Oakvale/Snowguy for Atlasia: Concession; Congratulations to Tmth and Dallasfan!

[Oakvale]

Hey everybody!

So, as you might have gathered from the thread title, I just a few minutes ago announced my intention to seek the Presidency of Atlasia next month. It's not a decision I take lightly, and I know some might feel it a little... audacious of me to be running for the nation's highest office as someone who's spent less time in the game than the other luminaries seeking the White House.

I wrestled with the idea for quite some time - up until literally a few days ago I was determined to remain as Governor until my term ended, declining to move on to the national stage. But Harold Macmillan's "events" have overtaken me - I realised that if there was ever a time to run, it was now.

We are lucky to have a great field of candidates, all of whom would, I genuinely believe, make capable and energetic Presidents. Tmthforu is someone who I've worked with closely as a fellow Governor, improving education and working together on many projects. Ben has long held my admiration for his sterling work as Secretary of External Affairs, and in his region. Marokai is an Atlasian institution with a record that speaks for itself.

I am proud to call all three friends, and I think Atlasia would be well served by whoever emerges triumphant.

So I'm not running because of the flaws of any other candidate. I'm running because, in some ways, I think the perspective of a relative newcomer may be just what we need to shake the game out of its recent stupor - I haven't been in the Senate for a hundred years, I haven't floated through dozens of Cabinet positions, true, but Atlasia needs - and you'll excuse the Kennedy cliché - vigour, and I think I can genuinely change the game for the better.

My goal in the Pacific has been to, in the words of that old soundbite, breath new life into old institutions. The problem with Atlasia is fundamentally structural - the game could easily be adpated into some nerdier version of The Wire - and we need radical restructuring of our institutional sacred cows. Take a look at my record as Governor, and you might not agree with everything I've done, but I think the fact that I've tried to make things a bit more exciting reflects well on my attitude towards executive office.

I've carved a reputation as a consensus builder in the Pacific, and that's the same kind of spirit I'd bring to the Oval Office - I may have vetoed a bill restricting gun rights, but I also threatened to the same to one which would have restricted a woman's right to choose. I'm no dogmatic partisan. If anyone has a good idea, I'll listen. I don't care if you're Xahar or Bgwah, Teddy or Winston, Batman or Rob-- uh, well, you get the idea.

I'm not looking for knee-jerk solutions, though - reform for the sake of reform ain't reform, after all. Atlasia's illness can't be solved by meandering gestures - term limits are great in theory, for example, but I'm inclined to be more in favour of them for executive offices than legislative ones - I'd back (consecutive) limits for the Presidency, but introducing them to the Senate would deprive us of genuinely great Senators like North Carolina Yankee.

A word to my friends - and there are many - in the United Democratic Left: I'm not your enemy. There was a time when I believed that a "united" left would be the best option for Atlasia. But think about that for a moment - what would this election be? A UDL/JCP (or vice versa) ticket would almost certainly easily defeat the Right's candidate. Atlasia's supposed to be an election simulation, first and foremost, and when the elections are boring the game is, too.

And hey, with so many capable candidates, this election looks to be the most interesting in ages - no landslides this time!

So I'm running for the Presidency. I don't expect a whole lot of prized endorsements, or a swathe of zombie voters backing me - this is a race, and it's not going to be easy. But I do think I can win it, with your help.

Last but not least, I want to thank my friend Snowguy for joining me on the ticket.

Both as a Senator and in all aspects of the game, Snowy has always put policy above politics - he could have easily joined the then-new UDL to save his seat in the Midwest, for example, but he didn't pay any mind to the silly partisan bickering - and, on a personal level, he's one of the most down-to-earth, likeable guys you could come across in a game that's often bitter and acrimonious. I'm honoured that he's running with me as my Vice-Presidential running mate, and I know he'll make a great partner if I'm elected President next month.

Oh, and, don't worry, guys, the completed draft of my comprehensive platform for game reform will be posted in this thread in a day or so.

Thanks, and I hope you've all had a great start to the year,

Oakvale

[Oakvale]

[reserved for posting of my communist manifesto platform]

[Oakvale]

Great speech, Mr. Oak Tree! I wish you the best of luck in this race.

Thanks! I wish you luck, too - although not too much.

[Oakvale]

*sits in corner, drinking*

EDIT: Incidentally, is the term "it's only a game" too much of a cliché to be used unironically?

[Oakvale]

A quick response to M's above tirade -

I was always pretty open - as I recall, and you correct me if I'm wrong on this - that I'd back Tmth for President - he being a friend of mine, and someone I work well with - in most circumstances. Stunningly, these circumstances don't include me being an opposing ticket. Tmth's okay with it, because he probably realises that there's not a whole lot of point getting worked up about what's essentially an occasionally amusing game on the internet.

When Marokai asked me to join him on the ticket after some other JCPers had turned him down, my initial reaction was to decline such - I didn't especially want to be Vice-President, after all. But, amongst other people, people I respect like Badger convinced me to agree to join Marokai's campaign. I did this sincerely, and, whatever he wants to believe, had no ulterior motives - I planned to, hopefully, get elected VP and then retire, leaving hilarious drama like the above behind me.

I changed my mind, though, plain and simple. There's not a big conspiracy, or some kind of horrible personality flaw on my part. It's a lame reason, yes - although I will note that I told Marokai as soon as possible, so as not to embarass his campaign, ironically enough - but it's what happened. I didn't want to be Vice-President - or, more accurately, I didn't know what I wanted. It would take me some serious thinking to decide if I wanted to run for anything in February, and I knew deciding at the last minute wasn't viable, so I bowed out, quietly and, I hope, graciously.

Incidentally, Badger had talked me into "uniting" the left as the token JCP candidate, but to be totally honest I didn't really buy it. Although I did say so to Archangel, bgwah, Snowy, and many others - surely this proves I wasn't being insincere about joinig Marokai's campaign? They were rationalizations, yes, but I did try to stick to them.

I also don't much care about the fact that this is a JCP ticket, but isn't one of the supposed points of the UDL to create the (much-needed) "competition" inside the "left"? Shouldn't this be exactly what the UDL wants? The idea that I'm some uber-partisan is nonsense. Nonsense.

This is a sad state of affarirs. Marokai isn't exactly my biggest fan at the moment, and that's fine, but I really do have a lot of time for him. When people fall out over a silly internet game, I think that's a shame. I'm a reasonable man, and so I don't expect Marokai and I to reconcile soon, but I do hope it will happen in the future. All this bulls**t is just that.

Last but not least, here's the "too long, didn't read version" -
I was going to back Tmth. Then I joined a ticket. Tmth understood, after I explained my mindest.

The ticket in question was Marokai's. After some thinking, I decided I didn't much want to be VP. Feeling genuinely bad, I told Marokai as soon as possible, and quietly started mulling over my options.

I decided to give the "being President" thing a try. If nothing else, the election will actually be interesting.

So, in short, sorry Marokai, but I think you're making a mountain out of the proverbial molehill. I hope we can put this behind us soon - it is, after all, just a game.

EDIT: Kal, you might want to at least get my spin on the whole mess before deciding such. That said, that's your choice.

 I'm disappointed to lose your vote, but politics, even virtual politics, is a nasty business. I understand.

[Oakvale]

Perhaps you should be more consequential?

Take me for example, I wasn't happy to become Vice President, I wasn't happy to turn down my almost achieved greatest Atlasian ambition: working in the Senate, but hell, Fritz asked me, I agreed to join him and I kept my commitment, despite the fact I never feel good as Vice President.

How the hell am I supposed to take seriously, especially as a potential President, a guy who don't know what does he want and is changing his mind frequently? I accept, ugh, I withdraw, now something else

We're different people, I guess. Another lame answer, but the best one. When this game stops being fun, there's no point in playing, right?

In other words, I'm not going to do a job I won't have much of a contribution to make in. Hell, didn't you come close to resigning recently? If you have a problem with me changing my mind, that's fine. I'm only human, as they say.

Marokai:

I don't know what Snowy said about the JCP or whatever, that's his opinion, not mine, so I can't comment on that. For my part, I wouldn't have bothered joining a ticket that's JCP for the sake of there being a JCP ticket - what'd be the point? Also, threatening partisan statements? If you'll pardon the 'net lingo, "lul wut"?

I also take some issue with the notion that I've "broken promises" - maybe I'm splitting hairs, but doesn't this imply that I've been sneakily doing so out of malice or some bizzzare ulterior motive? As opposed to a genuine change of heart... or circumstances. I told Tmth that I'd back him unless certain candidates ran, for example. I don't think I would have helped your ticket much by sticking on it without the drive or energy needed for a succesful campaign or administration. I can't speak for Snowguy, but I very much doubt he flat-out lied to you out of some personal spite, as you seem to think...

Also, Xahar - well, uh, it's something to do, at least. Yikes.

[Oakvale]

Perhaps you should be more consequential?

Take me for example, I wasn't happy to become Vice President, I wasn't happy to turn down my almost achieved greatest Atlasian ambition: working in the Senate, but hell, Fritz asked me, I agreed to join him and I kept my commitment, despite the fact I never feel good as Vice President.

How the hell am I supposed to take seriously, especially as a potential President, a guy who don't know what does he want and is changing his mind frequently? I accept, ugh, I withdraw, now something else

We're different people, I guess. Another lame answer, but the best one. When this game stops being fun, there's no point in playing, right?

In other words, I'm not going to do a job I won't have much of a contribution to make in. Hell, didn't you come close to resigning recently? If you have a problem with me changing my mind, that's fine. I'm only human, as they say.

Sure, but your frequent and nervous "mind changing" makes me not trust you as potential President.

I guess I prefer actually solid candidates.

Uh, okay. Sorry to hear it, but  you've made your mind up. Vote your conscience. *shrug*

[Oakvale]

But let's not pretend to be nice and holier than thou, here.

That is some weapons grade irony right there.

Apologies for using the Libertas emoticon.

[Oakvale]

Oh drama!

Indeed. Leaving aside the drama - loathe as I am to have my character attacked in such a degrading fashion- I'd like to thank President Fritz for his endorsement.

Fritz's time in office has befitted a statesman, and I'd be proud to do as good a job as he's done. While real life, as it often does, intruded on occasion, he's done us proud.

He also deserves kudos for paying attention to poor Badger.

[Oakvale]

I'm sure we can rustle up some marijuana for the libertarians.

[Oakvale]

I see Marokai's posting of private conversations between me and him are now gone. 

Yeah, I saw that. I didn't point it out though, since I think he made the right decision by deleting the post...

[Oakvale]

I think we can all put aside our differences and agree that, if nothing else, the five-way debate will be fantastic.

[Oakvale]

Oakvale, can you assure us, giving your recent record of lack of consistency in making decisions, you won't, if elected, woke up one day and think "hey, I don't want this stress, I'm resigning"?

Hey, I'd be fine with President Snowguy. 

I've changed my mind once, even using M's above chronology, which was my decision to leave his ticket. I didn't bail on Tmth - it was always clear that I'd back certain candidates - presumably me included - over him, and he can attest to that. He's still likely to get my second preference, incidentally.

If you're referring to the decision to run, that was something I gradually decided upon over the last week or so. Prior to that, I was pretty wary of the idea of holding any national office...

Hope that helps.

TPTTAA:
Oakvale. Given what's come out in the recent "brawl" between you and Marokai, do you feel you are qualified to be President?

(nothing personal)

I think so, given that Marokai's histrionics aren't especially relevant to anything much. I think I'd do a decent job as President, after all, and surely that's as qualified as someone gets in Atlasia.

I'd also like to ask what obscure point Marokai's trying to make by putting Fritz and I's endorsements of Purple State in his signature. I enthusiastically supported PS, and have no regrets in doing so.

[Oakvale]

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Namely?

[Oakvale]

(Hopefully) easing into a truce with Marokai and putting the entertaining drama behind us, I'll move on to stuff that matters.

With that in mind, I'll be rolling out my platform starting tomorrow.

EDIT: Also, I knocked up a little banner. Victory is now inevitable. Obviously.

[Oakvale]

Just an FYI - internet access has been unexpectedly sporadic in the last day or so... will have my "half" of the platform up tomorrow.

I also second both of belgian's points.

[Oakvale]

Hey everybody!

Irritating internet outages and, more to the point, a rather nasty bug have conspired to keep me away from my campaign as of late, but I've struggled out of bed to let you all know I'm still alive and to take part in the debate.

I'll knock off my opening statement ASAP, and, hopefully, get most of my answers in through Saturday and Sunday, when I'll presumably be in somewhat better shape.

Oh, and I realise that taking part in Atlasia while ill arguably qualifies as Taking The Game Too Seriously, but hey.

Rest assured that this temporary illness will not keep me from the important work of this drama-spewing, often hilarious campaign for long. I should be back to normal by Monday or so, assuming the doctor didn't slip me some kind of placebo.

[Oakvale]

You should all tune into the debate between Marokai, Ben, Tmth and I.

It's pleasantly interesting so far.

[Oakvale]

Good timing, I've just returned from my unfortunate flu-induced hiatus, and, being on enough medicine to kill a horse, am able to continue my campaign.

I'll post my response to the debate questions I missed shortly.

[Oakvale]

My delayed response to the debate questions I missed due to being sick for a few days -

What is your current opinion of the financial regulations the Federal Government currently has for corporations?  Is it fine as it is or should it be changed?  How and Why?

From what I can tell from quickly scanning the wiki, there aren't any major problems with the regulations on corporations we've got in Atlasia. They seem to be more serviceable those in the real-world United States, at least. I second Tmth and Marokai in advocating the closing of tax loopholes for corporations - it's a no-brainer, obviously, but bears repeating.

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Education is the obvious one to avoid cutting, it being arguably the most important long-term function of government.

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I'm going to disagree with my fellow lefty Marokai here, and admit, somewhat sheepishly, that I'd actually favour the privatization of the postal service.

*hide from angry mob*

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Apparently - I'm a strong supporter of universal healthcare, and the system as stands puts most of those in other developed countries to shame. People still have the option to go private if they so wish, which I also support.

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My philosophy on this can be summed up as "free trade is good". While trading with nations such as China might not be an ideal situation, decreasing or even stopping such would be just plain silly. Economics does not work that way, etc, etc.

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Does anyone know the current state of the military? I don't think it's crazy to suggest that Atlasia seems like the kind of place where cutting defense sending is one of the go-to solutions when trying to find the cash for a particularly juicy bit of legislation.

If possible, I'd like to see a summary of the status of Atlasia's current defense spending - as I've mentioned before, most legislation (if not all) disappears into a black hole and is never heard from again. Hell, defense spending is probably in the negative figures at this point.

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As Governor, I cut business taxes to give companies in the region an incentive to hire. I've said this again and again - burning a deficit is acceptable, even necessary to get out of the kind of economic apocalypse we're facing. I'd also advocate reducing the middle-class tax rate from 25% to a less burdensome 21% for the duration of the current mess.

As for churches - my instinct is to oppose the taxation thereof. I'd make an exception for churches that are more business than religious institution - the odious "megachurches" spring to mind - and for those that peddle political bile from the puplit or what have you.

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This is a pet issue of mine, and one I've been very engaged in as Governor. My overbearing focus in the Pacific's requests for the economic stimulus act was on "green" and renewable energy, and I was an active member of the Green Lobby when Barnes was still around.

To answer the question (), yes, I think the green sector could be a "lifesaver" for the economy. It's the very definition of a growth industry, and I think the federal government should be heavily involved in providing generous incentives for businesses to innovate in order to create more efficient cars, solar panels and so on.

It's somewhat controversial as to whether it's "green" or not, but I'm a huge proponent of nuclear power, which is, IMO, the only real solution to the energy crisis.

Also, because I have to throw it in somewhere - rural broadband! Rural broadband!

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Yes. Well, sort of. I think anyone would concede that a crisis of this magnitude is unlikely to be resolved in a single term. At the very least, I think we can prevent the situation from getting any worse  - I'd consider that a "win", if nothing else. It's evident, though, that it will take a very long time indeed for substantial growth and, most of all, jobs to return.

It's bleak, but that's the way it is.

[Oakvale]

Atlasia has been mostly an isolationist state for it's existence.  Do you support the status quo foreign policy?  Would you like to see Atlasia more interventionist in foreign affairs?

It depends what you mean. To get a possible interpretation out of the way, I'm adamantly opposed to what some people have suggested in the past - interacting with other political 'games'. It'd be an utter mess, and, plus, I rather like having the simulation as a feature of the forum rather than a seperate, impersonal clusterf***.

Assuming you're referring to "in game" geopolitics, I'm at heart an internationalist - or an interventionist, if you prefer. To briefly cover the inevitable questions about military intervention - I have no qualms about taking military action against rogue nations that pose a  threat, or those that harbor terrorists. I'm not some Cheneyite neoconservative lunatic, but I think it's sensible to pursue a realistic foreign policy - not every nation is necessarily our friend, after all.

As I mentioned earlier in the debate, Atlasia really does need two GMs - and I' m glad to see the candidates all more or less agree on this. Foreign policy is almost always ignored - we're an introspective, domestic nation, but I want to change that. Under my administration, the Secretary of External Affairs will be a vital and visible part of government, not an impotent job that nobody but the occasional newspaper writer notices. A dedicated "foreign policy GM", working in tandem with the regular old economic/social/domestic/whatever GM is the obvious solution to the servere lack of international issues in the game - one thing I've learned in my time in office is that the way to create activity and interest is to give government positions clear, precise and focused goals, hence a second GM.

I've even got a couple names who'd be a perfect fit for the new post.

[Oakvale]

We'll move on then with three questions, due by 6 PM:
Do you believe that out-of-site membership should be encouraged (as in branching out to other political sims and inviting them to join us)?

No, I'm afraid I don't, and it's something I've often argued against as JCP whip, despite calls from some quarters to do just that. It sounds like a good idea in practice, but, as Marokai deftly pointed out, it's just too susceptible to bias - a left-wing member is, naturally, going to search for new members on the Democratic Underground, not the Free Republic. To use an exaggerated example.

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As I said in my opening remarks, my proposal is for two and a half GMs, so to speak - one for domestic affairs, one for foreign affairs, and a secondary domestic GM who'd help out the 'main' domestic moderator, focusing on regional issues. As you might be able to tell, this is something close to my heart as a Governor. I'm sure Tmth can relate.

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The game thrives on conflict, what can I say? I think the growth of new parties, and of the RPP, is ultimately a positive thing. It shakes things up a bit! Some of the personal drama has been unfortunate, but that seems to have been aired out for now.




Right, I think I've covered all the questions I missed - if I've overlooked one, let me know and I'll address it as soon as I can. Apologies again for my absence - influenza conspired to make taking part in the latter half of the debate rather difficult.

I hope you'll all excuse my posting of a short closing statement in the thread.

[Oakvale]

And, last but not least, my closing statement -

I too realize that the debate is over, but I hope it won't be too much trouble if I provide a brief closing statement before the switched-off cameras and empty seats.

First and foremost, thanks to Archangel for hosting this debate. It's certainly been one of the more interesting discussions I've partaken in recently.

While I unfortunately missed the second half of this genuinely interesting and engaging debate due to falling ill, I enjoyed arguing and, on occasion, agreeing with my three opponents - it shows that, if you'll excuse the massive cliché, what unites us is stronger than what divides us. Most obviously, we all agree that a second GM is needed to draw further attention to the storylines that supposedly run the game. We may differ on the details, but the fundamental is an accepted truth.

Whoever wins in Febuary, myself, Tmth, Marokai or Ben, this debate has made me hopeful that Atlasia will be better off for it. We're not going to get saddled with an inactive or incompetent administration, and I think that's something to be glad for.

I hope you've all got a sense of how I'd govern, and what my policies would be as President. The brief flash of drama we had the other week is, thankfully, fading, and it's nice to see we're focusing on what the election should be about. If elected, I will strive day and night (well, day) to shake some life into Atlasia's creaking, dusty institutions. If there's one thing I've learned as Governor, it's that fundamental change requires changing the fundamentals. [1] That's what I propose to do.

Without further ado, I'll get off my soapbox. Vote Oakvale/Snowguy.

Thank you.


[1] Sorry.


PS: Yes, Badger, you'd still have a job.

PPS: You can read my responses to the questions I missed here, here, and here.

Now back to regular campaigning.

[Oakvale]

You should all take a look at the Vice-Presidential debate, recently concluded, where Snowguy emerged as the clear victor.

[Oakvale]

Due to the most recent developments, I'd like everyone interested to sign below this.

1. Regardless of a party affiliation, all members of the Atlasia left are interested primarily in working for a common values and causes.
2. Regardless of an electoral campaign, we should think about preserving a cooperation between us.
3. We should help fellow left members to become relevant in Atlasia politics.
4. Where it's possible, we all should rally around fellow leftist candidates and when there are more candidates, we should give our next preferences to fellow leftists.

x Kalwejt

Who else?

I'd suggest all in the UDL and JCP sign on to Kal's pledge.