Loudest applause line at CPAC: “Democrats are not Americans but the enemy”

[Hindsight was 2020]

Geeh I wonder why our politics is so toxic right now
https://mobile.twitter.com/ddale8/status/1101133227505475584
https://mobile.twitter.com/ddale8/status/1101133581940916227

[Hindsight was 2020]

What if someone emerges within that movement one day who tries to bring this line of thinking to its logical conclusion?

Probably the same thing as if someone takes the "Republicans are Nazis" talking point to its logical conclusion.

And what large, prominent and well influenced left-ish organization (ie like CPAC), have you seen (heard from) that says to the entire nation that "all Republicans are Nazis?"
Please include links (if they even exist).

This. This is exactly what I keep harping on. Yes the left has nut jobs but the problem is that the nut jobs on the right get power within the movement. For God sakes the president is a birther, at the height of anti-Bush hysteria the democrats didn’t promote let alone nominate for president someone from the “Bush was behind 9/11” crowd. The “both sides do it” blue atlas need to come to terms with the issue that the Republican Party as a institution (with help from Fox and talk radio) has mainstream the fringes of their movement and the inmates are running the asylum.

[Hindsight was 2020]

What if someone emerges within that movement one day who tries to bring this line of thinking to its logical conclusion?

Probably the same thing as if someone takes the "Republicans are Nazis" talking point to its logical conclusion.

And what large, prominent and well influenced left-ish organization (ie like CPAC), have you seen (heard from) that says to the entire nation that "all Republicans are Nazis?"
Please include links (if they even exist).

This. This is exactly what I keep harping on. Yes the left has nut jobs but the problem is that the nut jobs on the right get power within the movement. For God sakes the president is a birther, at the height of anti-Bush hysteria the democrats didn’t promote let alone nominate for president someone from the “Bush was behind 9/11” crowd. The “both sides do it” blue atlas need to come to terms with the issue that the Republican Party as a institution (with help from Fox and talk radio) has mainstream the fringes of their movement and the inmates are running the asylum.

The problem is that the progressive response is to go hard left on everything. That makes it harder for centrists to say "yeah, the GOP has gone too far for me, I'll vote Democratic until they return to sanity." Let's not pretend a huge contingent of folks have been bashing Dems to "go, go left" nonstop for 15 years.

I’m sorry I must of missed were the Democratic Party was calling for seizing land and redistributing it to the poor? Like you can read someone like JA’s post a legitimately think the sounds anything like how the Democratic Party acts and feels?

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I don't see the title quote in the tweets.

It’s not the exact words because I couldn’t fit it all in title

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(Because Dem hacks totally don't think this about Pubs)

But seriously Charlie shut up this isn't helpful

Maybe about the Republican Party as a institution but not the everyday voters like Charlie did with liberals

[Hindsight was 2020]

They hate the guy on our $20 bill, they hate the police, they hate borders, they hate the pledge of allegiance, they hate our gun laws, they hate the national anthem, they hate religion (unless it's something muslim or controversial) they hate our electoral college, they hate our President, they hate many of our Supreme Court justices, they hate big gulp sodas, normal bathrooms, even freaking Rudolph the red nosed reindeer.

The list goes on and on. The only thing the left likes about America is the right they have in America to speak about what they hate about America.

I unapologetically love America. So does Trump. Unlike Obama, he can say it without adding a "but". There are no buts. If you don't like it, leave. Please. Leave.

It's really not worth my time to respond to this lunacy, but let me just debunk/explain a few of the incomprehensible talking points you've used here.

1). the guy on our $20 bill was an absolute sociopath who dueled to the death and massacred Native people. secondly, it's odd how you would love a racist Democrat 🤔

2). This is just a strawman, not really much to debate here. I could just as easily say Republicans hate all teachers because they critizice them so often. with that said, criticizing police brutality and cops acting like action heroes who think they're above the law does not = hating police. the number of Democrats/leftists who actually hate police is almost certainly smaller than the number of Republicans who actually hate minorities solely for existing.

3). Again, a strawman that has no basis in reality. the bipartisan 2013 immigration bill would have secured the border and nearly all Democrats in Congress supported it, but of course those on the fringes of the GOP killed it because muh amnesty or something. so to recap on borders; we had a chance to secure the border, Republicans killed it. sit down and shut up.

4). I personally would not pledge allegiance to any country, but to say that the average Democrat shares this view point is yet again another strawman that's devoid of any factual basis. what most Democrats and progressives believe is that no one, particularly children, should be forced to say the pledge of allegiance. the United States is not a personality cult like North Korea - you don't have to tirelessly take an oath saying how much you love this country.

5). This is possibly my favorite part of your rant thus far. there are countless laws that Republicans "hate". look at how Republicans argue against our current abortion or immigration laws, and notice that they claim these laws are leading to death or disaster or whatever scare words they use. Democrats share the same view, and for good reason, on lax gun laws.


6). Every NFL player who kneeled has explicitly said they were not protesting the national anthem or America itself, but only police brutality and institutional racism - two very serious issues that must be addressed. you'll note that right-wingers had no problem with Tim Tebow kneeling during the national anthem in prayer... I wonder why.


7). The absolute base of the Democratic Party (women of color) are extremely religious, more so than most white Republicans. further more, the vast majority of elected Democrats are Christians or belong to some branch of Christianity. calling other religions weird and showing your Islamaphobia here is also a cute little side note. if you truly love this country, you would believe in freedom of - and freedom from - religion.


. They believe the electoral college is unfair  and/or outdated, and so did Donald Trump when he falsely claimed that Romney had won the PV and lost the EC in 2012 - what exactly does this have to do with the left's alleged hatred of America, again?


9). Again, are you under the impression that we live in North Korea? the fact that we have the right to hate our President is part of why America is a good country. also, Republicans hated Obama just as much as Democrats hated Trump so I'm unsure where you're even going with this one. most Democrats hate Trump because they believe his policies are wrong and are harming this country - that's the definition of patriotism.

10). Republicans also hate many of our Supreme Court justices. similarly to your last point, this one also makes no sense considering the exact same is true of Republicans.


11). Wanting to tax unhealthy things isn't something I agree with, but it's also far from being un-American or unpatriotic. people support this because they want Americans to be healthier, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that even though I disagree with this specific policy.

12). trans people have a right to use the bathroom of their choice, and the scare tactic/BS conspiracy theory that predators will use this and claim to be trans so they can assault women or little girls or something is totally invented by the right - like the idea of their being widespread voter fraud or a crisis on our Southern border. you're more likely to be raped by Roy Moore or Dennis Hastert than a sicko pretending to be trans so he can molest children.


13). A tiny, tiny, group of leftists (morons, to be more accurate) said that about Rudolph the Red Nosed Reindeer. again, this is an extremely fringe view so bringing it up as an example of why liberals hate America is like me saying Republicans hate America because they want to make it illegal to criticize the President.

And finally, I'll respond to your last statement here.

No prominent Democrats or liberals hate this country, they hate the injustices and issues that exist in this country and want to fix them. wanting to make this country better does not in any way imply it's not already great - unlike a certain slogan used by our current President. and I'd add that you have a history of racist and anti-Semitic comments, so I would find it really hard to say you love this country unconditionally when you seem to hate anyone who isn't exactly like you. America is not defined by race or religion or ethnicity or sexuality or any of those things, it's defined by a shared goal and a shared belief in our ideals. blindly accepting everything that goes on in this country in the name of patriotism is in fact the opposite of patriotism. true patriotism is not being afraid to criticize your country when she goes wrong, and working to make it a better place for all it's inhabitants. I love this country, I love the wide diversity of people you can find here - people of all different backgrounds, races, and creeds all coming together is fundamentally what America is about. our country has many flaws, but these can be overcome. I believe America is an exceptional country, and her people are among the best in the World. I do not like Donald Trump. I do not like the Republicans and what they want to do to this country - but I do love this country. I love it's people, I love it's ideals. I believe that our best days are ahead of us, and America will be even greater once our long national nightmare is over. I don't hate this country just because I hate the current Government, and I hope Republicans won't either once it becomes majority-minority, or once candidates they don't like win elections. we can disagree on policy, but we can all agree that this country is all we have, and we should make the best of it. we should embrace and love our fellow Americans, and we should put our differences aside and embrace the common goal of making sure this country lives up to what the founders intended.

Standing ovation!

[Hindsight was 2020]

I’m changing the title to better sum up the thread

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Naso certainly does a lot of complaining about the United States for someone who purports to love them unconditionally. In fact, I'm not sure that I could name any poster who is more negative about this country. He doesn't like most of the people here, how they live, or what they believe. Why doesn't he leave?

Naso complains about persons who are incapable of stating unqualified love for America.  People who can't say "I love America!" and leave it at that.  People who cannot unequivocally state that America is a GOOD Nation. 

Can YOU say "America is a GOOD Nation!" unequivocally?  Without any add-ons?  Just leaving it at that?

Nothing could be easier than calling the United States a "good nation" when you define everything that you dislike about it as un-American.

Since you're asking, I can easily write a response mirroring his screed, but with an emphasis on a different set of virtues:

You hate the guy who wrote Civil Disobedience, if you've even heard of him, you don't value this country's natural beauty, you abhor our major cities, you have only contempt for American pluralism, you despise our environmental laws, you have no appreciation for this country's art or literature, you hate our Congress, and you hold plastic pop culture and a highly personalized sense of cheap nostalgia above all of our higher national ideals.

Naso's perverse vision is not unapologetically "loving America." He doesn't get to define what the United States is from his La-Z-Boys and then tell the rest of us that we're un-American for having different values. Even if his posts often read more like some kind of public decree. All that's missing is a leaden seal.

*Yes, I realize that most Democrats are sad and pathetic enough to apologize for anything, and that many on the left are too preoccupied with guilt and suffering to recognize goodness, but there's a world outside these increasingly dolorous alternatives.

Well, yes, it's no more virtuous to hate San Francisco and Manhattan than it is to hate "The Heartland" (rural flyover country).  I certainly don't think small towns have cornered the market on virtue.  In truth, I see more "Peep Show" establishments when I drive through a certain rural stretch of WV than I do in suburbanized FL, so I get that.

There are posters here that, quite frankly, never say a positive thing about America.  Some are foreign, yet leftist Americans here side with them unequivocally, never thinking that their viewpoint is  one in which the welfare of America and Americans does not come before the welfare of themselves and THEIR nation, which is not America.  That's fine, as far as it goes, but I will point out the "conflict of interest" on the matter.

I'll simplify it:  If you look at the flag and dwell on how racist, sexist, imperialist, etc. America is, and meditate on all of America's faults, it is not reasonable for me to believe that you love the American Nation unequivocally.  There are some here that, based on their posts, have convinced me that they truly hate America and only wish to remake it in their own image (while they rail about the Mike Nasos of the world being "intolerant".)   They will never acknowledge the great good that comes from America, and the force for good that America has been in the World, because that is in conflict with at least some of their rhetoric.  And I use the example "look at the flag" because a nation's flag is a symbol for that nation as a whole; looking at the Hammer and Sickle flag brings to mind the former Soviet Union, while looking at the Union Jack brings to mind not just England, but the former British Empire, do they not?  Let's be real; many Americans loathe America and only seek from it what they can get, while never acknowledging what it has given to them.

Im sorry that in a day and age in which we are being run by a former tv celebrity with narcissistic personality disorder, were our courts are being stacked with accused sexual assaulters who are gradually taking a sledgehammer to a women’s reproductive right, when little kids are being thrown into “camps”  were they being physically, emotionally, and even sexually abused because our their parents work visas expired, were we are govern by a party that is destroying our democratic norms in a cynical persuit of power, and were we stand as the only major western country to be denying the science of climate change that will likely lead to a horrible future for the next generations that we aren’t smelling the roses

[Hindsight was 2020]

There are people here who cannot mention America without mentioning racism, imperialism, materialism, and chronic diarrhea.

But this is literally America in a nutshell. LOL. The incoming paragraph full of meaningless platitudes you come up with will not change that.

I cannot support people for public office who view America as you do.  America isn't perfect, not at all, and I think folks ought to be introspective about it without the hatred for it that you manifest.  But I could not imagine you ever taking a grievance I, myself, would have seriously.  I believe you actively resent White Americans, and that unmitigated resentment would get in the way of your objectivity (granting that no one is perfectly objective).  That's fine, too, until you, or somewhat like you, runs for office and actually get elected. Then, I am in the position of having an elected official that does not care about my concerns at all.  I can understand that you may view yourself in that situation depending on who represents you in GA.  I only suggest that this cuts both ways.

You supported Trump, who has a much lower opinion of America than any nationally prominent Democrat or most any (255,0,0) red avatar here.

Nonsense, of course, but you're pretty hard up for intellectually sound arguments at this point, so we'll roll with that.

Mind actually explaining why it’s nonsense instead of lobbying insults?

[Hindsight was 2020]

Btw, no offense, but I gotta say Fuzzy, it occurs to me that it must require some pretty serious cognitive dissonance for one to be a Trump supporter and talk simultaneously stress the importance of maintenaning the rule of law.  Trump is defined in no small part by his cynical contempt for the very notion of the supremacy of the rule of law.  The man has literally been a blatant crook for his entire professional life and is currently an unindicted co-conspirator in a criminal conspiracy which also involved his personal lawyer, his company’s CFO, and one of his sons.  

Trump is going to be charged with and likely convicted of multiple felonies in less than five years (likely becoming the first former President to serve time in prison).  He has committed multiple counts of obstruction of justice and actively tried to undermine public trust in the FBI, his own Deputy AG, and numerous other public servants who put their country first when the rubber hit the road.  He fired his own Attorney General for following the law and recusing himself from an investigation in which he had a conflict instead of being “my [Trump’s] Roy Cohn.”  The rule of law and Trump go together about as well as anchovies and chocolate ice cream.

The Rule of Law involves the presumption of innocence and Due Process.

Much of what you cite here are political questions, which will be decided in an election, and (possibly) in an impeachment and removal process.  He has every right to fire the AG and fire the FBI Director, regardless of the reason.  That is not, and cannot be, Obstruction of Justice, because a President has every right to fire these folks for whatever reasons he chooses.  If the electorate and the Congress wish to impose political consequences on Trump for these actions, then let them happen.  The assertion that his firing the AG and the FBI Director is Obstruction of Justice criminalizes the normal functioning of the Presidency.  

I'm sure you know far more than I do about this topic, but well into the 1940s, the Courts were reluctant to decide "Political Questions".  The reason the Supreme Court has become a predominant issue in Presidential Elections these days is the withering away of the Court's resistance to entering the "Political Thicket".  To be fair, the conservative jurists have lost this reservation as much as the liberal jurists have.  The Rule of Law has meant that the Courts do not enter the Political Thicket, and it is not a good thing that this is less so.

Firing the head of the FBI in order to influence an investigation that the president is implicated in is not a normal function of the presidency

[Hindsight was 2020]

Firing the head of the FBI in order to influence an investigation that the president is implicated in is not a normal function of the presidency

It's also not legal, and one cannot just redefine crimes as political questions to be decided by election. Trump is a literal criminal who should be prosecuted, not absolved because he spews enough nonsense at rallies to get a sufficient number of votes.

The President of the United States can fire the FBI Director at any time, and for any reason.

Ok Alan Dershowitz. “Obstruction of Justice” is defined as “obstructing a prosecutor or government official in preventing the course of justice”. Firing the head of the FBI in order to influence an investigation the president himself is implicated in fits this definition to a t