AOC says migrants forced to drink toilet water after tense border visit

[Fuzzy Bear]

https://www.democracynow.org/2019/6/26/house_progressives_vote_against_dhs_funding

So why did AOC and other "progressives" vote against an ICE funding bill that included money to upgrade these detention centers?

The answer is simple:  The Left WANTS these facilities to become so horrible that they will be shut down after a huge outcry, and the centers will be closed, all of the inhabitants allowed to stay in the US, and all part of a movement to implement Open Borders in stages.

The reason the conditions in these facilities are what they are is because of the massive (and unforseen) increase in illegal immigration; an increase that has been encouraged by leftist groups in America and outside of America.  And the Democratic Party encourages this by essentially advocating an immigration enforcement policy that tells people in other countries that if they can swim the Rio Grande River, they're Home Free.  Today's Democratic Party has no intention of enforcing our immigration laws; they wish to see enforcement fail in order to implement Open Borders, and they wish to do so regardless of whether or not it is good for American citizens.

[Fuzzy Bear]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

The ones there who are asylum seekers are people whose claims for asylum that have been found not legitimate, yet they refused to leave the United States.

[Fuzzy Bear]

In any case, those are horrible conditions. The only question is how widespread they are. And the only possible answer is not abolishing ICE or whatever, but increasing funding so migrants can actually be processed in humane conditions.

That's not really a solution when Trump and his supporters WANT the conditions to be as bad as possible as some kind of "deterrent."

(And unlike our dear friend, I'm not just making up a motivation for the other side and declaring it to be fact. Trump has actually said this.)

Then why did the Democrats vote against ICE Funding that would have alleviated this?

The reason, obviously, is because they want to (A) abolish ICE (long term) and (B) keep their "concentration camp" narrative going (short term) to gain support for the abolition of ICE, an idea that does not have majority public support at present.

The Democrats also hope that conditions become so bad in these camps that a Federal Judge will order the release of large numbers of detainees on some sort of bond or release on their own recognizance prior to some sort of future Court action for their situations.  They won't say this, of course, but why else would they vote against funding designated to alleviate the conditions in ICE Detention Centers.

The reason for the problematic conditions is the overwhelming number of persons that have illegally entered America with the encouragement of the political left in America.  Our ICE Detention system was not problematic until the immigration issue became one where Democrats actively celebrated illegal immigrants.  (They had them on stage at the 2016 DNC; don't tell me that this isn't so.) 

[Fuzzy Bear]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

The ones there who are asylum seekers are people whose claims for asylum that have been found not legitimate, yet they refused to leave the United States.

That's fake news, Fuzzy. Citation needed.

https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/research/asylum-united-states

Not all asylum seekers are in detention.  Some have been released, and some have not appeared for court proceedings while at liberty. 

Our system was not built for this level of asylum seekers.  We have this present problem because the asylum system is being abused by people who are not true asylum seekers.

So do you support a massive expenditure of funding to increase and upgrade detention facilities, immigration courts, and ICE staff?  All of these things will improve the lot of detainees and reduce the time of their detention, will it not?

[Fuzzy Bear]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

The ones there who are asylum seekers are people whose claims for asylum that have been found not legitimate, yet they refused to leave the United States.

That's fake news, Fuzzy. Citation needed.

https://www.americanimmigrationcouncil.org/research/asylum-united-states

Not all asylum seekers are in detention.  Some have been released, and some have not appeared for court proceedings while at liberty.  

I agree with this, but this is not what you said earlier. You claimed that the ones locked up had had their claims "found not legitimate", when in actuality they are in a concentration camp because the system doesn't have time to properly process this many asylum seekers in a time-efficent manner (and Trump likes it that way and will not fix it).

Those are two totally different claims.

A percentage of people in detention are Asylum seekers who were not detained, whose claims were found wanting, and had to be retaken because they didn't show up for a court hearing.  They are in that mix.  But yes, that is not all the Asylum seekers by any means.

I would agree in principle that the issue of detaining Asylum Seekers is a legitimate one and should be discussed.  The idea of detaining folks legitimately seeking asylum is one that does not go down well, and should not go down well.  That has to be balanced against the overwhelming evidence that the asylum system is being abused by people who are not true asylum seekers, but people who just want a better situation.  I have a degree of empathy for people in that situation, but that isn't what asylum is.

[Fuzzy Bear]

A group of people are being concentrated in a camp. They're concentration camps.

Since every camp is a concentration of people, all camps are concentration camps. Don't send your kids to summer concentration camp!

The key distinction is one is voluntary and the other is not. Don't be an idiot.

Yes, holding camps for illegal migrants are 100% voluntary. They chose to invade the United States and risk being detained in one.

The ones who came to the border seeking asylum are not illegal migrants.

The ones there who are asylum seekers are people whose claims for asylum that have been found not legitimate, yet they refused to leave the United States.

That's fake news, Fuzzy. Citation needed.

Because your prior citation from a right-wing anti-immigration groups sucked. And in terms of some people not showing up for court, we are talking about less than 1 and 100 under Obama era Administration practice

I need a citation for your stats.