LOLGreece - Part 1268

[ingemann]

What about we all make a deal until the Greek government have shown itself able to something other than making EU's PMs, presidents and foreign ministers look very very tired. Tender and everyone else who think the Greek government are a bunch of idiots can keep mock them, while everyone who think the solution is just around the corner, can wait until Greece have actualy done something, which they wasn't forced to do (under great whining), and then you can attack Tender and company.

I would love to see the Greek government doing something about corruption, and naive as I am, I expect Syriza and Anel to be the one most likely to try to deal with it. But I have lost some of my optimism after having followed their actions the last 50 days.

The meeting tonight is a good example, it have more or less pissed every single Euro members, except for Germany and France off (and even those two's countries patience have been tested).

[ingemann]

Dear ingemann, you don't get it.

What about we all make a deal until the Greek government have shown itself able to something other than making EU's PMs, presidents and foreign ministers look very very tired. Tender and everyone else who think the Greek government are a bunch of idiots can keep mock them, while everyone who think the solution is just around the corner, can wait until Greece have actualy done something, which they wasn't forced to do (under great whining), and then you can attack Tender and company.

On the one hand, I have little to say if you, Branson and others think that the Greek government is a bunch of idiots that deserves being ridiculed. That's not the issue, my friend. If you care to read some previous posts, you'll find that the news in which Branson bases his somewhat hysterical attempt of mocking the Greeks is mere propaganda. If there's an 'offence' here, it's not the dubious sense of humour. On the other hand, you seem to believe that all of us on the 'other side' are ingenuously optimistic about the possibility of a solution "around the corner". As far as I'm concerned, nothing could be more untrue. However, I think that it's mainly the EU establishment who creates obstacles by persisting in the error. I'm very very tired of the bunch of clowns that runs the EU institutions, believe me.

Yes we have the impressive counter point to a article Branson linked to (quoting a respected newspaper), something which Bacon King wrote. Now I respect Bacon King and all that, but I think that I will demand a little more evidence, before I think that a article by die Welt is "proven" as propaganda, than a poster just saying "that's wrong". You're free to believe that it's correct, but no; Tender Branson have not be proven wrong, someone have just posted something which fit into your narrative, which you have decided to take as the truth.

[ingemann]

I fully buy that what BK says is may be true. But you say it is true, because it fit your ideological narrative.

[ingemann]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-04-20/greece-moves-to-seize-local-government-cash-as-imf-payment-looms

Tsipras to Seize Public-Sector Funds to Keep Greece Afloat

Interesting, I must admit the only feeling I have is curiosity about how Greece end up.

[ingemann]

It seems we are headed to some sort of deal between Tsipras and EU which breaks a bunch of Tsipras promises in the election.  Then there will be a referendum where the Greek people can vote on the deal and stay in the Euro (and accept the fact that when you own money you have to pay it back)  or no and they all go down together in the sinking ship.  This way Tsipras can claim he tried to keep his election promises but the Greek people said it is OK to break it.

Honestly I think the Greek economy may be too far gone to be saved by now, and here's the really horrible part, the Drachma is not a real alternative anymore.

[ingemann]

It seems we are headed to some sort of deal between Tsipras and EU which breaks a bunch of Tsipras promises in the election.  Then there will be a referendum where the Greek people can vote on the deal and stay in the Euro (and accept the fact that when you own money you have to pay it back)  or no and they all go down together in the sinking ship.  This way Tsipras can claim he tried to keep his election promises but the Greek people said it is OK to break it.

Honestly I think the Greek economy may be too far gone to be saved by now, and here's the really horrible part, the Drachma is not a real alternative anymore.

That's the only thing certain. You need at least 6 months work to create a new currency. Right now our choice is between a tough deal or a national disaster.

That's really the least problem Greece is going to have. A much bigger problem is that no one, really no one will be willing to accept any Greek currency, if they default. Greece will only be able to buy foreign goods with foreign currencies, which with Greeks pulling their money out of Greece and the negative BOP will make it near impossible for Greece to import foreign goods.

[ingemann]

It seems we are headed to some sort of deal between Tsipras and EU which breaks a bunch of Tsipras promises in the election.  Then there will be a referendum where the Greek people can vote on the deal and stay in the Euro (and accept the fact that when you own money you have to pay it back)  or no and they all go down together in the sinking ship.  This way Tsipras can claim he tried to keep his election promises but the Greek people said it is OK to break it.

Honestly I think the Greek economy may be too far gone to be saved by now, and here's the really horrible part, the Drachma is not a real alternative anymore.

That's the only thing certain. You need at least 6 months work to create a new currency. Right now our choice is between a tough deal or a national disaster.

That's really the least problem Greece is going to have. A much bigger problem is that no one, really no one will be willing to accept any Greek currency, if they default. Greece will only be able to buy foreign goods with foreign currencies, which with Greeks pulling their money out of Greece and the negative BOP will make it near impossible for Greece to import foreign goods.

Supposedly there was a plan concocted by the government about using IOUs or electronic currency in the interim between exiting the euro and putting into circulation the new drachma. But the whole thing was completely ridiculous and was quickly abandoned as unworkable.

It's a horrible and unworkable idea, but again the 6 month are not the real problem, the real problem is that other countries will not accept Drachma, when they have been introduced, because of the complete lack of trust in the Greek currency and Greece will also have very hard to borrow from abroad. Just imagine what that will do in the short term to Greek oil import. Greek may in the year after leaving the Euro only be able to buy oil on the black market with Euros.

That alone will make what happening right now even worse, you can imagine what it will do to tourism if Greek barely have access to oil.