France: Roma's hunting is opened

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Then the Left has stayed literally dumb about it, not the slightest big voice disturbed its vacations in order to speak about that ethnicisation of problems, not to say of creation of ethnic problems, orchestrated by the govt to hide its global political weakness. We only had a few organizations who bother these questions to try to hold some criticisms about it.

The left staying silent is the best it can do. I don't doubt that a good number of old white working-class voters in the north, east and Parisian region are quite happy that the scary evil Romas are leaving, or at the least ambivalent about it. I think that if the left tried to act scandalized and make a big shazam out of it, a few of its old white working-class voters would flirt with the FN like they did in 2002.

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Then the Left has stayed literally dumb about it, not the slightest big voice disturbed its vacations in order to speak about that ethnicisation of problems, not to say of creation of ethnic problems, orchestrated by the govt to hide its global political weakness. We only had a few organizations who bother these questions to try to hold some criticisms about it.

The left staying silent is the best it can do. I don't doubt that a good number of old white working-class voters in the north, east and Parisian region are quite happy that the scary evil Romas are leaving, or at the least ambivalent about it. I think that if the left tried to act scandalized and make a big shazam out of it, a few of its old white working-class voters would flirt with the FN like they did in 2002.

Well, sometimes braveness wins over electoralism.

Mitterand opposed death penalty against all polls in 1981, and won.

And anyhow, just for a matter of conscious, the govt actually ethnicized the problem here.

Maybe in lala land, but in 2010 politics-land; electoralism beats all, especially two years out from the biggest election in the country. Few politicians these days actually do what's morally right.

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I love how Boutin thinks she's relevant and thinks she can afford to act independently of the UMP. Usually, she's worth 1% of the votes but can rely on her own constituency. Now, she doesn't even have a constituency. I think somebody should kindly tell her that nobody cares about her Christian humanism (btw, bashing gays is humanist?) and that she should go fly a kite.

As for Villepin, any opportunity to act anti-Sarkozyst and get his kid-Kodak face plastered in the papers is good.

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Isn't the irony here that Sarkozy is some kind of dirty Slav himself?

Hungarian......yeah

Hungarian aristocrat, though.

For the record, most Hungarians hate the Roms with a passion, so in a way it isn't ironic that an Hungarian aristocrat like Sarközy de Nagy-Bocsa hates Roms. All his ancestors likely did.

and Hungarians, lest we forget, are nationalist and irredentist.

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Nah, he doesn't give a penny about Roma. That was just a super easy target.

I wouldn't be surprised if an Hungarian hated Roms. Would you?

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Nah, he doesn't give a penny about Roma. That was just a super easy target.

I wouldn't be surprised if an Hungarian hated Roms. Would you?

While I would think most of Europeans see Roma as weird people of which they are not fond, not sure 'hate' would be the right word, maybe they are still less liked in Eastern Europe but I would reserve hate to groups who actually cultivate hatred, that ones use to be fringes of societies.

You don't know Hungarians well then.

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Nah, he doesn't give a penny about Roma. That was just a super easy target.

I wouldn't be surprised if an Hungarian hated Roms. Would you?

While I would think most of Europeans see Roma as weird people of which they are not fond, not sure 'hate' would be the right word, maybe they are still less liked in Eastern Europe but I would reserve hate to groups who actually cultivate hatred, that ones use to be fringes of societies.

You don't know Hungarians well then.

I would have expected you could answer something like that seeing your previous posts. I still think while some big resentment can exist toward groups of people, like maybe in Hungary toward Roma, a difference between the words 'hate' and 'resentment' should exist. Hating is actively cultivating a sentiment for me, a resentment is just a basic disliking more or less strong according to situations. That's why I would reserve 'hate' to those who actively spread 'hatred' which use to remain fringes anywhere in the world.

Really? Reading Hungarian history and looking at contemporary Hungarian politics does suggest otherwise. Hungary has been the most nationalist, irredentist nation in eastern Europe ever since Trianon; and they always seem to be picking fights with other nations and especially the Romas. They not only resent them, they borderline hate them. Mere 'resentment' doesn't explain why neo-Nazis poll nearly 20% in the country.

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Then 20% of the population would 'hate'. That doesn't make a whole nation. 'Essentialiser' as we say French, meaning seriously applying a characteristic to someone because that one belongs to a group, in this case a nation, is rarely relevant.

I only know a bit about the rightist feelings in Hungary, but, .k, if as you say there are so big figures for groups that would be neo-nazis, we can say that globally the resentment toward minorities/foreign would be strong, to very strong in significant fringes, but still, I've troubles seriously using the word 'hate' to refer to an entire population. 

20% + 60% for the right which isn't extremely fond of non-Magyars, it adds up. I'm not saying Magyars are racist sh**ts, far from it, I love Magyar culture and I'm the first to find Trianon a load of crap. But undeniably anti-Roma feelings are stronger in Hungary than practically anywhere else. It's a little issue of semantics which I don't care much for whether they hate them, strongly dislike them, strong resentment or whatevsky.

btw, I suppose it isn't a mere coincidence that the neo-Nazis poll nearly 35-40% in areas with the biggest concentration of Romas (which is, ftr, merely 2% at tops). I think that's a little nugget which suggests that it isn't mere resentment that you have going on.

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Then 20% of the population would 'hate'. That doesn't make a whole nation. 'Essentialiser' as we say French, meaning seriously applying a characteristic to someone because that one belongs to a group, in this case a nation, is rarely relevant.

I only know a bit about the rightist feelings in Hungary, but, .k, if as you say there are so big figures for groups that would be neo-nazis, we can say that globally the resentment toward minorities/foreign would be strong, to very strong in significant fringes, but still, I've troubles seriously using the word 'hate' to refer to an entire population. 

20% + 60% for the right which isn't extremely fond of non-Magyars, it adds up. I'm not saying Magyars are racist sh**ts, far from it, I love Magyar culture and I'm the first to find Trianon a load of crap. But undeniably anti-Roma feelings are stronger in Hungary than practically anywhere else. It's a little issue of semantics which I don't care much for whether they hate them, strongly dislike them, strong resentment or whatevsky.

btw, I suppose it isn't a mere coincidence that the neo-Nazis poll nearly 35-40% in areas with the biggest concentration of Romas (which is, ftr, merely 2% at tops). I think that's a little nugget which suggests that it isn't mere resentment that you have going on.

which groups are you defining as neo-Nazis?

Jobbik. They're the closest thing to Nazis in Europe excluding the NPD.

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Sarkozy further ridiculing himself, more and more populist, sillier and sillier.... Poor country.

The government is going to the dump. While Sarkozy isn't as unpopular as Chirac was in 2006 or so, he's got low 30 approvals and I fail to see how they can bounce back before the cantonals in the spring. I most certainly hope Sarkozy loses in 2012, but on the other hand I most certainly don't want an old PS stalwart like Aubry winning. Only DSK is half decent out of the likely cast of candidates (assuming a good guy like Borloo doesn't run). Yeah, poor country.