into energy beings, if proven possible one day
10. possibly joining together into a linked super-organism hive-mind, biologically and/or technologically, if proven possible one day
11. going beyond designer babies (which is just choosing the best traits from the list that's already human), there's the idea of "Procreative Liberty" that's usually paired with "Morphological Freedom," which is the right to create any offspring however you want to create them
12. beyond humans, uplifting nonhuman animals like Cats, Dogs, Dolphins, Elephants, Mice, etc. to Human-Level Intelligence and Capabilities

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transhumanism#Debate






Here's some real extreme body modification... it doesn't count as transhumanism (probably) because it doesn't strengthen body or mind and they're just aesthetic changes, but shows the demand is already there.

[Blue3]

This thread is terrifying and needs to stop.

How and why? Transhumanism is the big social issue of the future. I'm trying to see if there's a correlation with transgenderism support.

For the record those degenerates whose pictures you posted are not at all what the Transhumanist movement is about.

As I said in my OP:
"Here's some real extreme body modification... it doesn't count as transhumanism (probably) because it doesn't strengthen body or mind and they're just aesthetic changes, but shows the demand is already there."

support transḧumanism in principle but v wary of the strong possibility it'd reïnforce the rich/poor divide, among other things

It's not only the Rich/Poor divide. There's also arguments to be made about...

-"Human" rights... if we'd still have equal rights, if they should inherently have "more" rights, etc. And ones that go wrong could be given "subhuman" status. Corporations/Governments could even intentionally create a right-less "subhuman" class to work as slaves.

-Fairness... what happens if Transhumans become so intelligent they think and communicate faster than it takes for one of us to form a short sentence or send a text... normal humans being "left behind" and feeling and being treated like we are all mentallyretarded. Not only be left behind... a Transhumanist dictator could come along too.

-Loss of something essential, "lost in translation," that we might not even understand at first. Perhaps we really do all have something similar to an immortal soul, but something transhumanist is done that causes it to be lost forever? Or without getting into souls... perhaps a change done unknowingly and unintentionally makes us lose an essential part of our personalities/memories and how we think/feel?

They are not related or comparable to each other at all.  Transgenderism refers to gender identity or an umbrella of gender identities, and trans and non-binary people have existed all throughout human history.  Transhumanism is a new movement that seeks to expand human capabilities to their highest potential through use of new and continuously improved technology, to the extent that technology becomes the driving force behind human evolution rather than natural selection.

Transhumanism, as you describe, is not a new movement. Eugenics, folk medicine, etc. - the Devil's toys.

Yeah, it's always been around.
Eugenics, selective breeding, Alchemy and the pursuit of eternal life, Gilgamesh, Superheroes like Superman and Spider-Man and Captain America, etc.
The desire has always been there.

And as I said, both transgenderism and transhumanism are both based on the idea of a Right To Morphological Freedom. It's your body, change it as you wish. Modern-day "transitions" fore transgender people were once the hypothesis of transhumanists.

[Blue3]

They are not related or comparable to each other at all.  Transgenderism refers to gender identity or an umbrella of gender identities, and trans and non-binary people have existed all throughout human history.  Transhumanism is a new movement that seeks to expand human capabilities to their highest potential through use of new and continuously improved technology, to the extent that technology becomes the driving force behind human evolution rather than natural selection.

Transhumanism, as you describe, is not a new movement. Eugenics, folk medicine, etc. - the Devil's toys.

Yeah, it's always been around.
Eugenics, selective breeding, Alchemy and the pursuit of eternal life, Gilgamesh, Superheroes like Superman and Spider-Man and Captain America, etc.
The desire has always been there.

And as I said, both transgenderism and transhumanism are both based on the idea of a Right To Morphological Freedom. It's your body, change it as you wish. Modern-day "transitions" fore transgender people were once the hypothesis of transhumanists.

That is an argument they use, but transhumanists don't view themselves as "super humans" restricted by their biology in the way that transgender people do not "feel" the gender they were assigned at birth.

There's not much more to say than that, really.

1. Some do feel they were meant to be more.


2. A century ago, the gender reassignment/surgery/hormone-treatments were the speculative hypotheses of Transhumanists.

[Blue3]

https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/technology/godlike-homo-deus-could-replace-humans-tech-evolves-n757971

[Blue3]

https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/technology/godlike-homo-deus-could-replace-humans-tech-evolves-n757971

And why should we celebrate this? Those that embrace tomorrow with open arms may somehow survive this trainwreck semi-intact, but many billions will be ground under its tank treads.

Did I say we should celebrate it? I'm against transhumanism.

[Blue3]

But why not try to turn it into a force for good? The main problem with it is inequality of access, which is a part of our current system, not the technology.

This.

In the transhuman debate, inequality of access is NOT the biggest issue.

The biggest issue is the inherent morality of transhumanism. As I summarized on the previous page:



1. "Human" rights... if we'd still have equal rights, if they should inherently have "more" rights, etc. And ones that go wrong could be given "subhuman" status. Corporations/Governments could even intentionally create a right-less "subhuman" class to work as slaves.

2. Fairness... what happens if Transhumans become so intelligent they think and communicate faster than it takes for one of us to form a short sentence or send a text... normal humans being "left behind" and feeling and being treated like we are all mentally retarded. Not only be left behind... a Transhumanist dictator could come along too.

3. Loss of something essential, "lost in translation," that we might not even understand at first. Perhaps we really do all have something similar to an immortal soul, but something transhumanist is done that causes it to be lost forever? Or without getting into souls... perhaps a change done unknowingly and unintentionally makes us lose an essential part of our personalities/memories and how we think/feel?



,
I welcome technology to make us live longer and healthier, eliminating genetic diseases and other diseases and old age, healing scars and regrowing lost body parts, nanotech assisting white blood cells. Even with parents picking some of their children's traits, and cybernetic gadgets that can be put on and off and aren't part of the body like an iWatch or those eyeglasses. I don't consider those things "transhumanism."

The problem is those trying to become something other than human. Whether through genetics or cybernetics or drugs. THAT is "transhumanism."