This might be a dumb question but..... (user search)
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  This might be a dumb question but..... (search mode)
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Author Topic: This might be a dumb question but.....  (Read 2114 times)
JSojourner
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Posts: 11,512
United States


Political Matrix
E: -8.65, S: -6.94

« on: March 11, 2007, 12:24:37 AM »

Second, to be more accurate about it, the brutal conquest of the south by the likes of 'pyromaniac' Sherman and his thugs combined with the the subsequent rape of the south by the carpetbaggers and thieir associates turned the south into solid Democrat for nearly a century.

Yes, but that doesn't entirely explain why the South decided to go with the Democrats.  That part can then be explained by noting that the commander-in-chief during the war was a Republican.  Had Abraham Lincoln been a Democrat, we would have seen the solid Republican South.

And sure, technically speaking Andrew Johnson was not a Republican, but he was on a ticket with Abraham Lincoln.  I don't think many Southerners would have cared about anything else; that's enough association with the Republican Party for them right there.

Well, lets look at the two different aspects, first of how the war was fought and second how the south was treated after the war.

If the south had been defeated by the north following the generally accepted western rules of warfare (adhered to by McClellan and Lee) the level of animosity would have been far less than the practice of Sherman, Sheridan, Butler et al. who launched despicable attacks on civilians and their property.

Carl is correct, that there was a certain arrogance on the part of some Northern military men -- the contempt shown Southerners was, in some instances, remarkably offensive.  Ben Butler may be a better example of this than Sherman, who is sometimes misunderstood.  Sherman, like Grant, waged total war.  However, as is pointed out in Mark Grimsley's, "The Hard Hand of War: Union Military Policy toward Southern Civilians, 1861-1865", the loss of civilian life at the hands of Sherman's men was almost nil. 

Sherman DID destroy Southern railroads.  He also destroyed subsistence stores that could have been used to feed local militia or guerillas.  The theory, and it is a sound one, is that if you reduce the infrastructure in enemy territory, you reduce the ability and will to fight.  Dropping the atomic bomb on Japan twice was hardly humane.  But the lives lost, even among just the Japanese, would almost certainly have been greater had the U.S. proceeded with Operations Olympic and Cornet in 1946.

Most historians also reject the claim that Sherman ordered the burning of Columbia, South Carolina.  This is simply untrue. 

Unquestionably, crimes were committed against the South and its people throughout the Civil War.  Remember that scene in "Glory", where the troops burned that farm?  That happened.  (This was not Sherman's command.)  Such crimes are always inexcusable.  And the Northerners who claim "lily white purity" and nobility for our side are intellectually dishonest.

But the other side of the coin is also worth a look.  Southern troops could be, and sometimes were, horrendously brutal.  The burning of Chambersburg, Pennsylvania was no accident.  And unlike Columbia, S.C., the fire was order by the Confederate commander and set by his men.

My point is this:  For every hell-hole like Camp Douglas or Elmira, there was Andersonville.  For every massacre of unarmed Federal troops (as at Fort Pillow), there were brutal crimes committed against Rebels.

Each side must own its good history.  And its bad.

But the overarching question -- what brought about Democratic dominence in the South for so long? -- is answered in the fact that for most people, perception is reality.  Southerners were told and believed (and many still believe) that the Union Army was made up of murderous thugs, rapists and arsonists.  And that Republicans, like old Abe Lincoln, were to blame for such crimes.

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JSojourner
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 11,512
United States


Political Matrix
E: -8.65, S: -6.94

« Reply #1 on: March 11, 2007, 10:48:38 PM »

Carl's correct about northern prisons on both counts.  They were almost always as bad as southern ones, occasionally worse.  And they did not suffer from lack of resources.  Camp Douglas may have been the worst, not just because Confederate soldiers were deprived of food, potable water and medical care, but because they were sometimes shamelessly subjected to sport and ridicule by the population of Chicago.  Elmira was a pit.  Johnson's Island was hideous.  And there was no excuse for this whatsoever.  Any Union man worth his blue should be ashamed.  In some prisons, Quakers and Unitarians (who were ironically the staunchest abolitionists) ministered as best they could to the needs of Confederate soldiers.

I collect Civil War documents, photographs, relics and so forth.  In my possession is a Bible carried by a Private in the 51st Georgia Infantry.  He was wounded and captured at Boonsboro, Md. just before Antietam.  Attached to the front cover of the Bible is a CDV photograph of the male nurse who attended him in the prison hospital.  The bond of friendship this Reb and Yank forged is obvious from the tender inscription on the back of the CDV.  That said, such stories -- though true -- are nonetheless individual and anecdotal. And the overarching reality is that most Northerners treated most Southerners with contempt and brutality in captivity.  And vice-versa.

With regard to Sherman, however, just about everything Carl has said has been proven to be inaccurate or misunderstood.  Sherman likely could have done more to prevent some of the wrong done by his troops.  But historians view him much more kindly today.  (I will be happy to cite references if requested.)  This is not to say he bears no blame or resposibility.  He also bears some of the blame for what part he played in the ongoing genocide against First Americans after the Civil War.  But in both conflicts, he is hardly the beast than Ben Butler was. 

I can't fault Sherman for the crimes committed by his troops unless I am also willing to fault Nathan Bedford Forrest for the crimes committed by his.  And to my knowledge, Sherman's men never massacred unarmed, surrendering and wounded soldiers.  Even at Fort Pillow however, Forrest did not order the massacre.  And accounts of his reaction to it vary too much to draw any substantive conclusion.
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