Ford for Kerry?

[12th Doctor]

I'm thinking of voting for John Kerry to punish George W. Bush.  I'll post why when I get home.  I'm also going to try on a red avatar.

Oh, dear God, please no.  What is with you people.  Are you ALL really that stupid that you think that "Punishing Bush" is worth 4 years of Kerry.

[12th Doctor]

I'm thinking of voting for John Kerry to punish George W. Bush.  I'll post why when I get home.  I'm also going to try on a red avatar.

Oh, dear God, please no.  What is with you people.  Are you ALL really that stupid that you think that "Punishing Bush" is worth 4 years of Kerry.

Soulty,

If John Ford is thinking of voting for Kerry, then my e-mail to you earlier this week was correct. It is time for you and I to leave this MADHOUSE. I've talked to John Ford on the phone, and if an extremely intelligent, conservative guy like him would vote for John "Vietnam Hippies Against the War" Kerry...then I give up...I truly cannot deal with this revelation...it's too depressing that a guy like Ford would vote for a "thing" like Kerry.

Mark,

It's not the forum per se it's the country.  With everyday that passes by the dreaded thought of Bush losing becomes more and more a reality.  I think about it at least 10 times a day, I dream about it... I am just plauged with the thought.  No matter how much I want to believe, I just see hope fading before my eyes.

[12th Doctor]

John,

Much of what has happened under the Bush administration does leave a lot to be desired.  This Administration is, quite frankly, not what I had hoped for when I supported Bush 4 years ago (and I did invision some kind of war at the time, I felt it to be inevitable with the Middle-East, China, Russia, Africa, etc.).  No one has winced more than I, these past four years, at every failure, every missed oppertunity and every fumble of the Bush team.

Bush, it would seem, has no real coherrant policy on many issues.  I agree with you there.  What is worse is that the message has been lost.  Bush's handlers have failed miserable in getting their version of the story out.  I have very little confidence in half the cabinet.  Rumsfeld has lost a lot of stock in my mind.  Ashcroft is terrible.  I wish Cheney would just dissappear and in the mean time, these three have totally over-shaddowed Powell, the one man that I really trust out of this team.  It was time to bring in fresh blood long ago.  Things really have stagnated in Washington, and that pisses me off more than anything.

But, John, there have been remarkable moments as well.  I think that 9/11 would have destroyed anyother administration, but this one, for whatever reason seemed to thrive under the pressure.

We got something done on education.  Maybe not everything we wanted, but we accomplished more than we thought we might.  Bush has, in the face of a very unfriendly Senate, acheived a number of the goals that he set out for us.  

He got the Perscription Drug Bill through, again, not exactly what we had hoped for, but it is something, a basis for which we can make later changes.  Better we did it than them.  

We now have a Dept. of Homeland Security, which Bush was able to ram through dispite Democrat bickering about Unionizing it.  They wanted to leave the security of out nation in the hands of collective bargining.  

Bush has freed 50 million people.  Regardless the forrest we have found ourselves in now, the fact is that the terrorists are over there, not here or in Israel.  Bush has pledged to stick it out.  Kerry has pledged to bring the troops home in a year regardless of the results.

I agree, that there has been very little follow-through on Bush's policy, but these are difficult times.  This is probably the first time ever that we have been in a war where one of the major parties primary goals has been to block all progress, essentially assuring our defeat, not too mention all the self-important John McCain types who have sabotaged us from within.

Bush has had it tough, and though that doesn't fully excuse the past, it puts it into perspective.

In the end, however, elections really aren't about the past, they are about the future.  Bush has given a clear vision for a second term and God willing, that vision will be realized.  Would it not be better for us to achieve a second term now, when we are established and can get something acchomplished than to have to start all over again in 4 years with another untested group while the Dems continue to scream about us?

I feel your pain.  It seems to me that this Administration has seen one lost oppertunity after another, but put it in context, man.  Think about what is possible for the next 4 years.  Now think about what Bush has done right and think about how that will play out.  Now imagine all of that ceasing to be.  What will all of this time have been worth.  Wouldn't kicking Bush out now lead to more lost oppertunity, more confusion?

I have to believe that things will get better in a second Bush term, because I know they will become infinatly worse if Kerry is elected.

Anyway, think about it, John.  I hope you change your mind.

P.S. And what might be even worse is that Kerry will end up taking credit for all the progress that has been made these past 4 years... and you know it would happen too.

[12th Doctor]

Soulty,

I hope I change my mind too.  But it won't be something Bush says or something any poster says.  I'm tired of the words.  I want action.

Do something about Sadr.
Do something about Fallujah.
Do something about Sudan.
Do anything!

I am an undecided voter.  I am leaving open the possibility that I vote for John Kerry.  I want the Bush family out of Republican politics, and if W wins than we might nominate Jeb in '08, and that is as frightening as another four years of having Bush's failures reflected on the party.

John, how can Bush do anything when he has his hands tied behind his back?  Reelect him, and a 54-46 Republican Senate and maybe we can get things done.


Your mistaking the blocking methods of the Democrats in Congress for Bush's lack of vision or leadership and that just isn't the case.

[12th Doctor]

Soulty,

I'm tired of these excuses.  Take Social Security for example.  He hasn't tried.  You can't say its impossible if you're not willing to try.  Maybe social security reform would be blocked.  So waht?  Let the democrats block it, and let them answer to a generation of young voters who see this as their #1 economic concern.

John,

Believe me, I know what you mean.  I Bush would just charge in kick down the door to the Senate chamber and say, "we aren't leaving until we get something acchomplished... but it ain't gonna happen.  Things seem easy to us.  We can say, "I would do this" or "Why isn't he doing that"... but those are just words, and what do we know about it?  We aren't there.  We can say whatever we want, but if it were you or I in there, well, then it would be a different story.

These aren't excuses, just facts.  Bush has a difficult job at the moment, much harder than Clinton or even his father had.  And if he did launch on his massive domestic agenda, what would the Democrats say?  They would probablt charge that he is abusing his political capital from the War to push his agenda at home, or that he was pushing an agenda at home to take attention off a "desasterous war", which ever one the focus groups decided was more believable.  Give Bush a second term and he really won't have to worry so much about what they say, because he won't be running again.  Then we can get things done.  Don't jump ship now.  We need every person we can get.  Remember, it's not just you, what you say effects others and then they effect others they know and so on and so forth.  If you, John Ford, a man, I'm certain, a numbe of people respect, decide to turn on Bush, then others you know who might have voted for him take that into consideration.  Please, reconsider.

[12th Doctor]

Muon and Supersoulty have brought me back in line.  They were very persuasive, and plus I watched a Kerry speech today, and I realized something important.

John Kerry is a vagina.

He is a big, blubbering, walking, talking, piece of female genitalia.  No Republican is incompetent enough to make me vote for that prick.  Lieberman, maybe.  But not Kerry.

Kerry wants you to vote for him because he's not Bush.

Well, I'm voting Bush because he's not John Kerry.

John,

I'm glad to see you have come around.  To be honest, you turning would have been the final straw for me.  You and Mark are basically the only reasons I stick around here.  No offense to anyone else, I like a lot of you guys and if I did leave, I would continue to talk to many of you, but this forum has been over run by left-wing extremeists.  The average IQ of this place has dropped about 50 points since when I first started posting here.  There is hardly any intellegent debate that goes on anymore, just a bunch of Bush-bashing.

The exit of Mark from the forum is much to me like loss=ing Gandalf in Moria was to the Fellowship.  I'm not copying Mark either.  I have contemplated leaving for a couple of months now, but I would have to label it a likelyhood, now.

When I joined, this place was like Camelot.  Just like Camelot, though, the fallability of many of the people on here has led to a rapid downfall.

As long as Ford is here, though, I have a reason to stick around.  He and I can still fight hard for intellectual Conservatism, and I intend to do so for the time being.