Should Islam have any role in the Iraqi constitution?

[The Duke]

Yes, because I don't think trying to turn Iraq into modern France will work.  Take it slow, but make sure there are no compromises on the important areas, like ensuring rights for minorities.

[The Duke]

The US should've installed an oligarchical governemnt ran by the Christian minority instead considering that Christians always run things better than Muslims and their governments are alway superior. Christians over Muslims, ALWAYS.

Hopefully if the Constitution does end up like that the 1-2% Christian minority starts up a new insurgency. I'd hate to see them suffer under Islamic tyranny like the ones in Lebanon or Sudan.

Right, because installing a minority Christian government wqorked for us in Vietnam.

[The Duke]

Because people in America are not the type who let their religion dictate their whole life.

Now? No. In the 1780s?

Given how staunchly Muslim the people are in the Middle East, I don't really see how you're going to get them to agree on a constitution that doesn't include Islam in at least some way.

so the non-Muslims should just get over it? Much like the Zimbabwean whites and black ethnicities persecuted by Mugabe should just get over Mugabe winning fair elections in 1980?

I thought the point of our being in the Middle East was to spread democracy (you know, the thing where the majority gets to say what happens), not Christianity.  We have gotten past the Crusades, haven't we?

Never said our goal was to spread Christianity. I'm not an eveangelist. But there is no reason we should make concessions to Islam that would harm Christians in any way. And then there's also the fact that Islam and democracy are not compatibile.

Here's an example: In 1992, an Islamist party called the Islamic Salvation Front (FIS in its French initials) surged in Algeria. When time for elections came, it became obvious they would win and seize control of the whole government. If this happened, Algeria would become a brutal theocratic state and haven for terrorists. It would be an utter disaster on the level of the Iranian Revolution.

So the military carried out a coup and canceled the elections. The FIS was stopped.

Was this wrong? Should they have just let democracy happen?

Are you seriously trying to compare Ayatollah Sistani to the FIS?

[The Duke]

Well, obviously not to such a large extent as the Muslims in the Middle East, given that they were fine with and even came up with the idea of keeping Christianity out of government.

or they had seen the rather nasty effects of mixing religion and government in Europe.

It hasn't been quite so good in the Middle East either.

If there's anything blatantly oppresive towards non-Muslims written write into the constitution, I could see it.  Right now we have no idea what it means to incorporate Islam into the constitution, however, and we're talking in a purely theoretical basis.

what about for example banning alcohol?

I
You said a couple of posts above that we should establish an oligarchy run by Christians.

Simply because that would be the most tolerant form of government, as long as they didn't force Muslims to drink alcohol or ban women from covering their heads.

And keep in mind, most people point toward Turkey as being a tolerant Muslim country, but the reason that is the case is after independence it was rather autocratically ran by Ataturk, who was very secular and probably agnostic. And he ran into quite some trouble when he legalized alcohol sales and ended repressive traditions toward women.

Did you see my point about Algeria 92 also?

You don't have a point about Algeria, since the SCIRI and Dawa don't advocate strict Sharia law as the basis for government in Iraq.

If Iraq bans alcohol sales, good.  Besides, America had prohibition not so long ago, that doesn't make us a facist state.

As for Ataturk.  You have repeatedly reminded us that Saddam, though autocratic, was secular.  This lays the same foundation for secular government in iraq as it did in Turkey, which I'm sure was part of the rationale for invading iraq to begin with, that they did not have a strong Islamist government or movement.