10 horses left to be the democratic nominee in 08. Who gets your vote today

[TheresNoMoney]

Feingold.

[TheresNoMoney]

The wingnuts who decide the nomination process aren't as smart as we are.

The people you refer to as "wingnuts" definitely won't be voting for Hillary. Hillary fans are mainly the DLC crowd.

[TheresNoMoney]

I know, that's why I wonder why the same misconception is repeated.

The "liberal" wing of the party likes Wesley Clark and Russ Feingold much more than Hillary.

[TheresNoMoney]

He's right.  Many of "wingnuts" despise Hillary.  Hell, they despise anyone who is DLC.  These are the people who argued John Kerry was too moderate and dismissed Obama as soon as he joined the DLC.

Obama is not in the DLC.

My problem with the DLC is that many of them are stooges for big business. The overall goal of the DLC is admirable, but they are not economically populist enough for my taste.

[TheresNoMoney]

I think Justice Ben is right. Hillary is the candidate of the "establishment". The people who will vote for her are those who don't pay too much attention to everyday politics, but like her name recognition and status. These are the people who want to go back to the Clinton days (I can't really blame them there). She will also have much support from those at the top of the food chain in the Democratic party.

No one will come close to Hillary when it comes to name recognition, status, and fundraising power. How well that will translate into votes remains to be seen.

[TheresNoMoney]

Warner. Not because hes my closest choice (obviously) but because he has the best chance of winning

I also like Warner a lot. He is by far my favorite of all the DLC candidates.

[TheresNoMoney]

He may be a better politician, but he is not stronger.  Many Dean supporters will rally around Feingold, but he will not have the "movement" that Dean had.

While he may not have the "movement", he will appeal to a much wider constituency. He is much more skilled, experienced and smarter than Dean ever was.

Feingold will appeal to many voters disillusioned with politics as usual, and will have much greater rural appeal than other Democrats due to his economic populism and straight-talking approach. He is much more of a "man of the people" than any of the other candidates, except maybe Mark Warner.

[TheresNoMoney]

If the Republicans nominate John McCain, I doubt any Democrat can beat him.

We just have to hope they nominate Frist, Brownback, Allen, or one of other wingnuts.

[TheresNoMoney]

In the end i think Allen'll win it and he's a strong candidate but not the steam roller McCain would be, against Hillary I'd vote for McCain simply because I know he'd be a better president than her... at the same time I'd vote for Feingold over McCain (despite my disagreements with the guy) and would vote for Bayh in a heartbeat...

It's tough to say who our strongest candidate would be against McCain. I honestly think you'd have to take a risk and go with Feingold.

By the way, what specifically are your disagreements with Feingold?

[TheresNoMoney]

Social Issues I'm affraid, most importantly for me (abortion) you'll not have a pro-life Dem national ticket for decades

The majority in this country are pro-choice and a good majority of women (who the issue truly affects). I have no problem with pro-life Democrats, but making abortion illegal would be a nightmare for this country. It wouldn't make much sense running a pro-life Democrat, as it would alienate many, many women Democratic voters and pretty much ensure a loss.

but I still favour folks like Bayh and Warner who pretty much seem to share my concerns and vote acordingly.

Both are pro-choice as well, although they may favor a few restrictions.

I'm probably also more pro-second amendment and certianly more Hawkish...

Feingold is pretty moderate on gun issues. He's evolved into being more pro-gun as his time in the Senate has gone on. He was one of only 6 (I think) Democrats to vote against renewing the assault weapons ban. The NRA gives him a "C" rating I think, which beats Evan Bayh. I believe that Feingold will leave gun control up to the states and city governments.

As for his hawkishness, I don' t think he is weak in that sense. I just think he is very pragmatic in his approach to war. He only votes for wars which he deems extremely neccessary (like Afghanistan). He has proven to be right time after time. The majority of the country now thinks Iraq was a mistake. Feingold had the foresight to see that it would not go well and that the country would likely not be any better off because of it. I think you will be impressed when you hear him speak of foreign policy.

He's a great Democrat and one of the finest senators of his generation, and i wouldn't even rule out backing him in the primaries, but we disagree on a whole load of stuff...

That's good to know. You can never have a candidate who you will agree with 100% of the time. Having Russ Feingold as president would help ensure that the priorities of this country will shift back to where they should be, education, healthcare, expanding the economic future of the country, and foreign policy. There would be much less focus on divisive social issues and the role of religion in government. Those issues would be left alone and again become personal matters, which they should be.

[TheresNoMoney]

I do however share the concern of the majority of Americans that while abortion should be legal it should not be “on demand” nor should late term or partial birth abortions be available except in extreme circumstances, where it must be a regrettable but probably necessary tragedy.

The PBA ban was already passed (although the courts struck it down), so I don't regard that as an issue anymore. I think the "Abortion on demand" phrase is pretty much a myth. Many states already have many restrictions on abortion and the number of abortion providers in this country has dwindled drastically. Take a large state like Ohio, where 91% of the counties don't have one single abortion provider. There are many states where abortion is not readily accessible. I think the best course of action is legislation that will help reduces the number of abortions (increasing access to birth control, morning after pill, sex education, lowering the poverty rate).

But while I opposed the war in Iraq before it began, primarily because I though it unnecessary and that we where ill prepared for it, I’m now very much of the opinion that we have to stay in and sort the mess out… Feingold’s bill to withdraw troops I disagree with

He's not advocating an immediate withdrawal of the troops. He's advocating a flexible target date (December 31, 2006) with specific goals to be met before the troops are withdrawn. Basically he's calling for a concrete plan to get us out of there, instead of the unfocused lack of a plan we currently have. His proposal has (like usual) been distorted by the media. To me, he is taking the sane, middle ground on this. We can't stay there forever and we need to make better progress than we're making.

at the same time I disagree with his “ney” votes on a number of defence and homeland security related bills.

Can you tell me which specific bills you're referring to? I'm not familiar with any of these homeland security bills (unless you're referring to the Patriot Act).

I agree that we would probably see a more positive campaign with little or no mention of social issues that by and large should be left up to the consciences of individual politicians and should not be made into the party political arguing points that they have regrettably become.   

Agreed, but I'll take it a step further and say that they shouldn't be left up to politicians at all, but to the consciences of individual people. I' pretty sick of the federal government trying to legislate morality. Different people have different ideas of morality.

[TheresNoMoney]

The poll results are very telling.

While Hillary is the frontrunner nationally, the only candidates that have the ability to knock her off will be Russ Feingold, Evan Bayh, or Mark Warner.

Everyone else is just competing for the VP spot (Richardson, Vilsack, Biden).

[TheresNoMoney]

29 votes are a small sample.

That is true, but the results of this poll mesh with an article I was reading the other day. Political analyst Tim Saler gave an interview where he said that only Russ Feingold, Evan Bayh, and Mark Warner have any shot to knock off Hillary Clinton for the Democratic nomination (and he gave legitimate reasons why).

Here is a link to the article:

http://tennesseansforfeingold.blogspot.com/