France, as understood by a Frenchman (user search)
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  France, as understood by a Frenchman (search mode)
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Author Topic: France, as understood by a Frenchman  (Read 2470 times)
Umengus
Sr. Member
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Posts: 2,493
Belgium


« on: July 14, 2004, 06:29:50 AM »

I promise, this will be the last of my general article posts for a while. I just thought that the general politics discussion here had gotten a mite stale since the Edwards VP disappointment.

Anyhow, here's the link:
http://www.understandfrance.org/Sommaire.html

It's more of a search-and-destroy site than an actual article, but it's nonetheless fascinating. Highlights:

(1) French secularism--since 1789 generally, but 1905 by law, France has been an atheistic nation

"...in France, you do not mix religion and society : it is a private domain and no candidate for any public function would ever mention his religious belief, the name of God, etc ; it is absolutely unthinkable that a French president would express his religious beliefs the way US presidents do (particularly George W. Bush) ; at social occasions (dinner party, etc..), it would be considered rude to start a discussion about God and religion, unless a very light and careful one ; the role of the church in social life is extremely limited compared to the U.S.A"

I'm not particularly religious myself, but being surrounded by unbelievers in anything is intensely distressing.

(2) On French Anti-Americanism

"Nevertheless, it is a fact that there is a long tradition of (political) anti-Americanism, especially in the political left wing in Europe (see below and bibliography), the very symbol of it being the magazine Le Monde Diplomatique. It is also a fact that in France, as in other European countries, the words associated with America are not always positive: see a poll. Roger (see below) explains that since the 19th century, Anti-américanism has been a value shared by the whole French society, the only area of consensus between left and right.
But do not take it personally and don't fear any situation where you would be the victim of anti-Americanism : American tourist are never ill-treated and everybody will be friendly with you and, in France, in any poll on " What people do you like the most ", America always ranks #1 or #2... Read a letter about it."

In other words, we Americans should be grateful that a visit to Paris will not include an empty bottle smashed against our skulls...

(3) Americans the French 'admire'

The neo-populists " : Michael Moore (with his picture on the cover) & Jim Hightower
" The joker " : Howard Dean
" The radicals " : Barbara Ehrenreich & Ralph Nader
" The subversives " : Naomi Klein, Trey Parker & Matt Stone
" The new economists " : Paul Krugman
" The cyber-anarchists " : Elie Pariser & Richard Stallman
" The alternatives " : Lori Wallach & Jeremy Rifkin
" The new feminists " : Catherine MacKinnon & Gayle Rubin
" The moralists " : Alfred Ross & Barry Lynn
" The dissidents " : Mitchell Cohen, Michael Walzer, John Podesta & Bob Boorstin
" The Culture rebels " : Sean Penn, Don DeLillo, Chuck Palahniuk, Jay McInerney, Bret Easton Ellis, Dave Eggers, Nan Goldin, R.L.Burnside, Ani DiFranco, Marilyn Manson & Eminem

In other words, they love Americans who share the same psycopathic resentment of the US as the French themselves do. Interestingly, though, no one in France despises--not merely dislikes or lampoons or condescends--their own country in similar fashion.
 
Let me say this much: for some peculiar reason, only the 'Anglo-Saxon' countries (US, UK, Australia, most especially Canada and NZ), particularly the liberal-left political wings thereof, have the capacity for national self-loathing necessary to produce a Michael Moore or a John Pilger. I still haven't found a satisfactory explanation for that observation.









1)France is not a atheistic nation. Majority of french are catholics, "without religion" or muslims (unfortunalty...). And to be an atheistic nation, the french constitution must say that God doesn't exist and it's not the case. And I'm very happy that the role of church in the social life is very limited.

2)Anti-americanism in France? lots of pundits confound anti-americanism and anti-bushism. France, and Europa, hates Bush and his policy. For us, there is a big difference between Bush and amerian people. Consequently, you can hate Bush but like America people. I'm a reader of "le monde diplomatique" and it's exactly: it hates Bush but not america. It's a alter-mondialist magazine (+- 250 000).

3) The only american noted in the list and that french people knows is Michael Moore. And as in USA or UK, his film is a sucess. For the rest of the list, sorry but French people doens't know
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