Rise in violent antisemitism around the world (user search)
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  Rise in violent antisemitism around the world (search mode)
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Author Topic: Rise in violent antisemitism around the world  (Read 1392 times)
Vosem
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*****
Posts: 15,641
United States


Political Matrix
E: 8.13, S: -6.09

« on: November 06, 2023, 01:30:34 PM »

Absolutely crazy and sick what's going on right now all over the world (and on this website, as I have learned today). That's the worst persecution of Jews since the 1930s and 40s during the Holocaust. Nonetheless, Israel and Jews must have a non-negotiable right to defend themselves and their country from external and internal terrorists, in light of the atrocities during the Holocaust.

ps: if you take a look at US campuses, and this is a US website, it doesn't really surprise me that there are many virulent antisemites posting here too.

I can only think of two posters since 10/7 who have said anything remotely antisemitic. One was an Iran shill, MattRose, who praised the attack and Hamas. He was immediately banned. The other is hermit, a weird old boomer lady who probably sleeps in the woods surrounded by fake crystals.

There is virtually no antisemitism on this forum.

People living in their own pro-Hamas/Palestinian social media tiktok bubbles don't even realize anymore that they are anti-semitic. But the outside world knows.
Who on here is an anti-Semite? Could we get some names?

Crickets...

I would say anyone supporting a ceasefire between Israel and Hamas is supporting an anti-Semitic (but, more broadly, also anti-Bedouin, anti-Druze, anti-Thai-foreign-worker, etc.) political platform. This is also true of supporting Palestinian liberationism more generally, if you think an independent Palestine should exist led by the current leading Palestinian political figures; the reason that supporting a ceasefire is bad is because it would strengthen Palestinian liberationism.

It is hard to say that all of these people are anti-Semites because on this forum most of the time their attitudes are better explained by ignorance than hatred. (Some of the time, as with yourself, they're literally Jews, which is pretty funny in a black comedy sort of way.)
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Vosem
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,641
United States


Political Matrix
E: 8.13, S: -6.09

« Reply #1 on: November 07, 2023, 11:43:25 PM »
« Edited: November 08, 2023, 12:04:32 AM by Vosem »

And certain folks keep telling me that if Israel didn't exist all the Jews would eventually be killed off in Holocaust 2.0 and I just don't buy that, sorry. So if my response seems a bit flippant, it's because I consider such a view insane.

That's not quite the claim. The claim is that if Palestinian liberationism wins that Jews will be killed off (together with others). Destroying the Palestinian movement is more important in this sense than preserving the Israeli state (particularly if you live outside Israel itself), much as destroying Nazism was more important than preserving the Second Polish Republic (...particularly if you lived outside the Second Polish Republic).

No ethnicity has a right to a country; there is no particular 'Jewish right to a state' or 'Palestinian right to a state'. Israel has the right to define itself as a Jewish state and take steps to preserve that definition, much as many other states and subnational entities define themselves in particular ethnic ways; but this flows from a right that states have, to determine within particular limits their ideologies, goals, and form of government, rather than some special privilege which accrues to Jews but not non-Jews. The idea that it cannot self-define as Jewish because a Jewish state would be inherently bad or unfair in some way really is anti-Jewish in a very narrow way (and I say this carefully, because I think the hatred from the Palestinian movement goes far beyond Jews, which is why I try to refrain from calling them anti-Semites), but I'm not sure that focusing on this is helpful, because it distracts from the broader horrors of the Palestinian movement.
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Vosem
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 15,641
United States


Political Matrix
E: 8.13, S: -6.09

« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2023, 12:15:20 AM »

However, not every Jew is as lucky as Canadian/American Jews are. A lot of Jews even today reside in far more hostile places. The USA doesn't have an automatic 'if you're a Jew you may immigrate here' policy (and I obviously wouldn't expect it to given it's not a Jewish country), so having a Jewish nation-state seems like the most reasonable scenario.

Between 1990 and 2012 particular religious groups -- including Jews, but also evangelical Christians and Baha'i people -- from particular countries really did get special privileges in immigration. While I need to read more about which parts of Jackson-Vanik were repealed under Obama, I believe that Jackson-Vanik and the Lautenberg amendment actually do still apply to Iran -- someone with better knowledge of immigration law than me can correct me if this is wrong or out of date -- so if someone you know belongs to particular Iranian religious minorities (and my understanding is Iran does have non-trivial numbers of Jews and Baha'i individuals, if not evangelical Christians), they do get special privileges in immigrating to the United States.
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