"The Marvels" on pace to be the MCU's first massive bomb

[Landslide Lyndon]

If the movie isn't good then so be it. The only thing that will anger me is that all the racist incel losers and the youtube troglodytes like Nerdrotic and Ryan Kinell who prey on them will never stop bragging about "go woke, go broke" and that only movies with white dudes as leads can be good and financially successful.

[Landslide Lyndon]

If the movie isn't good then so be it. The only thing that will anger me is that all the racist incel losers and the youtube troglodytes like Nerdrotic and Ryan Kinell who prey on them will never stop bragging about "go woke, go broke" and that only movies with white dudes as leads can be good and financially successful.

Now that, I don't get. This year, we had Barbie, and even if we limit ourselves to superhero movies, the Spider-Verse films literally had an Afro-Latino protagonist (and a trans deuteragonist don't @ me) and so far have made a billion. And sure, maybe Spider-Man is the exception that proves the rule, but The Marvels isn't going to flop because Brie Larson has the woke mind virus; if it flops, it'll be because the MCU has been going on five years too long.

I still laugh every time I think about Critical Drinker's Barbie video where he warned parents not to let their little girls watch it because when they grow up they will become "misandric psychopathic killers".

   

[Landslide Lyndon]

Seeing reports from box office nerds that this has the potential to literally be the biggest box office bomb of all-time. Even worse than Indy 5.

Uh, have you heard of "Heaven's Gate"?
"Cutthroat Island"?
"Ishtar"?

[Landslide Lyndon]

Seeing reports from box office nerds that this has the potential to literally be the biggest box office bomb of all-time. Even worse than Indy 5.

Uh, have you heard of "Heaven's Gate"?
"Cutthroat Island"?
"Ishtar"?

None of those lost as much money as this will. That’s how a bomb is defined. A film can make less money but if it has a lower budget, it won@5 bomb as hard as a huge budget film that flops.

Heaven's Gate literally bankrupted one of Hollywood's oldest and most renowned studios.
It is until today the definition of a box office bomb and perhaps the most infamous movie of all time.

(It's also pretty good if you aren't intimidated by its runtime and sit down to watch it)

[Landslide Lyndon]

They're losing hundreds of millions of dollars. I am actually what would presumably be one of Marvel's target demographics, not that I have ever liked their movies, but I don't even know who they are even trying to appeal to now.

The only MCU movie to lose money under normal circumstances (not released during the pandemic) is Ant-Man 3. Everything else was profitable. Some of you people must learn the difference between one movie underperforming at the box office and being a bomb.

[Landslide Lyndon]

They're losing hundreds of millions of dollars. I am actually what would presumably be one of Marvel's target demographics, not that I have ever liked their movies, but I don't even know who they are even trying to appeal to now.

The only MCU movie to lose money under normal circumstances (not released during the pandemic) is Ant-Man 3. Everything else was profitable. Some of you people must learn the difference between one movie underperforming at the box office and being a bomb.

I think almost every superhero movie except for Spiderman and Batman post-pandemic were flops. Maybe that Sam Raimi Dr. Strange movie made money.

Of course it made money, it grossed almost a billion despite the fact that it wasn't screened in China.

[Landslide Lyndon]

They're losing hundreds of millions of dollars. I am actually what would presumably be one of Marvel's target demographics, not that I have ever liked their movies, but I don't even know who they are even trying to appeal to now.

The only MCU movie to lose money under normal circumstances (not released during the pandemic) is Ant-Man 3. Everything else was profitable. Some of you people must learn the difference between one movie underperforming at the box office and being a bomb.

This one is, again, about to literally be potentially the biggest bomb of all-time in terms of dollars lost, topping Disney's own John Carter and The Lone Ranger, two disasters from the early 2010s. Let alone this year's Dial of Destiny and The Flash.

This is not just me saying this, this is the forecast from box office experts based on hard data that's being confirmed now that the movie's been released.

Some people must learn what the definition of what a "bomb" is and stop being so f--king unwarrantedly smug when you're objectively wrong.

I don't understand why you are getting so worked up for my objectively true answer to another poster. I haven't a crystal ball to see the future, like you obviously, so allow me to judge the Marvels' box office after the movie gets released and not before.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Disney's only real success this year is the Guardians of the Galaxy sequel, and even that arguably underperformed by only matching its predecessor's gross, which means it made less adjusted for inflation. Every other movie from all their studios -- the massive disaster that was Indy 5, the failed to break even Little Mermaid remake and Pixar movie Elemental, the previous MCU movie Ant-Man -- they all flopped. This one and Indy are the big BOMBS though. Oh along with that Haunted Mansion movie I almost forgot existed already.

Elemental DEFINITELY did not flop. It looked initially to do so but had insane legs and managed to turn a small profit at the end.
Once again you show your ignorance.

[Landslide Lyndon]

The Rise of Skywalker has a 86% audience score. Those are easily manipulated and mean nothing.

They were manipulated by haters who review-bombed movies without even seeing them but that changed after the first Captain Marvel. Now you have to prove you actually watched the film before voting (through Fandango).

[Landslide Lyndon]

Rotten Tomatoes scores are much more likely to be manipulated by the studios than by haters, but both do happen.

And even if people are bombing the movie's score with negative reviews... so what? Nobody is claiming that they're bots. They're all individual people with their own personal opinions on the film. And yes, some people reviewing it may not have seen it, but (A) that's probably true for all movies on RT, and (B) that's far less troubling than Disney paying off critics and bribing them with early previews to write positive reviews, which absolutely happens.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Saw it last night. Honestly, it's fairly alright. A film like this was trading on the chemistry of its three leads, and they worked together well. Problem is that 'fairly alright' is not good enough anymore.

Form what I've seen, they're recalibrating with only a single release next year, which is definitely the right move.

What's actually going to annoy me is certain people using this film as validation for extremely reactionary and regressive views, and the possibility that film makers will start thinking they have a point.

I think what is desperately needed is for Marvel to step back, catch their breath, stop loading shovelware onto Disney+ (for f**k's sake Marvel, you're not the f**king Romine brothers), and stop making so many "setup" films. Oh, and for crying out loud, stop throwing so much money into films. Not everything needs to $250 million plus.

The root of all problems for Marvel was Bob Chapek's demand for a constant stream of Marvel content for D+ while at the same time taking away authority from Kevin Feige and instead giving it to his banker friends who had no idea about cinema and were just bean counters, like Chapek himself. This approach brought oversaturation and strained quality control to the point of breaking.

Iger immediately saw the problem and the delay of so many projects is actually the best news Marvel had the last year. Heck, I even expect to hear that some D+ series are going to get scrapped altogether.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Not that I'm complaining.

Imagine if you were.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Go f-cking figure. There is no world in which a season of She-Hulk will draw enough Disney+ subscribers to earn back the 500 million dollars it costs to make that one single product.

Jesus effing Christ! Where do you get these numbers from, George Santos? 

[Landslide Lyndon]

That was a guess based on how much this crap usually costs. A good rule of thumb is to take the stated budget and double it to get a rough estimate of how much it costs to produce and market something. I looked it up and She-Hulk had a budget of 225 million (which is actually less than I expected though in my defense I thought the episodes were an hour long, not 30 minutes), so I'd say 400 million would be a fair estimate assuming they spent less on marketing than they would for a Marvel movie. Since it was dumped onto Disney+ it has made zero dollars. What a success!

No, your assumptions are wildly inaccurate. Even the biggest theatrical releases don't spend 175 millions on marketing. And you can't compare spending 200 million dollars on a two hour movie with spending the same amount on a TV series whose total runtime is 5-6 hours. If you can't understand the difference because you have a hate-boner for Disney then this conversation just goes nowhere.

[Landslide Lyndon]

You are missing the forest for the trees. Even if they only spent 75 million on marketing for She-Hulk, it is still failing to make any of that back. There is no way to spin any of this crap as successful. There is no way that enough people are watching She-Hulk with ads running to make back all that money.

Something else I forgot to mention is that the streaming model is even less viable now that the strikes have forced the studios to actually pay their people. Not only will they earn zero dollars from the movies and shows they put on their streaming services, but they also have to pay royalties to the people who actually created them. The studios' response to this problem will be to cut corners and make even worse "content" (again, their word) as part of their ongoing effort to destroy their own industry.

You really have no idea what you're talking about. I might as well start writing about baseball.

P.S. She-Hulk was one of the biggest successes of Disney+ when it comes to viewership.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Nope.

Yeah.

https://fandomwire.com/she-hulk-reveals-impressive-viewership-record-despite-negative-online-hate-comfortably-beats-most-disney-shows-including-ms-marvel/

https://www.cbr.com/she-hulk-mcu-hot-doubles-ms-marvel-audience/

[Landslide Lyndon]

If there's one thing the manosphere dudebros do seem to be right about it's that Marvel is trying to replace every single character with a young girl who acquires all the powers and knowledge with zero effort and just seems to immediately be an expert on how to utilize those powers.  And that Marvel usually drives this point home by making her smarter and better than the original superhero, often emphasized with a scene between the two where she condescendingly proves her superiority over him.  I find these scenes not just annoying but also predictable.  But I'm more annoyed that these characters often seem as little more than advertisements for TV shows.

That's the same BS these cousin-humping, mouth-breathing, racist troglodytes were saying about Rey in the Star Wars sequels, being a Mary Sue and what.
And that's why I'll ask somebody to give me a specific example of an MCU project where that happened because I can't recall.

[Landslide Lyndon]

If there's one thing the manosphere dudebros do seem to be right about it's that Marvel is trying to replace every single character with a young girl who acquires all the powers and knowledge with zero effort and just seems to immediately be an expert on how to utilize those powers.  And that Marvel usually drives this point home by making her smarter and better than the original superhero, often emphasized with a scene between the two where she condescendingly proves her superiority over him.  I find these scenes not just annoying but also predictable.  But I'm more annoyed that these characters often seem as little more than advertisements for TV shows.

That's the same BS these cousin-humping, mouth-breathing, racist troglodytes were saying about Rey in the Star Wars sequels, being a Mary Sue and what.
And that's why I'll ask somebody to give me a specific example of an MCU project where that happened because I can't recall.

racism is when u dont like moovie

There are a significant chunk of people in this world who simply hate the fact that this film is led by three women, one of them black and another a Pakistani-Canadian.

These people aren't even consistent. A lot of them liked "The Last Jedi" and "Captain Marvel" when they were first released, and there are videos to prove that.
But when they discovered that anti-wokeism, racism, and misogyny bring a ton of clicks from the incel crowd, they did a u-turn and suddenly started saying that these are the worst movies in the history of mankind, Hollywood is disrespecting straight white males, and that the woke virus is the biggest threat to our civilization.

[Landslide Lyndon]

If there's one thing the manosphere dudebros do seem to be right about it's that Marvel is trying to replace every single character with a young girl who acquires all the powers and knowledge with zero effort and just seems to immediately be an expert on how to utilize those powers.  And that Marvel usually drives this point home by making her smarter and better than the original superhero, often emphasized with a scene between the two where she condescendingly proves her superiority over him.  I find these scenes not just annoying but also predictable.  But I'm more annoyed that these characters often seem as little more than advertisements for TV shows.

That's the same BS these cousin-humping, mouth-breathing, racist troglodytes were saying about Rey in the Star Wars sequels, being a Mary Sue and what.
And that's why I'll ask somebody to give me a specific example of an MCU project where that happened because I can't recall.

racism is when u dont like moovie

Nah, their main selling point is misogynism. That's why their Unholy Trinity of Wokeism is Ghostbusters 2016, the live-action Mulan, and Captain Marvel.

[Landslide Lyndon]

Huh? Mulan didn't race-swap or gender-swap the main character. People just hated it for the same reason they hate all those live-action Disney adaptations: they suck.

Don't shoot the messenger. These folks say a lot of things that don't make sense.
Like I said, a few years ago they were big fans of movies which they now consider an affront to the human race.

[Landslide Lyndon]

And like I said, they're clearly pulling back and recalibrating. People pronouncing this 'The death of Marvel' are speaking way too son, I think.

Funnily all these incel losers who celebrate the death of Marvel had nothing to say about the second season of Loki. Isn't that weird?

[Landslide Lyndon]

And like I said, they're clearly pulling back and recalibrating. People pronouncing this 'The death of Marvel' are speaking way too son, I think.

Funnily all these incel losers who celebrate the death of Marvel had nothing to say about the second season of Loki. Isn't that weird?

You're not helping.

I'm not here to help anybody. I'm saying my opinion.

[Landslide Lyndon]

To the actual point of this thread, people have brought up the issue of studios deciding to go all in on streaming (an example of the bizarre sort of decision-making that corporations were indulging in three years ago that would only make sense if they were of the belief that covid would last forever), but I would think that another factor would be the Chinese market. The reason that effects-heavy movies were everywhere in the 2010s was because the movie industry was looking to sell tickets in China, where culturally specific American stories play a lot worse than big explosions. Now the CCP doesn't want so many foreign movies and so a specific style of movie that was designed to play in China is a lot less lucrative.

That's exactly what I wrote a few months ago about the Hollywood studios trying to lower the language barrier in order to appeal to the lucrative east-Asian market.
But the streaming services aren't going anywhere, especially now that they are starting to become profitable. Cinemas won't go anywhere either but they will show almost exclusively event movies which will attract mainly younger audiences. The older moviegoers will prefer to watch the latest dramas and comedies at the comfort of their homes, without any i-phone wielding, rambunctious teenagers spoiling their experience.

[Landslide Lyndon]

And like I said, they're clearly pulling back and recalibrating. People pronouncing this 'The death of Marvel' are speaking way too son, I think.

Funnily all these incel losers who celebrate the death of Marvel had nothing to say about the second season of Loki. Isn't that weird?

Scorsese’s been awful quiet since that fire dropped 🔥🔥🔥🔥

Scorsese's latest movie bombed. So I guess that means there is Scorsese fatigue and nobody wants to see his movies anymore.

/S

[Landslide Lyndon]

And like I said, they're clearly pulling back and recalibrating. People pronouncing this 'The death of Marvel' are speaking way too son, I think.

Funnily all these incel losers who celebrate the death of Marvel had nothing to say about the second season of Loki. Isn't that weird?

Scorsese’s been awful quiet since that fire dropped 🔥🔥🔥🔥

Scorsese's latest movie bombed. So I guess that means there is Scorsese fatigue and nobody wants to see his movies anymore.

/S

In fairness, KOTFM is a very, very good film, albeit one of his weaker ones. We should also bear in mind that it was primarily an Apple+ film; the cinema release was basically an afterthought from what I understand.

I don't know man. According to what I'm reading here the box office can't be wrong.