North Korea Mega Thread

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

I'm not a Trumpist, but I love the fiery rhetoric, I only wish we would actually act on it and unleash dragon fire on North Korea.

If you want to burn people alive, you are a complete failure as a human being.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

From the original release by Yonhap:

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http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/news/2017/08/10/0200000000AEN20170810000600315.html

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

North Korea once again threatened to fire missiles at Guam, this time they threatened to fire 4 near Guam.

Are they suicidal?

Yes and they literally do not give a f about international law or threats by the US to retaliate. NK is the Leeroy Jenkins of nation states.

If they were suicidal, they'd just fire at Guam with no warning. The repeated warnings and specific details given about the plans suggest they want us to know what it is if/when it happens. As for why Guam... they seem very threatened by the live-fire exercises of the two B1-B bombers, which were deployed in July. Typically our position is that military exercises are defensive, but these have been simulating the destruction of enemy missile launchers and underground facilities, which could equally be defensive or offensive.

If we try to show a little empathy, or you know humanity, the North Koreans are doing the same thing we are. There was no direct threat to nuke Guam. They said they were making a plan to conduct demonstration strikes near Guam. That's damn aggressive saber-rattling, but it's also not that much different from the US saying we have a plan to destroy the North Korea military. We need to stop the escalation before someone unwittingly panics the other side.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Why exactly can people not realise that the North Korean regime is not suicidal and will not launch a pre-emptive nuclear strike which would not benefit them in any way and result in their annihilation?

Because our own government is insane and has a recent history of launching preemptive attacks that cost trillions and have no long term benefits? Plus now with Trump, we've got a so-called leader who practically salivates at the thought of getting to use the world's largest phallic symbol. We know that we're stupid enough to do it in their shoes.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

I actually think Trump wants war. Wars are good for approval ratings. He wants something to improve ihis rating.

Trump is a madman and a danger to the entire world as lons his approval rating is low.

I think this is true, but I'm equally confident he wants a short, easy war. North Korea might fight back, which probably scares him. And even if it can't, it'll be a complicated mess to sort out, and Trump hates real work too.  Now, he is amazingly stupid, so it's possible he will think it's a quick walk in the park (especially if he'll get to use those nukes he loves so much).

But I'm hopeful that his babysittersthe White House Staff and Cabinet will successfully use a combination pretty pictures ("See how imperial you look on the Fox News broadcast?"), dire warnings of real consequences ("the Chinese won't let you build a 70-story gold-plated casino in Macau") and colorful distractions ("Somalia is full of pirates, invading it will be awesome!") to keep him distracted from The Button.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Asked if he would consider a pre-emptive strike against North Korea to deny it the ability to launch a nuclear attack against the United States, Trump said, "We'll see what happens."

Everyone that voted for this idiot is going to have blood on their hands.

To be objective, "We'll see what happens" doesn't mean Trump is planning an attack. Like a great deal of what he says, what it really translates to is "I didn't do my homework". Sadder yet, it's not some sort of temporary cover while he goes and figures things out. He will never bother to learn anything about Korea, nor will he delegate and listen to people who do. He'll keep giving macho BS answers and making threats until either A) other people fix the problem, B) enough other stuff happens that people stop asking him about it, C) he has a tantrum (and starts a major war), or D) he dies, is jailed, or has a total mental breakdown.

Note that this, plus E) find some suckers and take their money,  is Trump's MO for everything.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Oh lord...

While an escalation, don't read too much into this. This is an opinion piece in The Global Times. It's much closer to being China's version of Fox News than an official government source.  

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

The biggest worry with North Korea isn't them attacking us, it's with nuclear proliferation. They are a poor country. Our sanctions aren't helping. They could easily sell nuclear materials to terrorist groups for money/food/supplies.

Just like Saddam!


It was never a good story to begin with, and it's a really lame one now. If we can cope with attempts at nuclear proliferation by our allies like Saudi Arabia and Pakistan, I think we can deal with the Hermit Kingdom too. Without fighting a war.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Point Of Order: Does anybody seriously think that ChinaRussia will throw away everything they've built over the past decades to defend North KoreaSerbia? I mean really?

I know they have to suggest as much but if it came down to it I highly doubt they would actually go to war with the USAAustro-Hungarian Empire (thus triggering the instant collapse of their economy) over this issue. I mean c'mon, they aren't anywhere near stupid enough to do that.

It isn't 19501860 anymore. If anything they would back-stab the DPRKSerbs and invade themselves to secure a buffer zone for refugees and humanitarian concerns after the fall.

FIFY.  This is what happens when we stop teaching history.

Has it ever occurred to you that China might see this in a different light? That perhaps they could see it as a chance to deal a body-blow to a weakened and incompetently-led United States, establishing themselves as the rising global power heading into the 21st Century? (And claim to be on the right side of international law while doing it.) That the people making the decisions have imperfect understanding of their opposite numbers, and can just be wrong about what the other players will do and when they will do it?






 

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Point Of Order: Does anybody seriously think that ChinaRussia will throw away everything they've built over the past decades to defend North KoreaSerbia? I mean really?

I know they have to suggest as much but if it came down to it I highly doubt they would actually go to war with the USAAustro-Hungarian Empire (thus triggering the instant collapse of their economy) over this issue. I mean c'mon, they aren't anywhere near stupid enough to do that.

It isn't 19501860 anymore. If anything they would back-stab the DPRKSerbs and invade themselves to secure a buffer zone for refugees and humanitarian concerns after the fall.

FIFY.  This is what happens when we stop teaching history.

Has it ever occurred to you that China might see this in a different light? That perhaps they could see it as a chance to deal a body-blow to a weakened and incompetently-led United States, establishing themselves as the rising global power heading into the 21st Century? (And claim to be on the right side of international law while doing it.) That the people making the decisions have imperfect understanding of their opposite numbers, and can just be wrong about what the other players will do and when they will do it?






 

Prior to WW1 everyone thought WW1 would be a short and decisive war. And the way people looked at war was much different pre-WW1 than now. Everyone agrees that a war between China and the US would be catastrophic and that we should do everything to prevent it, which definitely wasn't the case in the years before WW1.

Step back and think about what you're saying here. You're arguing that China would never go to war with the US because war between heavily-armed nuclear states in unthinkable, when the casus belli for such a conflict would be the US going to war against a heavily armed nuclear state (even if it is a backwards one). If nothing else, a war against North Korea would practically be begging the Chinese to deniably nuke a couple of navy or army groups  and say the North Koreans did it.

Relying on Everyone Knows in moments of crisis is a great way to end up with disaster.

If the US goes to war with North Korea under the assumption that China couldn't possibly join, we will be making it more attractive for them to weigh in.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Trump just called the governor of Guam... and congratulated him on Guam now being famous. That's what it's always about with Trump, isn't it? Fame and fortune.

He also said he was 1000% with Guam but whatever.

The governor also thanked Trump and was happy with him as president.

I'm certain that wasn't because Trump is the sort of petty tyrant who would pay back anything but utter sycophancy by taking it out on the people of Guam.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

http://thebulletin.org/north-korea%E2%80%99s-%E2%80%9Cnot-quite%E2%80%9D-icbm-can%E2%80%99t-hit-lower-48-states11012

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Once again, we find that mainstream US media have enabled and empowered Trump and his insanity, even while criticizing him.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Kim reviews Guam strike plan as Mattis issues stark warning
http://www.cnn.com/2017/08/14/politics/mattis-north-korea-guam-game-on/index.html

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I recommend reading the whole thing.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

A clear victory for trump, let's face it, he achieved more than obama in 8 years, fire is attacked with fire and fury

Yeah, sure.

Next, you'll tell me that Trump is going to save us from Obama's evil plan to blot out the Sun next week.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Donald J. Trump‏ Verified account @realDonaldTrump  28 minutes ago
 Kim Jong Un of North Korea made a very wise and well reasoned decision. The alternative would have been both catastrophic and unacceptable!

It's nice that at least one of the nations involved in this manufactured crisis has a leader capable of making wise and well-reasoned decisions.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Good article on recent developments and discussion of a potential for preventative war. The Ulchi-Freedom Guardian (UFG) drills kick off today and last until 31 August.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/20/world/asia/north-korea-war-trump.html

"Preventative war".

Do you mean like when fascist Imperial Japanese attack Pearl Harbor to defend themselves?
Or maybe like Operation Barbarossa, when the Nazi fascists attacked the Soviet Union in order to prevent the Soviets from hanging onto their lands and lives?

Great company you want to keep there.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

https://warisboring.com/the-u-s-navys-greatest-enemy-might-be-exhaustion/

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[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/news/2017/08/26/0200000000AEN20170826000651315.html

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[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

US Pacific Command says there were three launches.  The 1st and 3rd failed in flight, while the 2nd blew up immediately after launch.

I wonder if US Pacific Command's involvement in those explosions was limited to monitoring? With North Korea's missile track record, it's hard to say.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

"Talking is not the answer"

Donald J. Trump‏Verified account @realDonaldTrump  7 hours ago
 The U.S. has been talking to North Korea, and paying them extortion money, for 25 years. Talking is not the answer!

He's f***ing lost it.

He never had it.

He's also a complete blowhard and pathological liar, so this likely means nothing.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

What will happen first: Trump releasing his tax records demonstrating the truth of his financial claims, or North Korea detonating an H-bomb?

I wouldn't be surprised to see the North claim they've detonated an H-bomb. Nor would I be surprised to see Trump release some tax records immediately afterward.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/09/02/world/asia/north-korea-tremor-possible-6th-nuclear-test.html?partner=rss&emc=rss&smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur

Seems like there's been another test

Yep. And the reported yields are putting it in the range where it pretty much has to a be a fusion bomb.  I'm shocked. I really didn't think Kim Jong-un's regime would be able to do that.

I guess now I get to see if Trumpolini really does try to bury something damaging in the aftermath.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

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(source)

So, uh, China?

Does anyone in China believe Trump is actually calling the shots in his administration? Or that he's capable of following through on anything?

I'll also point out that for all Trump's whining that diplomacy doesn't work, he has never actually engaged in any.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Also note that Trumpot has just implicitly endorsed the death of civilian control of the military when he referred to Secretary of Defense Mattis and Chief of Staff Kelly as military leaders. Given that Trumpot himself is mostly a (very loud, and obnoxious) figurehead, from a certain perspective we're really seeing the end of civilian government. It's just obscured by how awful the leader of the Republican Party is.

[Absentee Voting Ghost of Ruin]

Why is Trump's red line not a bigger deal than Obama's? Does nobody remember the 'fire and fury' threat he made last month and he did nothing...

Because Trump has no reputation to lose. Everyone already knows he's a chaotic, idiotic blowhard and expects him to act accordingly. He's the global equivalent of the struggling toddler who gets praise for not soiling his pants today.