Crapo arrested on DUI

[patrick1]

Tweed, drunk driving deaths have dropped a lot
http://www.centurycouncil.org/sites/default/files/images/AIDF-Rates.gif

I know a lot of people who got bagged for a dewey.  However, I also know a family who lost their baby girl by a blacked out driving going the wrong way. Driving drunk is a dangerous and all too often deadly activity. You can argue the limits and prescriptions but condoning it is just foolish.

[patrick1]

Current DUI/DWI penalties are fine.

you support coerced 12-step participation for non-addicts and non-alcoholics?

<facepalm>

excuse me?  this goes on all the time.  drug criminalization and drunk driving criminalization have become a scam-slush fund for the 'treatment' industry and insurance companies.  people caught driving over the legal limit or in possession of any amount of an illegal drug are diverted to treatment, where they are taught that they are powerless over their addiction (although many of them do not meet the criteria for drug/alcohol dependence to begin with), and that they have an interminable and incurable disease.  the treatment-industrial complex has grown by hundredfolds over the past few decades thanks to ignorant attitudes such as yours.

Tweed, I am intimately aware of some of the dumb treatment penalties.  I never got a DWI and have never really driven drunk either.  However, I am a drunk and sought counseling treatment-  1x a week or so, outpatient. I refused to be in the same group as people who were mandated to be there on account of a dwi. It is not some thing where I am on my high horse either. I want to be around people who want to be there.  You simply can't compare some 19 year old or housewife who had one too many beers or sherries.  I don't think someone like that will identify with what having a bad withdrawal is and I aint there to be a a inksing scared straight ad.

[patrick1]

I thought of something better to say, I went over the top and shouldn't have. It's just aggravating to me that some people don't see that drunk driving is not safe.

I've never said it is safe.  operating a vehicle is inherently unsafe.  I am even willing to concede that operating a vehicle while under the influence of enough alcohol is to one degree or another less safe than it is otherwise, but it does not automatically follow that the behavior should be criminalized.

Tweed, people who have been drinking don't think or realize how drunk they are. You really need to plant the seeds in peoples heads that there will be massive penalties if caught. Realizing that they could decapitate 7 year olds isn't solely effective. 

I dont think that cookie cutter punishments are a good thing but I don't know how the system works and there is a large difference on this regionally. I would defer to Badger on the details. 

[patrick1]

@Tweed, I'm pretty open about it. I had a 20 year career of varying levels of functioning alcoholism. Started early, majority of family are problem drinkers, and grew up in culture where drinking to excess was celebrated. I was never really an everyday drunk but when I started I usually didnt stop until I passed out.  15 beers was a very light night. Liter and a half of rum type days wouldnt be a rarity. Eventually that type of drinking makes you sick. The constant hangover or worse withdrawal, sober up and then repeat cycle was killing me physically. It was also inducing some massive anxiety and depression toward the last few years. A real desire to stop was the key. Cirrohsis or an early death didnt seem too far off in the distance anymore. A vague death wish and loss of hope was hanging around the air too. This and some mildly crap blood work led me to give a local counseling center a shot.

My direct experience with the counseling has been good. I see a shrink usually once a week for one on one sessions. It is not 12 step based, although she does break my balls to go to AA. I'll admit that I have unresolved issues that I never really confronted and the bottle was a crutch for me.  The therapy has helped me keep things in perspective.  Ive only been to 2 AA meetings since I stopped 6 months ago. It simply isnt for me- right now at least. I met some nice people, I'm sure it works for some, but I just don't like scheduling my life around it and not fond of the cultish vibe of the place.

Additionally, once a week I have group sessions.  As in previous post, I only go to group with others who self refer themselves; whether it be for booze, blow or pills. It is a small group that varies from 5-8 or so. This isn't 12 step based either, although it does lean on the shared vocab and therapists would hold to the disease model. Mine is more of talking therapy.  You say what is on your mind, obstacles urges etc.  Like with many things I think a lot is dependent on who is running the group. I once had some broad who was pulling some relaxation hogwash about being a floating leaf and I thought I was going to Oedipus Rex my eyeballs. The woman I have is good and I get suspicion that she has been down the addict road herself.

There are MUCH larger sessions of DWI folks. I agree that it is usually a waste of most people's time to have people who are court ordered and dont want to be there, many of whom don't have a real drinking problem and dont want to stop in such treatment programs.

Let me know if you have any follow up questions.