COVID-19 Megathread 5: The Trumps catch COVID-19

[Calthrina950]

Some humor in these troubled times...

https://twitter.com/LocalReformer/status/1283608114084765697

Is this the 1980s? Or the 1990s? Those are my answers to the question.

Joe Biden is running for President, so it must be the 1980s.

I would assume so, though Barr didn't become Attorney General for the first time until 1991.

[Calthrina950]

Today begins the 5th month of "15 days to slow the spread"

Remember that the original estimate of the pandemic's duration was 12 to 18 months. We are nowhere near finished with this, especially with the recent surge in cases.

[Calthrina950]

Good news in Colorado. Nearly four months after urging all Coloradoans to wear masks in public, and three months after making them mandatory for essential employees, Governor Polis has finally issued a mandatory mask order for all of Colorado: https://www.kktv.com/2020/07/16/new-mask-requirement-announced-by-colorado-governor-jared-polis/. The requirement comes into effect at midnight tomorrow, and all who are ten years of age and older must wear masks when utilizing public/non-personal transportation and when in indoor public spaces.

[Calthrina950]

Retail CEOs: Enough is enough. It's time for all US governors to require masks in stores (written by 21 CEOs of major US retailers)

Bunch of Trump-hating anarchists and agitators.

Goddamn antifa socialists!!

With Colorado and Arkansas having joined the mandatory mask train yesterday, more than half of all U.S. states have now required them in public. At the trajectory we are going, I expect that there will be very few holdouts on that front by the end of next month. The only states that may still hold back from a mask mandate would be interior western states like Wyoming, South Dakota, and Alaska.

[Calthrina950]

New York has set the example to everyone on how to handle the coronavirus properly:

Fauci holds up New York as model for fighting coronavirus — 'They did it correctly'

Kudos to Governor Andrew Cuomo!

Watch Del Tachi use this to smear Fauci as an evil partisan hack.
While Cuomo definitely didn’t do everything right, he is infinitely better than the Sunbelt Trio and Kemp the Killer.

Cuomo's greatest error was to send coronavirus patients into nursing homes, and I think he should have acted somewhat sooner than he did. But he's maintained a very calm and confident posture throughout this pandemic, and New York City would be far worse off then it is now without his leadership.

As for Colorado, today was my first day back at work since Polis issued his mask mandate on Thursday. And I am astonished by the dramatic effect which it has had. Before the order was issued, roughly half of all customers were not wearing masks. Today, at least 90% were. I still had to deal with a number of maskless customers, and there were some others that I saw in the store, but they are in the definitive minority now. Polis should have made masks mandatory back in May, when Denver and Boulder did so. We would probably be in a much better situation now if he had done so.

Nevertheless, I am pleasantly surprised that most people are obeying the mandate, especially given that El Paso County is a hotbed of anti-government sentiment. It seems like even the ardent Trumpists are adhering to it. But it's unfortunate that it took an order from the Governor to finally compel mask wearing, after months of voluntary appeals failed.

[Calthrina950]

What did you do about the customers who weren't wearing any?

I didn't do anything, as I didn't want trouble with them or my supervisors. My store didn't have anyone posted at the entrances to enforce the mask mandate, although they did have a table with free masks provided, and a large poster stating that masks were now mandatory. I've said before that there are only two ways to effectively enforce it: to either have someone at the entrances turning back maskless customers, or to simply refuse service to those who are not wearing them.

We'll see how things change, especially as the Sheriff of El Paso County, and the Sheriffs of Teller, Weld, and Elbert Counties, have already said that they will not be issuing citations to anyone who violates the mask order. Law enforcement simply doesn't have the resources to deal with every mask violation. But the vast majority of people are adhering to the mandate, so it may not be that serious of a problem.

[Calthrina950]

New York has set the example to everyone on how to handle the coronavirus properly:

Fauci holds up New York as model for fighting coronavirus — 'They did it correctly'

Kudos to Governor Andrew Cuomo!

Watch Del Tachi use this to smear Fauci as an evil partisan hack.
While Cuomo definitely didn’t do everything right, he is infinitely better than the Sunbelt Trio and Kemp the Killer.

Cuomo's greatest error was to send coronavirus patients into nursing homes, and I think he should have acted somewhat sooner than he did. But he's maintained a very calm and confident posture throughout this pandemic, and New York City would be far worse off then it is now without his leadership.

As for Colorado, today was my first day back at work since Polis issued his mask mandate on Thursday. And I am astonished by the dramatic effect which it has had. Before the order was issued, roughly half of all customers were not wearing masks. Today, at least 90% were. I still had to deal with a number of maskless customers, and there were some others that I saw in the store, but they are in the definitive minority now. Polis should have made masks mandatory back in May, when Denver and Boulder did so. We would probably be in a much better situation now if he had done so.

Nevertheless, I am pleasantly surprised that most people are obeying the mandate, especially given that El Paso County is a hotbed of anti-government sentiment. It seems like even the ardent Trumpists are adhering to it. But it's unfortunate that it took an order from the Governor to finally compel mask wearing, after months of voluntary appeals failed.

That’s what phone alerts do.

You're right. My uncle's wife told me the other day that she got a text notification on her phone, with the Governor's mask mandate. That's probably how many people got it. Moreover, on I-25 and other major thoroughfares, the traffic announcement signs, which typically carry Public Awareness Announcements, had one stating that "Masks are mandatory in public spaces in Colorado." It's impossible for you to miss those unless if you're not paying attention.

[Calthrina950]

This may have been posted already, but NYT put out a very detailed map of mask wearing in the US:

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/07/17/upshot/coronavirus-face-mask-map.html

This is a very interesting article, and pretty much correlates with my expectations. I went up to Denver today, and had the chance to drive through Downtown. I'll leave aside my observations on the state of Downtown Denver (to put it mildly, it is looking horrible), but the majority of people I saw were not wearing masks, at least when walking outside or moving between stores. And when passing by stores and restaurants, it was a mixed story with regards to who was wearing them. Interestingly enough, Denver made masks mandatory over two months ago, long before Polis issued his order this past week. So his order had no impact on what they were already doing.

[Calthrina950]

This is a very revealing survey about where public opinion stands. According to this Morning Consult poll which was released earlier today (https://morningconsult.com/2020/07/22/face-mask-polling/), 72% of registered voters support making masks mandatory; moreover, they support mask orders that include penalties (i.e. fines) against those who violate the orders. Also, 28 states + D.C., more then half the country, have now made masks mandatory in public, and I expect for some other states to follow. It's clear that the anti-maskers have lost on this issue, and that those holding civil liberties concerns about mask wearing are in the definite minority.

I've noted previously how mask wearing rates have gone up dramatically at my job since Polis issued his statewide mask mandate last week. This persisted on Monday, with about 90% of all individuals wearing masks. El Paso County is now in jeopardy, along with fourteen other Colorado counties (including Pueblo County), of losing its variances if the current case growth trajectory does not decline over the next few weeks. It will take some time for Polis' order to have an effect upon the numbers, so given the situation in which we were headed, any further delay on that front would have been costly.

[Calthrina950]

This is a very revealing survey about where public opinion stands. According to this Morning Consult poll which was released earlier today (https://morningconsult.com/2020/07/22/face-mask-polling/), 72% of registered voters support making masks mandatory; moreover, they support mask orders that include penalties (i.e. fines) against those who violate the orders. Also, 28 states + D.C., more then half the country, have now made masks mandatory in public, and I expect for some other states to follow. It's clear that the anti-maskers have lost on this issue, and that those holding civil liberties concerns about mask wearing are in the definite minority.

I've noted previously how mask wearing rates have gone up dramatically at my job since Polis issued his statewide mask mandate last week. This persisted on Monday, with about 90% of all individuals wearing masks. El Paso County is now in jeopardy, along with fourteen other Colorado counties (including Pueblo County), of losing its variances if the current case growth trajectory does not decline over the next few weeks. It will take some time for Polis' order to have an effect upon the numbers, so given the situation in which we were headed, any further delay on that front would have been costly.

It's been clear for a while that the anti-mask people are a minority. They're just a very, very loud minority.

This is true. It's interesting how history has repeated itself with regards to masks. One hundred years ago, during the Spanish Flu, many jurisdictions made masks mandatory, in an effort to combat that pandemic. San Francisco was among them, and I've read about how there was an "Anti-Mask League", established within the city, that was opposed to its mask mandate. Moreover, many of the same complaints which we've heard about masks now-that they are uncomfortable, that they are unhealthful, that they are an intrusion upon individual rights-were made by people back then. However, the difference between 1919 and 2020 is that the overwhelming majority of people now have accepted masks, while public opinion was more divided then.

[Calthrina950]

This is a very revealing survey about where public opinion stands. According to this Morning Consult poll which was released earlier today (https://morningconsult.com/2020/07/22/face-mask-polling/), 72% of registered voters support making masks mandatory; moreover, they support mask orders that include penalties (i.e. fines) against those who violate the orders. Also, 28 states + D.C., more then half the country, have now made masks mandatory in public, and I expect for some other states to follow. It's clear that the anti-maskers have lost on this issue, and that those holding civil liberties concerns about mask wearing are in the definite minority.

I've noted previously how mask wearing rates have gone up dramatically at my job since Polis issued his statewide mask mandate last week. This persisted on Monday, with about 90% of all individuals wearing masks. El Paso County is now in jeopardy, along with fourteen other Colorado counties (including Pueblo County), of losing its variances if the current case growth trajectory does not decline over the next few weeks. It will take some time for Polis' order to have an effect upon the numbers, so given the situation in which we were headed, any further delay on that front would have been costly.

Did they ask the the respondents to say how large the fine or jail time would be, or who would enforce it? Would there be a bounty for reporting large gatherings at a neighbors?

Not as far as I know.

[Calthrina950]

https://twitter.com/JordanStrack/status/1286001015213428737

This represents a reversal of his earlier position, as he had initially walked back from a mask mandate because of civil liberties concerns. But I'm glad to see that the momentum for this is increasing.

[Calthrina950]

https://twitter.com/JordanStrack/status/1286001015213428737

This represents a reversal of his earlier position, as he had initially walked back from a mask mandate because of civil liberties concerns. But I'm glad to see that the momentum for this is increasing.

Makes me happy for personal reasons for sure. I have a friend who lives in Ohio and works at a library. Patrons have been pretty unreliable for mask wearing. Hopefully this increases people's willingness to protect the safety of others.

Polis offered pretty much the same explanation here in Colorado when he was asked why he had reversed his position on a mask mandate. He pointed to studies which indicate that more people will wear masks when there is a mask order in place. He still recognizes the difficulties of enforcing such an order, and acknowledges that there won't be 100% compliance, but most people are reasonable enough and will abide by it. In this, he has been proven correct, as mask-wearing rates have gone up dramatically in Colorado over the past week, like I've noted.

With Ohio now joining the mandatory mask train, that brings the number of states requiring them up to 29. We shall see if Ducey and DeSantis are soon forced to give way. I'm also curious to see what Governors like Noem, Reynolds, and Ricketts, who have been hostile to mask orders, will do moving forward.

Time for Abbott, DeSantis and Ducey to do the same. Probably Newsom as well.

Newsom made masks mandatory in California about a month ago, and Abbott made them mandatory a few weeks ago. But I agree with you about DeSantis and Ducey.

[Calthrina950]

Makes me happy for personal reasons for sure. I have a friend who lives in Ohio and works at a library. Patrons have been pretty unreliable for mask wearing. Hopefully this increases people's willingness to protect the safety of others.

I worked at a library for years, and would never even dream of demanding patrons wear masks.

That said, my views on this have evolved slightly in recent weeks. I'm willing to encourage coverings in certain very crowded, enclosed spaces, because I can see how it can be of some benefit in very tight spaces. But I would never make it a rigid requirement, and would instead focus on educating the public.

A bus that's standing room only would be a good example. Never outdoors.

The library system in my area made masks mandatory for all individuals at their locations a few weeks ago, before Polis issued his statewide mask mandate. And how has the mask mandate been playing out in your home state?

[Calthrina950]

https://apnews.com/b9d636f28a9d08ebcceee2e1adcacb69

Arkansas police chief standing up to the commie nanny state by not enforcing mask order

People's Republic of Arkansas huh?

It's truly eye opening how the coronavirus has become simply another chapter in our ongoing culture wars.

Many law enforcement officials across the country, including in El Paso County (where I live), are refusing to enforce the mask mandates imposed by their respective state Governors. Moreover, many of the businesses (i.e. Walmart, Costco, Home Depot, Kroger), which made masks mandatory for their customers, have said that they won't deny service to any who aren't wearing them, nor are they rigorously enforcing their requirements. This defeats the purpose of what a mask mandate is supposed to accomplish. Nevertheless, the overwhelming majority of people where I live-upwards of 90%, are voluntarily complying with the mandate, even the staunch conservatives and Trumpists, and have no problem with it.

[Calthrina950]

https://twitter.com/JenniferJJacobs/status/1287731817395761152

Confirmed by the White House: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-53557447

Yet another Trump confidante has contracted coronavirus. How has he not gotten it at this point?

[Calthrina950]

If they have 14 players who have to self-isolate I'm not sure how they're going to have much of a team for the next 2 weeks. I mean it depends who's infected and they can probably still put up 9 capable players but they're probably going to suck.

What I think this shows us is that resuming sports inside an isolated "bubble" like the NBA's in Orlando is workable.  But resuming outside a bubble probably isn't.

We're not going to see sports events-or any large events for that matter-fully resume until next year, and probably not until after the vaccine has finally appeared. Given this outbreak, it's possible that MLB may be forced to suspend games for the remainder of their season.

[Calthrina950]

https://twitter.com/JakeSherman/status/1288477193933381633

Gohmert is the ninth member of Congress to contract coronavirus. And like South Carolina Rep. Tom Rice who got it a month or so ago, we have a member who was refusing to wear a mask while on Capitol Hill. At this point, I would hope that any remaining Republicans who are opposed to the practice will drop their opposition and don a mask. Masks, as I've said repeatedly, should not have been politicized.

[Calthrina950]

https://twitter.com/mkraju/status/1288597256363483137

She's only just now mandating that??

She made the mistake of believing that congresspeople are responsible adults.

That's just stupid of her then.

Certainly so. It's appalling to me that there are so many bigoted and shockingly ignorant people in Congress-Gohmert is only one of many. Many members are given to conspiracy theories, disseminate misinformation on their official accounts and through their media appearances, and have absolutely insane policy views. Both sides have their bad apples, but it seems increasingly obvious that such "bad apples" are overwhelmingly concentrated on the Republican side of the aisle.

[Calthrina950]

I'm surprised this hasn't been posted yet, but I wanted to provide a link to Dr. Fauci's comments the other day about the potential benefits of donning eye protection (i.e. goggles, the like) to help limit the spread of coronavirus: https://abcnews.go.com/US/dr-fauci-wear-goggles-eye-shields-prevent-spread/story?id=72059055?id=72059055&amp_js_v=0.1&usqp=mq331AQFKAGwASA=&cid=referral_taboola_feed. At my stepmother's job, they've been requiring employees to wear both masks and face shields for about a week or so now. Now that our medical experts are starting to recommend it, I wonder if this will become a more widespread practice.

[Calthrina950]

I'm surprised this hasn't been posted yet, but I wanted to provide a link to Dr. Fauci's comments the other day about the potential benefits of donning eye protection (i.e. goggles, the like) to help limit the spread of coronavirus: https://abcnews.go.com/US/dr-fauci-wear-goggles-eye-shields-prevent-spread/story?id=72059055?id=72059055&amp_js_v=0.1&usqp=mq331AQFKAGwASA=&cid=referral_taboola_feed. At my stepmother's job, they've been requiring employees to wear both masks and face shields for about a week or so now. Now that our medical experts are starting to recommend it, I wonder if this will become a more widespread practice.

They called me four-eyes then...
Well now I will laugh at them when they are in the ICU.
(Yes I know glasses aren’t adequate eye protection for medical experts)

I won't go this far, but it can be ironic when people say things that ultimately rebound on that. As you know, many people have downplayed the severity of this virus, and have suffered or died from it. Hopefully, we'll see the numbers of these deniers decline over time.

As for myself, I wear eyeglasses, and have worn them since seventh grade. So I can sympathize somewhat on that level.

[Calthrina950]

https://twitter.com/DavidLat/status/1289065591345643522?s=20

Is this implying that we should continue with online learning this fall? I'm not sure how sustainable that will be, especially given the demonstrated inferiority of online to in-person instruction, the difficulties associated with working families finding time to superintend their children's studies, and concerns related to school lunches, achievement gaps, childhood poverty, domestic violence, and all the rest. It seems like we are in a losing situation here.

[Calthrina950]

I'm surprised this hasn't been posted yet, but I wanted to provide a link to Dr. Fauci's comments the other day about the potential benefits of donning eye protection (i.e. goggles, the like) to help limit the spread of coronavirus: https://abcnews.go.com/US/dr-fauci-wear-goggles-eye-shields-prevent-spread/story?id=72059055?id=72059055&amp_js_v=0.1&usqp=mq331AQFKAGwASA=&cid=referral_taboola_feed. At my stepmother's job, they've been requiring employees to wear both masks and face shields for about a week or so now. Now that our medical experts are starting to recommend it, I wonder if this will become a more widespread practice.

Bumping this forward because I want to see if any others on here have an opinion about this. Will wearing face shields or eye goggles become mandatory? It seems like some other businesses are starting to require their employees to wear them as well. What is the opinion on here of this?

[Calthrina950]

Everything is fine.

https://twitter.com/HelenBranswell/status/1289042454755397632

You know what the most depressing thing about this is? Every state that is rated green or yellow is a state that already had an extremely severe outbreak and death count or is extremely rural.

No state with a significant population center has been remotely successful at containing this.

And there is very little distinction, on this map, between states with a Democratic or a Republican Governor (Vermont, one of only three states where the situation is trending in a "positive" direction, has a Republican Governor in Phil Scott). Colorado, for example, is rated among the states where the situation is worsening, and it has worsened considerably over the past month. It's been two weeks now since Polis made masks mandatory here, and it doesn't seem to be having an effect as of yet. So we'll have to see what happens going forward.

But what this map tells us is that this country has failed in containing the virus, and at this point, we may all have to go through a "New York" situation before we can possibly start on the record of recovery. And that will mean hundreds of thousands, if not millions, of more cases and tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands, of more deaths between now and November.

[Calthrina950]

From the article linked in the tweet above:

Because he had been at a hearing on Tuesday with Texas Republican Rep. Louie Gohmert, who tested positive for coronavirus on Wednesday, "out of precaution, Grijalva went into self-isolation on Wednesday until he got a test," Nolan said.

In a statement Saturday, Grijalva slammed Republicans who don't wear masks in the building, citing the events of the week.

"While I cannot blame anyone directly for this, this week has shown that there are some Members of Congress who fail to take this crisis seriously," he said. "Numerous Republican members routinely strut around the Capitol without a mask to selfishly make a political statement at the expense of their colleagues, staff, and their families."

It is embarrassing, and frustrating, that many of the leading figures in our own government haven't been taking this seriously. They have set a bad example for so many Americans to do the same. I fully agree with what Rep. Grijalva says here. And he's not the first member to criticize his colleagues for not wearing a mask. Rep. Jim McGovern of Massachusetts did so in a speech on the House floor a few months ago.