Israel Ambassador: If UN recognize Palestaine, expect the US to completely stop funding the UN

[Red Velvet]

I wasn’t aware officials from other countries could tell what officials from countries that aren’t theirs will do, but it goes to show how much USA is worldwide recognized as Israel’s lapdog that even Israeli ambassador will confidently say something of this kind and not sound like delusion. He’s probably correct.

I don’t support Israel, but I do support US getting out of UN for Israel btw. The less US presence in the global institutions, the better and that is the isolationist path they’re clearly choosing for themselves not just with Trump, but with Biden as well.

[Red Velvet]

President Biden is more likely to have the US recognize Palestine and not veto UN membership than defund the UN lol

hahaha do you really strongly believe in that? It’s possible but I wouldn’t be this confident.

[Red Velvet]

Imagine actually feeling sorry for the UN

The UN is not great, but leaving it over Israel would hurt our worldwide reputation far more than simply telling the Israelis to stfu and be better people.

This isn't leaving the UN, its just defunding the UN.  When the bill was created it also wasn't seen as very realistic to defund the UN so this basically just forces future presidents to keep a consistent foreign policy on this issue until a true solution can be created.

Defunding the UN based on one country's demands a has made my point about Israel's interference in American politics.

I wasn’t aware officials from other countries could tell what officials from countries that aren’t theirs will do, but it goes to show how much USA is worldwide recognized as Israel’s lapdog that even Israeli ambassador will confidently say something of this kind and not sound like delusion. He’s probably correct.

I don’t support Israel, but I do support US getting out of UN for Israel btw. The less US presence in the global institutions, the better and that is the isolationist path they’re clearly choosing for themselves not just with Trump, but with Biden as well.

Counterpoint : The US far right has sought to damage the UN for sometime now. There was always a skepticism of the UN coming from the right wing of the Republican Party. Israel's only taking advantage of the populist isolationist sentiment.

Remember the John BIrch Society ? National Review ?

Everyone knows the US right (aka republicans) is isolationist on many grounds these days, the news that people are uncomfortable to talk about is that Democrats increasingly are as well.

The Israeli ambassador is talking about USA in general, which means independent from whoever is president. He clearly believes USA would do that in regards the UN be it Trump or Biden the president. And he may not be wrong about it.

For me it’s great that both Trump and Biden would sacrifice US influence in big international institutions just to suck Israel’s balls, it opens space for OTHERS to occupy the space vacuum left and Brazil could maybe be one of these places. It just sounds stupid the length if what people are willing to do to appease to Israel. They clearly love it more than they love themselves hahahaha. Let’s watch how far this goes.

[Red Velvet]

Imagine actually feeling sorry for the UN

The UN is not great, but leaving it over Israel would hurt our worldwide reputation far more than simply telling the Israelis to stfu and be better people.

This isn't leaving the UN, its just defunding the UN.  When the bill was created it also wasn't seen as very realistic to defund the UN so this basically just forces future presidents to keep a consistent foreign policy on this issue until a true solution can be created.

Defunding the UN based on one country's demands a has made my point about Israel's interference in American politics.

I wasn’t aware officials from other countries could tell what officials from countries that aren’t theirs will do, but it goes to show how much USA is worldwide recognized as Israel’s lapdog that even Israeli ambassador will confidently say something of this kind and not sound like delusion. He’s probably correct.

I don’t support Israel, but I do support US getting out of UN for Israel btw. The less US presence in the global institutions, the better and that is the isolationist path they’re clearly choosing for themselves not just with Trump, but with Biden as well.

Counterpoint : The US far right has sought to damage the UN for sometime now. There was always a skepticism of the UN coming from the right wing of the Republican Party. Israel's only taking advantage of the populist isolationist sentiment.

Remember the John BIrch Society ? National Review ?

Everyone knows the US right (aka republicans) is isolationist on many grounds these days, the news that people are uncomfortable to talk about is that Democrats increasingly are as well.

The Israeli ambassador is talking about USA in general, which means independent from whoever is president. He clearly believes USA would do that in regards the UN be it Trump or Biden the president. And he may not be wrong about it.

For me it’s great that both Trump and Biden would sacrifice US influence in big international institutions just to suck Israel’s balls, it opens space for OTHERS to occupy the space vacuum left and Brazil could maybe be one of these places. It just sounds stupid the length if what people are willing to do to appease to Israel. They clearly love it more than they love themselves hahahaha. Let’s watch how far this goes.

You're naive to think that Brazil could be one of those countries. Russia and China will take up the vacuum and they're no progressive freedom loving countries. But I guess, because they're Anti West, I guess that's okay with you huh ?

American Imperialism bad ! Chinese Imperialism, good !

Either way, this will never happen in reality. The US is not going to lose it's only leverage it has on the world stage; just to appease one singular country, and it's not naive to think so. Trump never withdrew from the UN, or tried to when he was President. This is just an opinion of a singular Israeli politician who's playing to the base in his home country, to win votes ( or whatever votes his party, Likud can win.)

Nonsense victimization there. Brazil is one of 4 major countries that aspires to get a permanent seat in UN security council, alongside Germany; India and Japan.

The main obstacles between Brazil and a permanent seat are USA and China. And China’s problem is actually with Japan, not Brazil, reason why they tend to be against expansion in general so that Japan doesn’t sneak in.

Every other country would be in favor of Brazil’s ascending to a permanent seat, from France to Russia. So if USA leaves UN and gives up their international power and influence for the sake of Israel, it’s one less complicator factor working against Brazil.

As for your last paragraph, we’ll have to wait and see. Like you said before, domestic political sectors inside USA are increasingly isolationist and historically suspicious of the UN, especially in the Trumpist right.

However, the democrats are also trying to find a balance between supporting Israel and maintaining their international leverage through these institutions even if these two positions enter in major clash as the worldwide internationalist position is one of solidarity with Palestinian people.

Eventually they will not be able to maintain a 100% balance and will have to somewhat compromise on their unconditional support for Israel OR on their internationalist pedigree and influence. The current democratic position is to actively use their international relevance in FAVOR of Israel but that eventually will not be possible to maintain due to existing a clear Pro-Palestinian consensus as the global internationalist positioning.

And honestly, it’s not 100% clear what they would choose at all. Sure, the US establishment would love to maintain their international relevance and cares about it BUT the country is also very clearly on a nationalist and isolationist trend and not just with Trump. Unclear what the Democratic Party while still financially supported by big money from Israeli lobby, would really choose if forced to pick under international pressure.

[Red Velvet]

If the international community (read: UN) isn't involved, then there will never be a two-state solution. Israel and Palestine can never be trusted to coexist (as in, recognize each other's right to exist) peacefully without third-party involvement, and that's the God's honest truth.

And if you support a two-state solution but don't like the UN, I'm curious how you think we can get there without it.

Precisely. Which is exactly why it’s unclear what Democrats would choose when they sound exactly like the Trumpist Republicans and Nationalists who are skeptical of international institutions. And that kind of thing isn’t even because they’re ideologically isolationists, they’re simply unwilling to concede on Israel, turning against international institutions instead.

I genuinely don’t know what Red Avis here and the Democratic Party as a whole would pick between “Support for Israel” and “USA international presence”. I don’t think anyone does.