Turkey Shoots Down Russian Jet

[ag]

Can we please kick Turkey out of NATO? Please?

For gods' sake, do not! This would make a horrid situation a lot worse!

[ag]

There's a video out there of the "moderate rebels" chanting "Allahu akbar" while celebrating over the pilot's corpse.

disregarding the said rebels, Allahu Akbar is like saying Jesus Christ or Sma'a Israel it's not a radical battle hymn. I would say even secular Arabs would use it as a proverb at times of distress

Even Spaniards still say "ojala", and they haven't been Arab for some centuries now.

[ag]

As many people have said "Allahu akbar" is used by most Muslim Arabs, so these rebels could be secular Muslims. Of course they're not, people can read up on this groups conquest of the Armenian populated coastal city of Kessab, where they vandalised Churches and force converted the few old people who stayed back. They're not ISIS bad, but they're not secular or even moderate.

Do you know what "Allahu akbar" means? I assume you do, but I was just wondering.

God (Allah) is Great. But here's the thing I know a great number of atheists who use the word God or religious terms in common speech.

Even Arab Christians say "Allah" when talking about god. By itself it means nothing.

[ag]

Considering the role Turkey has been playing in accomodating the refugees (for some years now), if we call its behavior in this case "reprehensible", I do not know what we should call that of the rest of us. I guess, "genocidal" would be to scale.

[ag]

So, just an observation, looking at the Turkish map that's been published, it looks like the incident occurred in the Northwest corner of the country, not far from Jisr ash-Shughur. That's hardly an ISIL-friendly or ISIL-controlled area, and is mostly under the control of the FSA with some pockets of al-Nusra Front support. Granted, it's not far from the Russian base in Latakia, but what were their planes doing circling that area in the first place?

Killing Turkish allies, of course.

Even the Russians are justifying this not by fighting ISIS, but by claiming there were, basically, Chechens on the ground there.

[ag]

Would it be appropriate to say that Turkey is playing the part of the Pakistan of this conflict, where they play both sides? Bombing ISIS while tolerating supplies and fighters passing through, using it as an excuse to fight the Kurds, etc.

No. If you want to push the analogy, everybody is a Pakistan there now. The war has become far too multi-sided.

[ag]

Just to clarify...




Turkey shot down the Russian bomber.
 
Then someone else shot down a Russian helicopter on the rescue mission, killing at least one Russian marine. This is the one that might have been shot down by rebels in Syria.

The locals also claim they shot the pilots of the original plane as they were parachuting down.

[ag]

As bad as Putin is, everyone sane has to side with him over the terrorist enabling country that is buying oil from ISIS.

Well, Putin is not in need of buying oil, but that is not the reason to side with him - still less, to side with him against a crucial ally.

[ag]

As bad as Putin is, everyone sane has to side with him over the terrorist enabling country that is buying oil from ISIS.

Well, Putin is not in need of buying oil, but that is not the reason to side with him - still less, to side with him against a crucial ally.

No one who is attacking the Kurds can be considered our ally.

If you are a kurd, most definitely. But we have been talking of US and Europe.

[ag]

Anyway, for those who understand

[ag]

Is the joke something along the lines of "fly Air Belarus, don't get blown up"?

No. It is "Belavia. We will deliver you to countries your president has spats with! Moscow-Minsk-Tbilisi 299 euro. Moscow - Minsk - Kiev 149 euro. Moscow-Minsk-Cairo 279 euro. Moscow - Minsk - Istambul 199 euro."

As you know, at present there are no flights from Russia to either Ukraine or to Egypt. Flights to Georgia have resumed some time ago after a long interruption. And Putin has just prohibited charters (though, so far, not regular flights) to Turkey.

And, of course, Belavia has sharply increased its flights to all those places.

[ag]

Turkey has already all but apologized, so Russia should be satisfied with its response.

One thing you should realise: Russia is never satisfied. It needs to define enemies all around.