Norbert Hofer (FPÖ) to host US-Russia summit in Vienna if elected President (user search)
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  Norbert Hofer (FPÖ) to host US-Russia summit in Vienna if elected President (search mode)
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Author Topic: Norbert Hofer (FPÖ) to host US-Russia summit in Vienna if elected President  (Read 1140 times)
MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
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Posts: 57,380


« on: November 12, 2016, 01:31:10 PM »

Does he realize President of Austria doesn't have an actual power?

Wonderful. I look forward to renewed detante with Putin.

I wonder who are you going to throw under the bus? Would that be my folks? The Baltic Republics? Or maybe just the rest of Ukraine.

There is no comparision with 1970s Detente, which was a right and logic move, an appeasing Putin now.
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,380


« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2016, 02:08:14 PM »

Throw under the bus? Not Poland, we need Poland. You'll be fine.

Right, silly me. Mr. Trump likes his undocumented workers.

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Crimea had been part of Ukraine since the 50s, when Krustchev ceded it to the Ukrainian SSR. If there was a time to rectify this, it was when the USSR collapsed.

I was long convinced NATO serves no purpose anymore, but what happened in the East convinces me I was wrong.

The whole principle of peace in stability in Europe post-1945 was respect for existing borders.

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Weaking the EU is not really in U.S. interest.

Because Estonia is a pluralistic democracy and when Russia previously occupied the Baltic countries, they deported hundreds of thousands of people, killed thousands more, ensured ethnic Russians received preferential treatment to locals, and brutally suppressed any opposition?

Also it's naive to think if you "cede" Estonia to Putin he'd just say "OK, I'm really stopping now with other countries Smiley" Well, he can say that, but he proves himself not a trustworthy partner.
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,380


« Reply #2 on: November 12, 2016, 03:53:36 PM »

OK, so we should just ignore every single relevant development that happened during the 73 years the USSR existed? Why so modest? How about we ignore everything that changed since the Congress of Vienna.

Also, let's dispel with the fiction that standing your ground in international relations and honoring existing alliances will automatically led to the nuclear war Roll Eyes

Btw, you've been talking about inevitable collapse of Chinese economy. Do you have any idea about the real state of Russian economy?
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,380


« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2016, 06:06:00 AM »

It isn't naive because I don't care. I'm not dying for some Estonian. And of course, the USSR was not a legitimate successor to the Russian Empire and the transition of power in the Russian revolution, being by force, was illegitimate. There is no comparison to, say, our revolution. So any and all of the precedents set by the USSR are out the window.

Just curious, do you have a map somewhere of countries whose citizens you're willing to die for and countries you don't give a sh** about?

I just pictured La Fayette, Tadeusz Kościuszko, Comte de Rochambeau, Kazimierz Pułaski and Friedrich Wilhelm von Steuben all saying: "f**k this, why would I give a s**t about these colonist?"
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,380


« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2016, 09:21:42 AM »

the transition of power in the Russian revolution, being by force, was illegitimate. There is no comparison to, say, our revolution.

Jesus Christ, Sanchez.

I guess 70% of all developments in world's history should be considered illlegitimate and therefore ignorable.
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,380


« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2016, 12:23:20 PM »

The American Revolution was completely unjustified.

A bunch of terrorists who waged the war against their sovereign because they dislikes a tax.

Illegitimate - let's just declare the United States never legally happened Cool
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,380


« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2016, 02:16:53 PM »

the transition of power in the Russian revolution, being by force, was illegitimate. There is no comparison to, say, our revolution.

Jesus Christ, Sanchez.
Only legitimate transfers of power should be recognized. The American Revolution was one. The Glorious Revolution was another. The secession of the CSA can even be legally justified (though, of course, not nearly as much as the subsequent reconquest and repatriation by the Union). These were totally different animals compared to the Russian Revolution or the rise of the Nazi Party in Germany, where existing albeit flawed state structures were overthrown either by force or just general intimidation.

It isn't naive because I don't care. I'm not dying for some Estonian. And of course, the USSR was not a legitimate successor to the Russian Empire and the transition of power in the Russian revolution, being by force, was illegitimate. There is no comparison to, say, our revolution. So any and all of the precedents set by the USSR are out the window.

Just curious, do you have a map somewhere of countries whose citizens you're willing to die for and countries you don't give a sh** about?

I just pictured La Fayette, Tadeusz Kościuszko, Comte de Rochambeau, Kazimierz Pułaski and Friedrich Wilhelm von Steuben all saying: "f**k this, why would I give a s**t about these colonist?"
I didn't know Frederick the Great sent Prussian troops to die along with Colonel von Steuben to wage war against their continental ally Britain. That comparison makes total sense!

Comparision of British-Prussian relationship back then with U.S.-Russian now doesn't make much sense either.
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MASHED POTATOES. VOTE!
Kalwejt
Atlas Institution
*****
Posts: 57,380


« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2016, 02:18:48 PM »

I wonder who are you going to throw under the bus? Would that be my folks? The Baltic Republics? Or maybe just the rest of Ukraine.
I find it extremely unlikely that he wants any of these. At this point, the best he could get (and probably wants) would be recognition of the annexation of Crimea and re-absorption of the two secessionist republics on his terms.

Probably, but there are two troubling factors in play:

1. Putin makes mistakes like everyone else.
2. Putin may not be able to stop due due to internal factors.
 
Also, annexation is not the only way of taking over effective control.
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