Current Trump Press Conference: I hope Russia finds Hillary's emails

[Oakvale]

Not sure why people are talking about how this will poll or whatever when it's plain that electing Trump would be the greatest gift to Russian imperialism since Churchill and Roosevelt were duped at Yalta. Does that not matter?

I think he was joking. Just the press doesn't get it. Big Don has just a great sense of humor.

This sums it up.

I think that many of the conniptions that we are seeing here, as well as from those in the mainstream media, are a product of people who are genuinely disturbed by what Trump is doing. And it should be extremely disturbing for those of us who care about the quality of political discourse in this country.

The thing is, that does not mean that Trump is actually in cahoots with Putin. And when prospective members of what we might call the "Trumpenproletariat" hear accusations to that effect, they are not inclined to believe them. Instead, they interpret these warnings as disingenuous, and yet another reason to feel alienated from the mainstream politicians and media figures who espouse them.

We would be in a much less disturbing place as a country if Russian interference were the best explanation for Trump's success. What we have experienced over the past year, however, points to other factors. Besides, who would choose an actor as unpredictable, even irrational, as Trump is, as his pawn? Do we really think that Putin is capable of influencing him in a way that yields predictable benefits for him?

I don't think being disturbed about the bizarre Russian connection to Trump's inner campaign circle absolves him, the Republican Party or the American public of guilt for the Trump campaign.

Is Trump literally on the payroll of the Kremlin? Probably not. Why would they take the risk when he's going to do whatever they want anyway? But Russia clearly recognises that Trump is basically the kind of ignorant internet troll who thinks Putin is tough and macho, and to the extent that he has any beliefs about foreign policy they're manipulatable based on that.  I think it's fairly obvious that Manafort etc. have been steering him in this direction. As for unpredictability, sure, but as we've known for some time Putin's primarily concerned with weakening 'the West' above all else, and the election of Trump would achieve that in dramatic fashion. A human Brexit.

Remember that literally the only platform plank the Trump people edited - while letting the usual Christian right write the rest of of it freely - was about condemning Putin for Crimea.

[Oakvale]

Oh, you've finally seen the light, Oakvale? Did you ever apologize for supporting Drumpf for so long?

I would never sincerely have supported Trump, Tony. Yikes. I do think ironic Trump support was, at the time, largely justified given that it was funny to watch him humiliate Marco Rubio or whoever, as the "normal politician" portion of the RNC proved again. There's also something to be said for the idea that nominating Trump lays the Republican Party bare. They can't hide behind OPTIMISTIC SMILING MARCO or MODERATE JEB! this time.

But, yes, I wrote a very long mea culpa on Trump over on AAD a few months back. I think my main issue was a blindness, due to not living in the horrifying 24/7 US media environment, to the corrosive impact the Trump thing was having outside of politics.

e: That blindness was also partly wilful, probably. Hey, it was fun! Best not to think of the implications.

[Oakvale]

What your missing is that Trump doesn't need to be labeled as a Kremlin agent. Russia is unpopular as is Putin. Trump is clearly showing that he holds pro-Russian views. Trump may have tapped into alot of hidden sentiments in America, but I guarantee you pro-Russian will not be one of them.

This would be a great bit of political strategy if we had any indication that swing voters believe the accusations when they hear them. But we do not. On the other hand, this has become another opportunity for Trump's shills to bring Clinton's private e-mail server back under national media coverage, and in yet another context in which Clinton's surrogates are almost forcibly maneuvered into talking about it in a way that sounds dismissive and deflective.

(Does this actually hurt Clinton? I'm inclined to think that it does, given how poorly polls show her scoring on trustworthiness and accountability. Who knows, really, but I'm confident that it is, at least, not helpful.)

Then I believe your being deliberately obtuse.

Instead of trying to make others shut up, try to rebut. Can you post something longer than a sentence that says "you are wrong, I am right" for once this week? You can't be this dense surely?

This place has gone to hell. I don't exclude my own posts from this judgement.

[Oakvale]

I'm not suggesting that he's in cahoots with Putin. But what's clear is that Putin is backing him

No, it really isn't.

It depends what you mean by 'backing'. We can quibble about the extent of involvement. Surely it's evident that Putin would like Trump to win, no?

But, yes, I wrote a very long mea culpa on Trump over on AAD a few months back. I think my main issue was a blindness, due to not living in the horrifying 24/7 US media environment, to the corrosive impact the Trump thing was having outside of politics.

e: That blindness was also partly wilful, probably. Hey, it was fun! Best not to think of the implications.

Fair enough. As someone who might directly suffer from a Drumpf victory (far less seriously than most Americans, admittedly, but still), I accept your apology.

I'm glad to hear that.

[Oakvale]

But, yes, I wrote a very long mea culpa on Trump over on AAD a few months back. I think my main issue was a blindness, due to not living in the horrifying 24/7 US media environment, to the corrosive impact the Trump thing was having outside of politics.

e: That blindness was also partly wilful, probably. Hey, it was fun! Best not to think of the implications.

Fair enough. As someone who might directly suffer from a Drumpf victory (far less seriously than most Americans, admittedly, but still), I accept your apology.

I'm glad to hear that.

Just curious, have other "fellow travelers" recanted as well? I'd like to know which posters I can go back to valuing at least somewhat.

The only holdout I can think of is smilo, who I guess was sincere all along? I don't know if anyone else has apologised or whatever but ironic/ratfúcking Trump support is basically non-existent outside of Snowstalker etc I think (and even he's backed down in the last few weeks).

Oh, and Libertas but lol

[Oakvale]

So Trump called the line sarcastic this morning. That's probably because he was hemorrhaging Republican votes over it who were furious at the very suggestion of Russia attacking the US

Really weird that they'd be desperately spinning away this FIENDISH TRAP as a joke imo