Numerous majority-Muslim countries stand with China on oppression of Muslims (user search)
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  Numerous majority-Muslim countries stand with China on oppression of Muslims (search mode)
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Author Topic: Numerous majority-Muslim countries stand with China on oppression of Muslims  (Read 1194 times)
America Needs R'hllor
Parrotguy
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Posts: 11,446
Israel


Political Matrix
E: -4.13, S: -3.48

« on: July 17, 2019, 09:12:12 AM »
« edited: July 17, 2019, 07:32:08 PM by Socialist Mod Stands with ProudWhatsHisName »


I agree, but the amount of countries defending China should nontheless worry America. South Sudan has been pretty pro-Western when it was founded, so it shows the degree of influence China now has in Africa and the Middle East. The U.S. should stop descending into isolationism from one side, and stupid trade wars or neoconservative regime change attempts on the other side. Instead, it should start a way more proactive foreign policy to curb China's influence around the world with positive (or negative yet subtle) steps, like the Marshall Plan, one of its biggest foreign policy successes in history.
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America Needs R'hllor
Parrotguy
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 11,446
Israel


Political Matrix
E: -4.13, S: -3.48

« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2019, 02:43:44 PM »

In a foreign policy class I was in way back, the topic was being discussed:  Why do almost all Muslim-majority countries support the Palestinian cause to one degree or another, yet the persecution of Uighurs is met with silence?  Someone in the class asked if it was because the Uighurs were Turkic, and not Arab.  Maybe that could be one factor, though it’s not like the Arabs all like each other either.  China is powerful enough that countries realize it’s their interests to be on good terms with them.
it can't just be about power as the US is much more powerful than the PRC.  Fear of one flavor or another?  A knee jerk hatred of the west?  Crazy idea, maybe they just hate Jews more than they like their fellow Muslims?

Important note- the Muslim countries treated their Jews much, much better than the Europeans. There were almost no pogroms and definitely no holocaust, and the Jews mostly prospered. Until Israel was founded.

So it's not like Muslims have some inherent antisemitism- I think that a passionate hatred of the West, caused by both legitimate reasons (colonial oppression) and others (religious fanaticism or Arab nationalism), hits much closer to the mark. Once the JewsTM started settling in a land claimed by the Muslims and "invading" the Dar al-Islam, and once they started representing the West in the eyes of their neighbours, then antisemitic ideas rapidly started taking hold.

That's my take, at least.
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America Needs R'hllor
Parrotguy
Atlas Icon
*****
Posts: 11,446
Israel


Political Matrix
E: -4.13, S: -3.48

« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2019, 05:45:26 PM »

In a foreign policy class I was in way back, the topic was being discussed:  Why do almost all Muslim-majority countries support the Palestinian cause to one degree or another, yet the persecution of Uighurs is met with silence?  Someone in the class asked if it was because the Uighurs were Turkic, and not Arab.  Maybe that could be one factor, though it’s not like the Arabs all like each other either.  China is powerful enough that countries realize it’s their interests to be on good terms with them.
it can't just be about power as the US is much more powerful than the PRC.  Fear of one flavor or another?  A knee jerk hatred of the west?  Crazy idea, maybe they just hate Jews more than they like their fellow Muslims?

Important note- the Muslim countries treated their Jews much, much better than the Europeans. There were almost no pogroms and definitely no holocaust, and the Jews mostly prospered. Until Israel was founded.

So it's not like Muslims have some inherent antisemitism- I think that a passionate hatred of the West, caused by both legitimate reasons (colonial oppression) and others (religious fanaticism or Arab nationalism), hits much closer to the mark. Once the JewsTM started settling in a land claimed by the Muslims and "invading" the Dar al-Islam, and once they started representing the West in the eyes of their neighbours, then antisemitic ideas rapidly started taking hold.

That's my take, at least.

You've touched an important historical context that is often overlooked. Many Muslims saw the Jewish migration to Palestine as the extension of the European colonialism (as it's been endorsed by the British government in the Balfour Declaration). I don't want to get into "what could've been and what should've been" after 1948 here, but it did originte from "geopolitical reasons", rather than anything characteristic to the Muslim faith and doctrine (the Koran explicitly considers Jews and Christians as members of the same, wider Abrahamic family).

I think it's a combination of these factors. Since the fall of the Ottoman Empire, the Middle East struggled to find an identity and a regional order, but whatever disagreements the Arab nations had on the right order- pan-Islamic, pan-Arabic or particular Arabic- Israel violated this order. For the pan-Islamic Arabs it invaded the Dar al-Islam, the nation of Islam, and for the pan-Arabics it was declared war against fellow Arabs. Hatred of colonialism alone, while a very important factor, couldn't have been the only factor, considering the united front initially presented against Israel by all Arab nations, even those frienlier to the West (like Iraq, Jordan and Saudi Arabia).
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