SR 106-07: Censuring and condemning Chief Justice Windjammer.... (Failed)

[Ancestral Republican]

Thank you Mr. PPT.

This bill primarily is a reaction to Chief Justice Windjammer's conduct, as cited above. While the Court may arrive at conclusions which are unpopular, using the bench to threaten opponents either materially or politically goes beyond the pale. When it comes to behavior, the Court is indeed accountable to the people of Atlasia.

[Ancestral Republican]

If I were senator I would question the interest of passing a motion censuring someone who isn't a senator as this is a procedure for senator but anyway, I'm not part of the senate so I will not start an argument regarding that.

Thank you Mr. PPT.

This bill primarily is a reaction to Chief Justice Windjammer's conduct, as cited above. While the Court may arrive at conclusions which are unpopular, using the bench to threaten opponents either materially or politically goes beyond the pale. When it comes to behavior, the Court is indeed accountable to the people of Atlasia.

It's funny how one-sided it is. I made these comments against you when you and many others were attempting to remove me for office because I dismissed the case you filed after a unanimous decision. You really don't see a problem with that when there is basically a mob threatening supreme court justices when they do not side with you? This is infringing the independence of justice.


But anyway, as I am catholic and I believe in forgiveness I will offer an olive branch. If you admit your behavior was wrong about plotting behind the scenes to overthrow the entire judiciary system because they didn't side with you, I will apologize to you as well.

No one was plotting to overthrow you, Mr. Nixon. Many thought - and some still think - the decision went outside the boundaries of typical jurisprudence. You certainly didn't help your case by making multiple comments to the effect that you would prefer it didn't go to trial. We've accepted the decision, while a bad one, was within normal protocol and not corrupt. But considering you for impeachment was completely constitutional, as the current measure is (and respectfully we are absolutely able to symbolically discipline you within the confines of the Senate.) Your threats and other contemptible behavior were not. Ergo, you are in the wrong here. I have done nothing but faithfully serve the people of Atlasia.

[Ancestral Republican]

If I were senator I would question the interest of passing a motion censuring someone who isn't a senator as this is a procedure for senator but anyway, I'm not part of the senate so I will not start an argument regarding that.

Thank you Mr. PPT.

This bill primarily is a reaction to Chief Justice Windjammer's conduct, as cited above. While the Court may arrive at conclusions which are unpopular, using the bench to threaten opponents either materially or politically goes beyond the pale. When it comes to behavior, the Court is indeed accountable to the people of Atlasia.

It's funny how one-sided it is. I made these comments against you when you and many others were attempting to remove me for office because I dismissed the case you filed after a unanimous decision. You really don't see a problem with that when there is basically a mob threatening supreme court justices when they do not side with you? This is infringing the independence of justice.


But anyway, as I am catholic and I believe in forgiveness I will offer an olive branch. If you admit your behavior was wrong about plotting behind the scenes to overthrow the entire judiciary system because they didn't side with you, I will apologize to you as well.

No one was plotting to overthrow you, Mr. Nixon. Many thought - and some still think - the decision went outside the boundaries of typical jurisprudence. You certainly didn't help your case by making multiple comments to the effect that you would prefer it didn't go to trial. We've accepted the decision, while a bad one, was within normal protocol and not corrupt. But considering you for impeachment was completely constitutional, as the current measure is (and respectfully we are absolutely able to symbolically discipline you within the confines of the Senate.) Your threats and other contemptible behavior were not. Ergo, you are in the wrong here. I have done nothing but faithfully serve the people of Atlasia.

You were considering to overthrow me because you didn't like the way the supreme court ruled. I would have more respect for you if you were more honest about what you wanted to do. You were not the only one, even Truman considered it as well for a brief moment. But in the end Truman and I ended up mending and things moved on.

And as for "I have nothing but faithfully serve the people of Atlasia", the court unanimously ruled you filed a lawsuit way too late and the reason was because you were actually trying to blow Atlasia by supporting the secession of Lincoln

Your continued delusion and paranoia are just more evidence that you should be formally reprimanded for your behavior.

[Ancestral Republican]

This entire debacle is odd and so random to me. I absolutely want this legislation tabled until we get more answers. Since Crane wants Windjammer censored and condemned, if he is found to be operating in bad faith, lying, misrepresenting the situation in any way, or proven to have antagonized Windjammer, the same should also apply to you. We need more information about you and the others who were discussing Justice Windjammer. If this legislation is nothing more than hogwash, you should be forced to resign.

To sum up the situation, Cranehusband filed a lawsuit against Louisville. The supreme court unanimously dismissed it because all the supreme court justices believed it was filled way too late (Cranehusband was busy trying to make Lincoln secede). As Chief Justice, I posted the opinion of the court on that.

And this is when there were people who got really upset about my decision. Wulfric for example opened a thread to start impeachment proceedings against me. And someone leaked me on discord that there was a discord channel who was considering my impeachment. And crane was the main one behind it.

So I "overreacted" and I said these comments. I would be willing to make amends about it but Crane utterly denies it his wrongdoing.

Truman basically confirmed in this thread that these impeachment proceedings were being discussed just after I posted the trial so I'm not lying.

How are you the chief justice and you don't know the difference between a lawsuit and a criminal proceeding? First mistake.

Second mistake: There was no discord server discussing your impeachment. I'd welcome you to provide evidence of such a thing. There was a thread made (not by me) discussing the CONSTITUTIONAL METHOD of removing you from office for perceptions of incompetence and/or corruption, which you certainly haven't managed to shake off with your actions here!

It's truly hilarious that you dismissed that case, which was based on wrongdoing in a Discord server, and are now attempting to justify your foolish and contemptible behavior with, as best I can tell, faulty information you got from Discord chat logs you freely admit illicitly being in receipt of. Perhaps you were so unwilling to hear a case against doxxing because it would open a can of worms against your own activities?

You are embarrassing yourself and the whole Court.

[Ancestral Republican]

How are you the chief justice and you don't know the difference between a lawsuit and a criminal proceeding? First mistake.

Well, I know the difference between the two thank you very much. But I fail to see the point of discussing about it in a thread that has nothing to do with that?

I mean, if you're going to bring it up in your own defense you should at least pretend to have a clue what you're talking about.

Second mistake: There was no discord server discussing your impeachment. I'd welcome you to provide evidence of such a thing. There was a thread made (not by me) discussing the CONSTITUTIONAL METHOD of removing you from office for perceptions of incompetence and/or corruption, which you certainly haven't managed to shake off with your actions here

Truman literally said on the floor that you were discussing about my impeachment just after the ruling.
And again this was a UNANIMOUS ruling, it's basically your hidden agenda since the beginning, you can't stand the fact the court ruled against you.

I'm going to take that as a "no", then. You would think someone involved in the judicial process for a long time would know that you need a firm foundation of fact before you start rattling off paranoid delusions.

Perhaps you were so unwilling to hear a case against doxxing because it would open a can of worms against your own activities?

What do you mean? You're making baseless accusations as always, so please go ahead and explain your reasoning

Based on the way you've acted here, I can definitely see you doxxing somebody because you feel you might lose your grip on power for a position in an online game. You had no qualms about begging people for invites to discord servers the majority of its members would never want you in to try to catch people in the act of disloyalty to yourself.

[Ancestral Republican]

How are you the chief justice and you don't know the difference between a lawsuit and a criminal proceeding? First mistake.

Well, I know the difference between the two thank you very much. But I fail to see the point of discussing about it in a thread that has nothing to do with that?

I mean, if you're going to bring it up in your own defense you should at least pretend to have a clue what you're talking about.

Second mistake: There was no discord server discussing your impeachment. I'd welcome you to provide evidence of such a thing. There was a thread made (not by me) discussing the CONSTITUTIONAL METHOD of removing you from office for perceptions of incompetence and/or corruption, which you certainly haven't managed to shake off with your actions here

Truman literally said on the floor that you were discussing about my impeachment just after the ruling.
And again this was a UNANIMOUS ruling, it's basically your hidden agenda since the beginning, you can't stand the fact the court ruled against you.

I'm going to take that as a "no", then. You would think someone involved in the judicial process for a long time would know that you need a firm foundation of fact before you start rattling off paranoid delusions.

Perhaps you were so unwilling to hear a case against doxxing because it would open a can of worms against your own activities?

What do you mean? You're making baseless accusations as always, so please go ahead and explain your reasoning

Based on the way you've acted here, I can definitely see you doxxing somebody because you feel you might lose your grip on power for a position in an online game. You had no qualms about begging people for invites to discord servers the majority of its members would never want you in to try to catch people in the act of disloyalty to yourself.

I have never doxxed anyone in my life and this is a serious accusation you're making based on literally nothing. You could be charged for defamation for that IRL.

I was not accusing you of doxxing, I was merely suggesting that it would not be outside of the realm of possibility based on your discord behavior I just described.

But, I agree. Let's move on. You clearly lack the reflective capacity to accept any wrongdoing and your continued display of such does nothing to help anyone involved.

[Ancestral Republican]

tbf impeachment WAS discussed in the immediate aftermath of the decision, so I don't think "Nobody was plotting to overthrow you" is exactly accurate.

I guess if I misunderstood the difference between "constitutional impeachment" and "coup d'état" as Windjammer seems to, I would be confused, too.

[Ancestral Republican]

tbf impeachment WAS discussed in the immediate aftermath of the decision, so I don't think "Nobody was plotting to overthrow you" is exactly accurate.

I guess if I misunderstood the difference between "constitutional impeachment" and "coup d'état" as Windjammer seems to, I would be confused, too.

An impeachment for the sake of "effecting a desired ruling" is while not a coup, certainly would qualify as an attack on the independence of the judiciary branch of government.

I'm not sure where that language is coming from, but I certainly never once advocated for that or a similar position. Regardless, if people want to follow a constitutional procedure to remove someone for whatever reason, let them try. If the case is weak or perceived as biased or as being pursued for the wrong reason, it will fail. Now if someone were to try to remove Windjammer through illegal means, he would certainly have legitimate grounds for his many, many, complaints. But nobody has done or has even contemplated doing that to my knowledge.

This censure is all about Windjammer's conduct, and I certainly believe he has, himself, built an airtight case that he deserves reproach for his bizarre outbursts and behavior unbecoming of someone in his position.
He should apologize to Atlasia and should promise not to utilize Discord leakers again to attempt to find dirt on his perceived enemies. If he does that, I will drop the issue.

[Ancestral Republican]

tbf impeachment WAS discussed in the immediate aftermath of the decision, so I don't think "Nobody was plotting to overthrow you" is exactly accurate.

I guess if I misunderstood the difference between "constitutional impeachment" and "coup d'état" as Windjammer seems to, I would be confused, too.

An impeachment for the sake of "effecting a desired ruling" is while not a coup, certainly would qualify as an attack on the independence of the judiciary branch of government.

I'm not sure where that language is coming from, but I certainly never once advocated for that or a similar position. Regardless, if people want to follow a constitutional procedure to remove someone for whatever reason, let them try. If the case is weak or perceived as biased or as being pursued for the wrong reason, it will fail. Now if someone were to try to remove Windjammer through illegal means, he would certainly have legitimate grounds for his many, many, complaints. But nobody has done or has even contemplated doing that to my knowledge.

This censure is all about Windjammer's conduct, and I certainly believe he has, himself, built an airtight case that he deserves reproach for his bizarre outbursts and behavior unbecoming of someone in his position.
He should apologize to Atlasia and should promise not to utilize Discord leakers again to attempt to find dirt on his perceived enemies. If he does that, I will drop the issue.

I believe Dwarven Dragon was saying so publicly with regards to impeachment for a results oriented justification. In terms of what Windjammer perceived as such, with his filtering out and around, even if it not from you, it is not unreasonable to be of a mind that there was a direct threat against the independence of the judiciary during that period.

Maybe, but I'm not really concerned about piecing together the puzzle of Windjammer's thoughts and emotions. The only thing material to this case is his actions. As I said, I would accept the aforementioned apology and promise to refrain from illicit Discord activity as a possible resolution.

[Ancestral Republican]

I do appreciate the support from across the aisle.

Let's be honest, the problem isn't my "actions" but fundamentally Cranehusband's.


He's fundamentally a high school bully who sh**ttalks people behind their backs, is always in denial about his actions and viciously attacks any perceived opposition to him.

Crane, you have been making a ton of vicious personal against me or on discord, calling me some kind of mental psycho, and now accusing me of doxxing people. I have dealt with many bullies like you in my long atlasian career and all of them are gone, I am still standing. You're going to lose progressively all your friends by your self-imploding and unrepentant personality.

So continue to use the senate to make these pointless situations if that reassures your ego. "Oh Windjammer has been mean to me, ouin ouin ouin,...". For someone who wants portray himself as some kind of tough revolutionaries, this is really hilarious to watch.

Words, words, and more words. I'm glad you've found a few people in this thread who prefer the status quo to having competent and emotionally sound officeholders in Atlasia. I note that one of them, who recommended your latest delusional screed, is the very person who you tried your hardest to help avoid consequences for his alleged actions. Your threats mean nothing. In fact, I welcome them. It's just more evidence that you are unable to respond to criticism with anything but that. Make no mistake: in the future, I'll be making sure anyone unlucky enough to be involved in a case under your purview knows about your past behaviors and actions and how they may pervert the course of justice. Lastly, you should know it wasn't even me who wrote this bill, I elected to sponsor it. So there are more people than you may realize who are fed up with your style. Perhaps this can be a wake-up call. Or you can just keep arguing in this thread until the end of time.

[Ancestral Republican]

I do appreciate the support from across the aisle.

Let's be honest, the problem isn't my "actions" but fundamentally Cranehusband's.


He's fundamentally a high school bully who sh**ttalks people behind their backs, is always in denial about his actions and viciously attacks any perceived opposition to him.

Crane, you have been making a ton of vicious personal against me or on discord, calling me some kind of mental psycho, and now accusing me of doxxing people. I have dealt with many bullies like you in my long atlasian career and all of them are gone, I am still standing. You're going to lose progressively all your friends by your self-imploding and unrepentant personality.

So continue to use the senate to make these pointless situations if that reassures your ego. "Oh Windjammer has been mean to me, ouin ouin ouin,...". For someone who wants portray himself as some kind of tough revolutionaries, this is really hilarious to watch.

Words, words, and more words. I'm glad you've found a few people in this thread who prefer the status quo to having competent and emotionally sound officeholders in Atlasia. I note that one of them, who recommended your latest delusional screed, is the very person who you tried your hardest to help avoid consequences for his alleged actions. Your threats mean nothing. In fact, I welcome them. It's just more evidence that you are unable to respond to criticism with anything but that. Make no mistake: in the future, I'll be making sure anyone unlucky enough to be involved in a case under your purview knows about your past behaviors and actions and how they may pervert the course of justice. Lastly, you should know it wasn't even me who wrote this bill, I elected to sponsor it. So there are more people than you may realize who are fed up with your style. Perhaps this can be a wake-up call. Or you can just keep arguing in this thread until the end of time.

This will be my final statement until the vote:

You are a cry baby and a high school bully trying portray yourself as some kind of tough guy.


 

Your only answer to allegations of misconduct is personal threats and whining about how persecuted you are. You're the last person who has room to call anybody else a crybaby or bully. As I said earlier in the thread, you obviously lack the reflective and emotional capacity to admit any wrongdoing, and we are now well into the second page of proof for that claim.

[Ancestral Republican]

This thread is turning about as well as I predicted.

Anyway, it is the Senate's job to consider resolutions and not mine. I will reiterate my confidence in the Chief Justice, as someone who's had my fair share of encounters with LT. I do not believe he used appropriate language on the bench, but I also don't believe this warrants a censure.

Looking forward to him exploding onto another delusional, threatening tirade on the bench now that he knows he's free to do so with his targets having no recourse.

[Ancestral Republican]

I'll open a vote in 24 hours if nobody objects.

As sponsor of this bill, I would prefer it be tabled. It's clear it doesn't have majority support at this time and even if it passed it would not really have an effect on the behavior of the subject in question, based on his reaction here. Let's move on for now.

[Ancestral Republican]

Aye