SENATE BILL: Efficient Referenda Amendment (Failed)

[bore]

Cincy asked me to introduce this, so if he wants to elaborate he can, but I fully agree with the amendment. Simply put, our current system is useless. Not only is it sometimes a problem even holding the votes, there is no real method of ascertaining which amendments have been ratified. Since the wiki has last been edited, 5 amendments have been ratified but no one would know, and no one is keeping track. If the SOFE was administering them, we would know for certain whether an amendment had been ratified.

[bore]

I definitely support the use of the DoFE when holding regional votes, but I can't support repealing the 17th in its entirety. Its presence presents too many opportunities for fun. I remember when Marokai fought for the passage of this bill, and at the time I was against it, but hindsight is 20/20.

In my opinion, something to the effect of allowing the DoFE to administer the first vote by region on any amendment - with the regional government dealing with subsequent attempts at passage - would be more desirable. I suppose I'm leading the charge for regional rights on this, then?

What does this mean? Something like the DoFE holding the first vote on an amendment, but if that fails, and the senate passes it again, allowing the regions to administer that? Or the DOFE opens one booth, but the governor certifies each result?

[bore]

I definitely support the use of the DoFE when holding regional votes, but I can't support repealing the 17th in its entirety. Its presence presents too many opportunities for fun. I remember when Marokai fought for the passage of this bill, and at the time I was against it, but hindsight is 20/20.

In my opinion, something to the effect of allowing the DoFE to administer the first vote by region on any amendment - with the regional government dealing with subsequent attempts at passage - would be more desirable. I suppose I'm leading the charge for regional rights on this, then?

What does this mean? Something like the DoFE holding the first vote on an amendment, but if that fails, and the senate passes it again, allowing the regions to administer that? Or the DOFE opens one booth, but the governor certifies each result?

THe DoFE holds the first vote and Region the subsequent re-attempts if the first one were to fail.

A failure of the amendment or a failure of the administration of the vote? If it's the former, isn't that entirely arbitrary, like allowing the regions to hold all the votes on amendments passed on dates which are also prime numbers, but not on any others?

[bore]

What would it mean for the first vote to fail?

[bore]

Right, but would a first vote failing mean that it was rejected by the regions but then passed again by the senate?

[bore]

So, if a particular region, say, the IDS were to originally vote against an amendment, Adam's saying, if the governor wanted to, he could open that vote again and see if there was a different vote?

[bore]

Yes, I think so.

Glad we got there eventually

[bore]

Amendment is friendly.

[bore]

The northeast's regional elections are tied into the federal calendar.

But I, for one, wouldn't support regionalizing senate elections, because I'm certain that it wouldn't be long before a region failed to hold one. The current system is not broken, so does not need to be fixed. Unlike the amendment system.

[bore]

But I, for one, wouldn't support regionalizing senate elections, because I'm certain that it wouldn't be long before a region failed to hold one. The current system is not broken, so does not need to be fixed. Unlike the amendment system.

Is this distinction not the result of the fact that we have been blessed with two years plus of homelycooking doing a job that few would do and without incident? There was a time when the SoFE/SoFA was late or forgot to do it.

Maybe, but it's still far less likely that you'll have a lazy/ incompetent SoFE than that 1 out of 5 regional executives is lazy/incompetent.

[bore]

If it were the case that there were citizens in every region ready to punish lazy executives then I wouldn't mind delegating the regional senate elections, but I just don't think it is. Governors regularly miss amendment votes with little or no consequences, and there's not a rising up among the population. I think all we'd get by regionalizing senate elections is the negative consequences (missed votes) without any of the positives that you talk about, because it's been shown time and again that activity is not the only, or even the most important characteristic. And if that's so, is it worth the hassle?

[bore]

I'm fine with a final vote.

So, to be clear, I motion for a for a final vote.

[bore]

Aye