Characteristics of Fascism

[badnarikin04]

America-
1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism -- DEFINETLY (see Pledge of Allegance, flag burning laws)
2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights -- Yes (anti-gay, Abu Ghraib incedent)
3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause --  Somewhat (Osama Bin Laden, although justified, but unjustified support against Iraq, "liberals")
4. Supremacy of the Military -- Sort of(TV ads, possible draft)
5. Rampant Sexism -- Very little... I'l say no.

6. Controlled Mass Media -- I'd like to say so. I may be right.

7. Obsession with 'National Security' -- ABSOLUTELY!!!!!
8. Religion and Government are Intertwined --  Not yet...

9. Corporate Power is Protected -- WITHOUT A DOUBT

10. Labor Power is Suppressed -- Not really

11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts -- Not yet

12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment -- Yes

13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption -- MORE THAN ANYWHERE ELSE IN THE WORLD!!!!!
14. Fraudulent Elections -- Yes... Combination of Bush buying election in 2000 and the ploy to eliminate those who are right from the political process.

So America has approximately 8.5 out of these 14....

I challenge any of you damn "neo-cons" to step up and defend this dictator.

Because it should be 0.
 
 
 
 
 

[badnarikin04]

America-

1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism -- No. Strong patriotism, yes, but that is an entirely different phenomenon.

2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights -- Clearly ridiculous. Observe the incredible care that has been taken to avoid civilian casualties in both Afghanistan and Iraq. We could just bomb Fallujah to the ground, you know; if we were fascist we certainly would.

3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause --  Not specifically. The fact of a major enemy (Britain, the Confederacy, Germany, Japan, the USSR, terrorism) have throughout the nation's history tended to create a unifying spirit; this is a fact of human nature and is true of homo sapiens throughout recorded history. Unlike fascist regimes, the USA has not invented nonezistant threats specifically to create unity.

4. Supremacy of the Military -- This one is just plain foolish. The military is completely loyal to civilian masters, and tends to get far less respect in the country as a whole than it should.

5. Rampant Sexism -- No. American women are equal in almost all ways to men; the last barriers are falling. The very fact that equality is the ideal shows we are far from fascist.

6. Controlled Mass Media -- Nope. We have a sensationalist and cynical independent media controlled only by its own biases, which vary.

7. Obsession with 'National Security' -- Yes, like any other country. Are you telling me that communist, monarchial, theocratic, and democratic regimes generally lack concern with the security of their country?

8. Religion and Government are Intertwined --  Certainly not. In at least one of the fascist countries listed, Nazi Germany, too much religion got you killed, and the leadership was generally atheist or neo-Nordic pagan.

9. Corporate Power is Protected -- Yes, because this is a free country. Different from a fascist "corporate state", companies truly are independent in a way they are not under fascism.

10. Labor Power is Suppressed -- No.

11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts -- Clearly not. These folks do not make the nation's political decisions; however, that is hardly exceptional or disdainful.

12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment -- Not particularly. We do punish crime; but no country I am familiar with today or in history has ever fully abolished the concept of crime.

13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption -- No. This country is an extreme meritocracy; if anything, this element is increasing.

14. Fraudulent Elections -- Foolish. Fascists usually did not have elections; at least 3 of the dictators this man was supposedly analyzing had zero. And the election at the end of Pinochet's regime actually was not fraudulent.

In sum, this is a poor analysis of fascism, and an extremely poor attempt to define a right-leaning democracy in wartime.

That's not exactly saying if those things exist in this country. You're just modifying that definition to make Republicrats seem anything but fascist.

There's no control of the media? Then how do you explain the complete and total omission of third parties from the media? The only logical reason I can think of is because the Republicrats control it.

And if you look at the Bush administration, you mean to tell me this is a TOTALLY HONEST GROUP OF LEADERS FIXED ON HELPING PEOPLE AND IN NO MEANS WHATSOEVER MAKES DECISIONS BASED ON THEIR BUSINESS TIES?!?!?! You're saying there is NO CORRUPTION. Somebody loves the taste of Fox News' bodily waste.

[badnarikin04]

There's no control of the media? Then how do you explain the complete and total omission of third parties from the media? The only logical reason I can think of is because the Republicrats control it.

Possibly has something to do with it, but has more to do with people just not caring or having interest. The media only cares about ratings to make money, and if people were interested enough in third parties they would cover them.

I'd be willing to bet people would have interest if they knew about them in the first place.

[badnarikin04]

America-
1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism -- DEFINETLY (see Pledge of Allegance, flag burning laws)
2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights -- Yes (anti-gay, Abu Ghraib incedent)
3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause --  Somewhat (Osama Bin Laden, although justified, but unjustified support against Iraq, "liberals")
4. Supremacy of the Military -- Sort of(TV ads, possible draft)
5. Rampant Sexism -- Very little... I'l say no.

6. Controlled Mass Media -- I'd like to say so. I may be right.

7. Obsession with 'National Security' -- ABSOLUTELY!!!!!
8. Religion and Government are Intertwined --  Not yet...

9. Corporate Power is Protected -- WITHOUT A DOUBT

10. Labor Power is Suppressed -- Not really

11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts -- Not yet

12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment -- Yes

13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption -- MORE THAN ANYWHERE ELSE IN THE WORLD!!!!!
14. Fraudulent Elections -- Yes... Combination of Bush buying election in 2000 and the ploy to eliminate those who are right from the political process.

So America has approximately 8.5 out of these 14....

I challenge any of you damn "neo-cons" to step up and defend this dictator.

Because it should be 0.
 

I would certainly challenge all of you "damn" (using your word there) Libertarians to take that chip off of your shoulder.  The world is not out to suppress you.  You remind me of that guy from the Holy Grail "Help, help I'm being repressed".  You think that others are activly out to "put you in your place" and you fail to realize that the reason others talk you down is because you are being generally disagreeable.

Anyway, while neo-conservatism is certainly authoritarian on some issues it is far from facist.  Words have inpact it is your responsability to use them responsably.  That being said:

1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism -- No.  Patriotism and trying to bring on a sense of national pride and identification is not "Powerful Nationalism".  And since when is nationalism in it self a bad thing?

2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights -- No.  People are defended by the law in this country.  If we are so horrible, why are the ACLU and Amnesty International still around?

3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause --  No.  They provoked us and we are in a real war.  We do not go around identifying "Arabs" or "Muslims" as the enemy.  The enemy is "terrorism" a force that really seeks to do us harm.

4. Supremacy of the Military -- No.  There will be no draft.  We have commercials to recruit people into what most would deem an honorable living.  Is there something wrong with respecting the military?

5. Rampant Sexism -- No.  We do not force people into traditional rules as they did in Nazi Germany.

6. Controlled Mass Media -- The government doesn't control the media here.  If you want a good example of where this is going on, turn to France.

7. Obsession with 'National Security' -- In todays world, national security is important, but it is not the Bush teams only preoccupation.  In different times, idfferent issues are important because of events.  That doesn't mean "Facism" is upon us.

8. Religion and Government are Intertwined --  Don't know what they mean with this.  Usually facist regimes declare war on traditional religious institutions.

9. Corporate Power is Protected -- It's a free market.

10. Labor Power is Suppressed -- No.

11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts -- No.

12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment -- Here again we see "obsession" used as a criteria.  There is no "obsession" here.

13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption -- Not only is "rampant" far too strong a word, but both parties do it.

14. Fraudulent Elections -- The 2000 election obeyed both the Florida Constitution and the U.S. Constitution.  Later studies proved that Bush would have won, no matter the method applyed.  It is true that people were denyed the right to vote because of the "ex-con" confussion, but many who voted the other way voted in two states, so....

You're still trying to justify the substandard mission of neo-conservatism. My point was, we can live in a society where all of these are scoffed at instead of remanufactured in a lite rated-PG version and packaged to Americans as a true form of government in which watching over people is OK.

This really should not be debateable, yet here we are wondering whether or not these exist.