Chaos in the China stock market! (user search)
       |           

Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
June 09, 2024, 07:41:33 AM
News: Election Simulator 2.0 Released. Senate/Gubernatorial maps, proportional electoral votes, and more - Read more

  Talk Elections
  General Politics
  Economics (Moderator: Torie)
  Chaos in the China stock market! (search mode)
Pages: [1]
Author Topic: Chaos in the China stock market!  (Read 5693 times)
Simfan34
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,744
United States


Political Matrix
E: 0.90, S: 4.17

« on: July 06, 2015, 09:27:10 PM »


If my professor from last semester is to be believed (and I tend to think he is- if a bit wishfully), this is only the start of a very, very long road down. Beyond the empty real estate people tend to focus on, China has generated an immense amount of excess industrial capacity, which has avoided collapse so far only because the government (both in Beijing and at the local level) has been propping them up, mostly by encouraging banks to roll over their loans in addition to direct subsidy (which, among other things, has left local governments deeply indebted).

Between that and the real estate issue, which has been largely driven by local governments seeking to generate revenue from industrial and commercial land leases- borrowing heavily to pay for the infrastructure needed to attract buyers- the result is that commercial banks and local governments alike have massive debt problems. Now the number of non-performing loans is rising, over 10% in the last quarter according to official numbers. All this while Xi's high-level "anti-corruption" campaign is increasingly paralysing the administrative organs of the state: perhaps the worst possible time for that to occur. Officials don't know what is going to happen to their superiors, or what now constitutes inappropriate activity, and are choosing to play it safe- by doing nothing. None of this means that there's going to be some horrific crash, but it's no surprise the markets are jittery.

The sole upside of this is that it may ease that subsidy-induced glut of Chinese industrial capacity, which has wreaked havoc on manufacturing sectors the world over. A steel industry that produces 60% of global output, and is now seeking to offload its excess capacity overseas, has more or less cannibalised that of every other country. Overcapacity in their shipbuilding industry has caused prices to more than halve (spotty construction, however, means many will have to be replaced in a few years- thankfully). Tires, cement, paper- it's clear that Chinese overcapacity is preventing manufacturing growth essentially anywhere else except at the very low end, to say nothing of the kind of heavy industry you really need for development. A correction that wipes out this overcapacity- if still decidedly a net negative for the global economy- will be one with a very significant silver lining.
Logged
Simfan34
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,744
United States


Political Matrix
E: 0.90, S: 4.17

« Reply #1 on: July 08, 2015, 07:53:19 AM »

The thing is, though, that the market has risen 150% over the last year, in a time of slowing growth. Hence even after this plunge, the market is still up 80% from a year ago! It remains to be seen whether this is purely a market correction driven by overleveraged retail investors or part of a broader systemic correction- a panic or a proper crash.

It's not as if there aren't any reasons to be worried about the Chinese economy- as has been said already in this thread there are many reasons to be worried.
Logged
Simfan34
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,744
United States


Political Matrix
E: 0.90, S: 4.17

« Reply #2 on: July 08, 2015, 08:20:35 AM »

In related news, already heavily-indebted local governments have taken to buying up empty real estate:

Quote
You must be logged in to read this quote.

In the infamous Inner Mongolian ghost city of Ordos City, authorities purchased 3,660 units in May alone.

Logged
Simfan34
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,744
United States


Political Matrix
E: 0.90, S: 4.17

« Reply #3 on: August 12, 2015, 07:17:01 PM »
« Edited: August 12, 2015, 07:18:54 PM by Simfan34 »

Just wait until China's shadow banking bubble bursts. There will be blood.

Could you elaborate a bit?

I more or less touched upon this in my first post.

Such dramatic devaluation bodes ill for the health of the economy, or perhaps just as importantly, the Party's assessment thereof. If they are reversing years of carefully planned cooperation with their trade partners on the yuan's appreciation, it suggests they take a bleak view of things and are desperately trying to boost exports.
Logged
Simfan34
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,744
United States


Political Matrix
E: 0.90, S: 4.17

« Reply #4 on: August 12, 2015, 08:34:33 PM »
« Edited: August 12, 2015, 08:48:52 PM by Simfan34 »

I haven't read anything suggesting something so calamitous. The explosion seems to have been in an industrial area, although I did see something about a building 10 km away collapsing. If it is that bad then the main port for Beijing and the whole Binhai Bay region will have been taken out of order, which would be disastrous.

e: Now I've seen a couple, and seen the location... death toll is up to 66 and I'm no longer as skeptical as I just was about what you said.

If people on Reddit are to be believed, there are heavy fatalities on ships and the hit to affected insurers is a heavy one.
Logged
Simfan34
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,744
United States


Political Matrix
E: 0.90, S: 4.17

« Reply #5 on: August 24, 2015, 07:52:10 AM »
« Edited: August 24, 2015, 07:54:00 AM by Simfan34 »

Down 8.5%. Government frantically trying to pump money in the market. Still up 45% for the past 12 months.
Logged
Pages: [1]  
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Terms of Service - DMCA Agent and Policy - Privacy Policy and Cookies

Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines

Page created in 0.026 seconds with 10 queries.