A Second Chance - CONCLUSION

[Jerseyrules]

Awesome.  Who is Noel again?  What/why does he run?  Or is he just like Rick Santorum with no nationwide campaign experience, who decides to throw his hat into the ring anyway?

[Jerseyrules]

Awesome.  Who is Noel again?  What/why does he run?  Or is he just like Rick Santorum with no nationwide campaign experience, who decides to throw his hat into the ring anyway?

He's sort of a Northern "pissed off white male" figure. Basically, you'd find a ttl version of me probably supporting him. In OTL he was Governor of Rhode Island and I think he ran for Senate in '76, but lost to Chaffee. In this, however, given that Chaffee won the Senate election four years earlier and there's bigger turnout in RI thanks to RFK on the ticket, Noel is able to make it. There wasn't much info on him when I first started looking into him, so I've molded him into what I see fit: The candidate of pissed off blue collars who're socially conservative and don't have much taste for all this Civil Rights stuff. Given that Noel's running in the 80's, however, his candidacy is about twelve to twenty years too late.

So he's like a northeastern George Wallace?  Interesting....  Helms / Noel (or Glenn, Ferraro, etc) in 88!

[Jerseyrules]

Well isn't it typical! I have this huge update (number of words-wise) in the works and I move my laptop and find out the internet was exited out of.

That's happened to me, except I have iPad, I'll look for a pic to go with the update, then once I go back to the tab with the update, it automatically refreshes itself.  Sucks.

[Jerseyrules]

Wait, was Wallace shot ITTL?

[Jerseyrules]

Wait, was Wallace shot ITTL?

No. Bremer shot Agnew on July 4th, 1973. Wallace is still around and is Governor of Alabama, got rid of his racist rhetoric as in TTL. He isn't running anymore, etc.

Did he still retain the "pissed off white man" aura as ITTL?  I wonder if he would've changed even if he weren't shot as otl, because he was quoted saying "I don't wanna meet my maker with unforgiven sins" after his pivot on Civil Rights

[Jerseyrules]

Interesting.  Btw, I can understand your decision regarding Wallace, honestly I'm not sure what I'd have him do, except maybe confess on his deathbed.  Why did he sit out 80 and 84, and who did he endorse, out of curiousity?

[Jerseyrules]

Interesting.  Btw, I can understand your decision regarding Wallace, honestly I'm not sure what I'd have him do, except maybe confess on his deathbed.  Why did he sit out 80 and 84, and who did he endorse, out of curiousity?

In 1980, the southern Democrats as a whole decided to support Kennedy as the opposition to the insurgent McCarthy. While a Southern candidate, maybe Wallace even, could have done very well, it very well could've split the vote in the South and parts of the West and Mid-West. Instead, they chose to support Kennedy due to his anti-communist foreign policy and general moderation. (Though, Wallace did receive write-in support in Alabama, making his state the only southern state to go for someone in under 50% margins) Wallace chose not to endorse anyone in '84, now more uncomfortable with Helm's rhetoric and not trusting him ("He's the candidate for Big Tobacco and Big Tobacco only!") as a candidate of the "common man", but also seeing the others as worse. By '84, as in RL, he was irrelevant and not factored in as a potential candidate.

Makes sense.  Keep up with updates

[Jerseyrules]

Have Noel win a brokered convention!

[Jerseyrules]

I'm Jerseyrules, and I approve this ticket

[Jerseyrules]

I'm Jerseyrules, and I approve this ticket

Thanks.
Who do you plan on supporting in November?

Meh.  Third party or Bentsen.  But Bensen's really good for a Democrat

[Jerseyrules]

Cool.  Please sir may I have some more

Also, what's Phil Gramm up to?

[Jerseyrules]

This is amazing.  Don't you dare stop now!  Lets get her up to 100 pages!

Who have the libertarians put up this year?

[Jerseyrules]

Any thoughts on the two tickets? Also, anyone rooting for specific tickets? Also, any questions on 3rd party nominations in case some of you don't feel confident in these two emminently qualified tickets?

I'm quite happy with both, though I'd lean Bentsen (though he really should wait to run for president until he can campaign as the elder statesman.)

Has Hatfield balanced the budget or just cut the deficit?  If not, who have the libertarians nominated?

[Jerseyrules]

Just need to revise the year a little.

Did hatfield ever run for president as more than a favorite son?

[Jerseyrules]

Cool.  Please sir may I have some more

Also, what's Phil Gramm up to?

RNC, comin' up!

Phil Gramm's a Democratic Congressman from Texas. He's running for U.S. Senate against Republican nominee, two-term Congressman H. Ross Perot whose campaign is financed largely by his own personal fortune. One-term Senator John Tower is retiring. He was considered a possible VP candidate and likely would have been chosen if not for Warner. (I mean really, he'd served in WWII, on the House Armed Services Committee, as Governor and Senator, was a reliable hawk, and had worked in two Presidential cabinets for God's sake. Maybe I should've chosen him. Oh well, too late)

Cool!  More please

[Jerseyrules]

Just need to revise the year a little.

Did hatfield ever run for president as more than a favorite son?

More appropriately, did Hatfield ever run? (Pretty sure I already know the answer)

Hatfield has cut the deficit by more than half from when Reagan first entered office.

Anyway, as for the Libertarians, the ticket is:
Kingswood Township Committeeman Richard P. Siano (L-NJ)/Activist James A. Lewis (L-CT)

There isn't a wikipedia page on Siano, but he was elected a Kingswood Township, New Jersey, Committeeman in a special election in 1981, both in this and in real life. That's according to wikipedia's "History of the Libertarian Party". Any other third party questions?

So going on a different path even for third parties?  I would never have the patience to wade through all that information!  I salute your superior patience and attention span! 

[Jerseyrules]

Just need to revise the year a little.

Did hatfield ever run for president as more than a favorite son?

More appropriately, did Hatfield ever run? (Pretty sure I already know the answer)

Hatfield has cut the deficit by more than half from when Reagan first entered office.

Anyway, as for the Libertarians, the ticket is:
Kingswood Township Committeeman Richard P. Siano (L-NJ)/Activist James A. Lewis (L-CT)

There isn't a wikipedia page on Siano, but he was elected a Kingswood Township, New Jersey, Committeeman in a special election in 1981, both in this and in real life. That's according to wikipedia's "History of the Libertarian Party". Any other third party questions?

No, but there were still fanfare buttons for him, as there are with many candidates. For instance:



(It is worth noting that some time in the late 60's he appeared with WFB, who as absolutely gushing over him in the introduction saying he'd have been President were he from a state with more clout than Oregon.)

Anyway, what is the status of the Libertarian Party ITTL, insofar as their base and which wing has prominence? Are they distraught neoconservatives like John Hospers and Bob Barr or are they of the Lee Wrights/David Bergland variety? (I can't imagine them as much of a conduit for the cosmo-libertarians like Ed Clark/Gary Johnson.)

I always thought that interview was interesting, especially considering Buckley wasn't exactly the darling of the Rockefeller Republicans

[Jerseyrules]

1. Y'all talkin' about that one interview in, I think, 1966 or 1967 where Buckley had Hatfield on his show?

B. Well, Jerseyrules, you asked for the Libertarian ticket, so I decided I'd make an alternate one. I myself get tired of reading about activists being the nominees, so I decided I'd use one of their elected officials.

III. Dallasfan, hadn't thought about the makeup of the party. You're right though on the "cosmo libertarians", they're not that much in the folds and anyone you'd identify as one of those would probably be voting for Hatfield. On the issue of the other two factions, distraught Neo-Conservatives and what I guess is more of a Libertarian hard-liner, I hadn't thought that much about the issue seeing as I'm not that deep into Libertarian politics. However, looking at the situation we're at at this point, 1984 with Hatfield being the Republican nominee, I'm gonna say distraught Neo-Conservatives. If these are the type that are more Libertarian domestically and whatnot, they're not gonna be that at home with either party right now. I'm trying to think of an example for 1984 so I can use him (or her?). Given that, the ticket may change. Any suggestions since you seem to be the expert on this?

d) Dan Quayle... Hmmmm.... I'm gonna say he's been a Congressman from Indiana since 1975.

He needs to rise up the ranks. President Quayle would be badass.

A non-"stupid" one would be even better.  Maybe Quayle for Governor 1984?

[Jerseyrules]

Some pretty big names for the Conservatives and Progressives, though I doubt either of them could break 5%.

This.  TTL 84 seems to be one of those years when the 2 major party candidates aren't very different, and where third parties could do very well.  More please , matching funds for libertarians too

[Jerseyrules]

This is very interesting.  Just one question: after 12 years of Kennedy's, what's NASA looking like?  Do we have any plan similar to SDI?  Thanks.

[Jerseyrules]

Please tell me Barry Jr is a senator

Very good, keep it coming

[Jerseyrules]

.....John Marchi or Ed Koch 85!

[Jerseyrules]

Please tell me Barry Jr is a senator

And yes he is. Congressman 69-77, then when Reagan declined re-election to run for VP in '76, Goldwater Jr. was nominated and won re-election. He's been in the position since.

Yay

[Jerseyrules]

Yes!  An update, and a damn good interesting one too!  Just don't tease us though

[Jerseyrules]

Awesome man.  Just wondering, what are George Schultz and Henry Kissinger up to?