Are IQ tests relevant and or meaningful? (user search)
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  Are IQ tests relevant and or meaningful? (search mode)
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Author Topic: Are IQ tests relevant and or meaningful?  (Read 14806 times)
pbrower2a
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« on: May 10, 2013, 10:13:43 PM »
« edited: May 11, 2013, 03:14:35 PM by pbrower2a »

(I quote an email that a scientist (Dr. Van Arsdale) sent me in this post quite a bit, so I'm just crediting him here.)



Now, from my perspective, IQ tests are meaningful to an extent, but I think scientists like J. Philippe Rushton and Charles Murray have been misleading people on this for far too long.

The short answer to your question is: no, IQ tests do not measure "intelligence."  Intelligence has an ontological reality, certainly, but in practice, intelligence is inevitably epistemologically defined. Arthur Jensen and Rushton's 'g factor', for example, is merely a statistical construction based on standardized test results.  It exists, but its existence is not necessarily connected with biology in any meaningful way.

In regards to race, to get big, consistent differences across races you'd need to have allelic variants with really large effect size. You would essentially need to prove that the complex admixture of genes for intelligence haven't been acquired by non-Eurasian/Jewish populations, when in fact, lots of genes had been admixed INTO those populations for the past 8,000 years.  Keep in mind that while we've found some genes for IQ, we're still a long way from mapping the human brain, so no one with full confidence should claim that intelligence genes are distributed discriminately.  Also, given the really large number of genes that must inevitably be involved with the varying complex forms of intelligence that exist, unique small effect variants would simply be swamped in the polygenic nature of the phenotype.

We also have a wealth of evidence that intelligence is highly malleable to a multitude of environmental factors; not just genetic.

In short, the claim that there are innate differences in "intelligence" between biological "races" is, quite simply, an absurd, biased interpretation of data.  This myth has been debunked many times, and the Heritage Foundation was doing itself a favor by distancing itself from this pseudoscience.

IQ is mutable. Downward mutability has possible causes in heavy-metal pollution (the poor experience more pollution because they are more likely to live near smelters and other dirty industries), trauma from near-drowning to head injuries, and of course unstimulating environments. IQ might be mutable upward because of experiences, which might not be as significant as trauma and poisoning from pollutants.  If that has connections to ethnicity, then such may manifest itself in 'racial' differences that become proxies for poverty.

Some people are just simply better at raising their kids to compete intellectually. Do children learn to trust or distrust well-intentioned authority such as school teachers? That may be the difference between kids learning in school and getting little from it. But such depends upon parents being trustworthy.

Is it meaningful? People with below-average IQ are unlikely to get much out of matriculation in college. (Of course, people with bad study habits would get little out of a college education, too). One fast-food company that I heard of in a business management class gives a basic IQ test to people applying for jobs as fast-food location managers. The optimal IQ for an applicant was about 90, and an IQ much above that indicated on the whole poor matches for the job.

OK, so the work isn't comparable to being the director of a scientific research institute.  Below 90 one has people who can't cope with the rigid rules and the paperwork. Around 90, rigid rules fit one well, and the paperwork is something of a challenge. In view of the sorts of people who remain workers in such a place for an extended time (dullards), someone with an IQ near 90 can better relate. Someone with an IQ in the 120s might learn the routines quickly but would see the job only as a stepping-stone to something more intellectually-satisfying.  People like challenges that validate themselves.

There is an optimal IQ for just about any job. For a lumberjack the level might be low because someone who thinks too much might get excessively cautious for the job description. Assembly-line work is far more a matter of hand speed than a deft mind, and a person who does such a job whose mind is working on something other than the repetitive work of feeding a punch press is easily distracted.  A house-painter is near average because although the painting is easy, estimating amounts of paint and calculating costs requires some mathematical sophistication; besides, one needs to manage one's time on the job. Physician, attorney, research scientist, accountant, engineer? You get the general idea.    
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #1 on: May 11, 2013, 05:51:03 PM »

They obviously can't test for motivation, sobriety, personal characteristics (ruthlessness is an asset in many jobs), or connections to the Right People. In jobs requiring the exercise of discretion, IQ might have relevance. For a professional athlete it might indicate who can be a team player, which is especially important in the execution of complex plays.

Yes, I would rather hire a salesperson with a cheerful disposition and a proclivity to take care of appearance -- neither of which has appreciable connection to IQ -- than someone with a high IQ who lives on an emotional rollercoaster and might occasionally appear disheveled. .
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #2 on: May 20, 2013, 09:18:18 PM »

As far as race and IQ are concerned I would post a couple of simple maps/graphs



Hard to take a test if you can't read:



oh and this map is similar too i'm sure it's a coincidence though and i really doubt there's any proven correlation between childhood malaria and lifetime educational achievement or anything




Good one. The ethnic mixture in the USA is closer to that of Brazil than to those of Argentina and Uruguay, yet the US is closer to either Argentina or Uruguay in the  'IQ' measure. (OK, American blacks may be "whiter" than Brazilian blacks, but that shouldn't be much of a problem).

Illiteracy and malaria closely relate to the weakness of the public sector. If one is a black American one is highly unlikely to be illiterate or ever get malaria in childhood. Although people may have some idea that constraining the public sector is a good idea, constraining it to the point that people go illiterate or die of infectious (but preventable) diseases is a horrible idea. Illiteracy obviously cuts into the ability of people to learn -- and effective education increases intellectual growth. I can't say that malaria retards leaning as much as does exposure to lead, but I would suppose that a political order that can't fund effective sanitation can't fund education well.   
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2013, 03:44:47 PM »

Denial of American Miscegnation has been one of the cornerstones of many, many schools of American history.

...and at what point do "white" genes that define any 'racial' difference in intelligence overpower those of "black" genes? Dark skin color is a dominant trait, but as we all know, skin is not where IQ lies.

The raw truth is that about everyone descended from African slaves in America is some part white. On Who Do You Think You Are the retired football star Emmett Smith was surprised that he was just under one-eighth white, and the genealogist told him upon showing the results of the DNA test that African-Americans were almost never less "white" than he.
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2018, 05:59:21 PM »

As far as race and IQ are concerned I would post a couple of simple maps/graphs



Hard to take a test if you can't read:



oh and this map is similar too i'm sure it's a coincidence though and i really doubt there's any proven correlation between childhood malaria and lifetime educational achievement or anything




So some countries invest heavily in elementary education (where children typically learn to read) and some don't.  Not only is it hard to take any test if one can't read -- it is practically impossible to design a relevant IQ test for the illiterate. Poverty? It certainly does not help. As is often said in America -- if you want to know what a 'good' statistic is in America, then  look for anything at which Mississippi is unusually high or low -- and that is a statistic to avoid.

It's hard to see how malaria is a good proxy for intelligence; it is a good proxy for malnutrition. That would be enough to distinguish North Korea from South Korea.

If it is race -- Brazil has a high percentage of people of African origin, but Brazil is nearly average.
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pbrower2a
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« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2018, 06:02:23 PM »

If there is a correlation between wealth and IQ then I think that further discredits IQ tests. No genuinely intelligent person wants to be wealthy.

Genuinely intelligent people don't need to be wealthy. They prefer to be upper-middle-class and are typically too busy doing something interesting to do conspicuous consumption.  
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