If Non Binary Genders are Real and Just as Valid as Man and Woman...

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Hopefully I don't get censored for saying that I think that Chelsea Manning deserves Federal capital punishment. I phrased it in a more pc manner this time. Anyways, the easier solution is to do it by sex. For me, sex and gender are the same thing for most all intents and purposes, but I do acknowledge that the vast majority see them as separate. But I still think that people should go to the jail/prison based on their birth sex.

I think you should go jail based on your terrible opinions.

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Also I like how the OP doesn't even consider degendering prisons.

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Also I like how the OP doesn't even consider degendering prisons.

Locking women prisoners up with male rapists, sexual abusers and all sorts of violent offenders? I don't see a problem at all!

Rapists get special rooms.

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Thinking about things more, the fact that sex segregated prisons seem like such a rape risk implies a problem with society in of itself (ie If we can't trust people to be in mixed prisons without serious problems, our culture has a pretty nasty streak through it). Though prison rape is already a huge problem, by both inmates and prisoners. Honestly, I think with proper guarding (if we could manage that, which is a massive "if"), a prison design that dies r cause the awful prison culture we have now, and segregated rooms, we could probably make it work.

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Not hard. Just put them in a mental hospital until they come to terms with reality

yikes

I mean... is that really so different than most of the sentiments expressed by the right wingers on this thread?

Anyway, if we eliminate prison sentences for nonviolent crimes, the problem of how to handle gender identity and its overlaps and disjunctures with biological sex in prison siloing, while still thorny, would affect a whole lot fewer people 

Wait so people who recognize basic biology are now right wingers?

I'd love to live in a world where reality isn't seen as a partisan issue.

Says a Republican in 2018.

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Not hard. Just put them in a mental hospital until they come to terms with reality

yikes

I mean... is that really so different than most of the sentiments expressed by the right wingers on this thread?

Anyway, if we eliminate prison sentences for nonviolent crimes, the problem of how to handle gender identity and its overlaps and disjunctures with biological sex in prison siloing, while still thorny, would affect a whole lot fewer people 

Wait so people who recognize basic biology are now right wingers?

I'd love to live in a world where reality isn't seen as a partisan issue.

Says a Republican in 2018.

So if I had a red avatar you wouldn't actually have an argument.

Anyway, if you want to pretend that non-binary genderqueer trigenders are real, then you can do that.  The problem is when people declare it to be a civil rights issue, which means that people like me are the equivalent of the KKK.  If I have a student who thinks that they are a non binary gender and I don't play along I might lose my job.

I was being snarky about the incredible irony of that statement.

Even if it wasn't "real", refusing to respect a student on things as trivial as pronouns means you probably shouldn't be a teacher. Also, honest question, would you respect the pronouns and identity of a binary trans person?

BTW Do you have any evidence that it doesn't exist? Chromosomes aren't an argument because brain gender and body sex aren't the same thing. Trans people aren't claiming they have the chromosomes of their gender.

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Even if it wasn't real?  So feelings are more important to you than reality?  For the record, while I'd call the person by whatever name they chose, I would not use some zie/zir/zimself pronoun.

Your entire argument is based on your unsubstantiated feeling that physical sex is the sole determinant of gender.

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If you want to invalidate other people's identities, you get burden of proof.

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So because physical sex is a thing, mental gender has to match it?

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Linguistics is irrelevant to reality. Words can change meaning, and the differentiation is useful.

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Oh my god are you really claiming that physical sex and mental gender are the same thing because "gender" and "sex" have roughly the same meaning to most people? Now, I'm using the definition of "sex = physical, gender = mental" here for conveniences sake,  so don't try using etymology to argue. Gender isn't about "biological function", it's about identity. Trans people aren't denying that they have the parts of their birth sex.

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For someone who's claiming your position is based on biological reality you sure are focused on linguistics and how cultures felt about gender.

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Why should it not be?  What use is the term "gender" if it is divorced from the term "sex."

Are you really this dense? I'm not even sure how to argue against something this stupid/willfully ignorant. There is a mental thing involved in ones identity that is different than physical sex that is most easily labeled gender.

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For the most part, that's false. Of course someone who will never have their identity questioned or attacked wouldn't consider it important...

If you cared about the truth you wouldn't automatically assume they were invalid absent overwhelming proof to the contrary. If there's no evidence on either side, and assuming one side will attack the core of who someone is, one should do anything but assume said side.

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Because that idea objectively hurts people, and isn't even logical(not that you care about actual truth. But seriously, its a f**king absurd idea).

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This would be plainly obvious if you weren't being a disingenuous blockbrain.

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You're denying that enby people (and trans people in general)s existances are valid because of some unsubstantiated claim about the words sex and gender supposedly having meaning the exact same thing(and with zero difference in connotation or tone, apparently) before trans people decided a distinction between physical and mental gender needed different words for convenient communication. And AFAIK sex has always had a clinical, private partsy implication, while gender has more often been used to talk about the social aspects of it, not that it would matter if your linguistics claims were correct anyway.

According to oxford, "Gender" means

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So yeah. Stop playing the definition game.

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Words gain different meanings when people start using them in different ways, Mr Einstein. And it doesn't matter if you're as right as one can be when ascribing absolute meaning to words, that only makes talking about mental gender (I'm using the word """""""""""""""wrong""""""""""""""" because I like not writing an essay to describe something that can be said in a single word. If you read this like I'm saying gender as you (erroneously) define it, than just stop). 10000000000000000 times more of a pain. Why should peoples identities be vetoed by etymology?

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Are you really this dense? I'm not even sure how to argue against something this stupid/willfully ignorant. There is a mental thing involved in ones identity that is different than physical sex that is most easily labeled gender.

I, like most Americans, grew up with the words used interchangeably.  I know that you identify as a gender other than the one you were born as.  That doesn't make you that gender.

And that is irrelevant to the identity of trans people. You don't get to invalidate us because we use a word differently.

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Racism was wrong because it hurt people and attacked the core of their humanity.

And let me guess, people with depression or anxiety have to "prove" they're not just making it all up? You have literally zero evidence that its a fantasy. Do you have any idea how hard it is to "prove" ones identity? You need millions in grant money, a team of researchers, and decades of time. Until or unless that happens, the only inkling of evidence we have is that the one person who actually sees their own heart and soul feels the way they do.

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As Crabcake said, less than 1% of people regret it. Seriously, f**k you. You don't give a damn about me; you're just doing this for your own BS prejudices.

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I'ma just say this again.

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F**king Oxford disagrees.

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Denying someone is who they say they are because they can't prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt is invalidating them.

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False Dichotomy based on your own feelings about other people with zero evidence or factors making it seem more likely.

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Not really. "Sex" always has a more clinical, biological tone, and gender is more used for cultural aspects. I think I'll take Oxford over the word of someone living in a regressive hellhole bubble.

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And why do you get to decide who is and isn't valid. You clearly don't respect me, or you might consider deprioritizing your transphobia. And seriously, go f**k yourself with your patronizing BS.





Also, learn to format.

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Racism was wrong because it hurt people and attacked the core of their humanity.

And let me guess, people with depression or anxiety have to "prove" they're not just making it all up? You have literally zero evidence that its a fantasy. Do you have any idea how hard it is to "prove" ones identity? You need millions in grant money, a team of researchers, and decades of time. Until or unless that happens, the only inkling of evidence we have is that the one person who actually sees their own heart and soul feels the way they do.

Oh, so gender dysphoria is now equated to depression/anxiety, both serious mental disorders. Hmm, you made my point for me.

That's a pretty f##ked up interpretation of what I said. Neither of those are labels that make people "just crazy" or whatever gross s##t you believe. The point is that denying that trans people's struggles are real because they don't have "proof" is equivalent to declaring that people don't have anxiety or depression unless they prove it's a biological reality or whatever.

It's pretty clear that the only thing you're interested in its being transphobic.

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Race actually is a social construct, but it is still ridiculous for Rachel Dolezal to identify as something she clearly isn't.  But at least what she identifies as exists, unlike genderqueer or two-spirit.

The problem people had with Rachel Dolezal saying she was black was that she was lying about having faced the struggles that black people face when she was actually white bread from Montana. Or something along those lines. I haven't read anything about it in a while.

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i

You say with zero evidence. (there are zero races, race isn't real, its just BS invented by europeans hundreds of years ago so they could be evil for gawd).

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So you know that there are studies contradicting your opinion(I'd like to see how many of the ones "supporting" your assertions are complete BS or not saying what you think) and yet you feel the right to invalidate us with absolute certainty.

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But being a child is a """Biological fact""". You don't get to ignore fact because of your feelings.

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And that means you get to invalidate us as people why? (also Oxford). Your argument is that your personal definition of a word trumps respecting trans people.

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There was certainly a debate over whether black people were human beings, which, regardless of your "oh, I respect you but I won't even accept the core of your identity shtick, is a thing happening for trans* people too.

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"I don't deny that some people have depression. I just don't think that changing peoples brains with medication is the solution."

Your feelings about our bodies mean nothing. You have no idea what its like to be like this, you have no right to decide for us because of your narrowminded view of "reality".(we know that our body resembles our birth sex pre-hrt(afterwards its complicated).
 

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Because not hating me isn't a sacred part of your identity, and you're obviously being disingenuous all over the place(including here).

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I didn't know that "cuck" meant "You'd know damn well what I meant if you were arguing in good faith."

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Only as an "informal" meaning under the academic meaning.

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Plus people objectively use literally "wrong" all the time. It annoys me because the traditional definition of "literally" is useful and has no good synonyms, not because its magically incorrect because reasons.

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Race doesn't exist, and I've explained the problem people have with it in detail.

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It would have to be powerful enough to overcome how much better I feel on HRT. Yeah, I would bet my life that its not possible to genuinely prove (as opposed to some disingenuous pseudoproof) that trans people should be treated as who they really are (or "say they are" as you would put it).

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Thats pretty irrelevant to what I said. Don't dodge my questions. And I'm not going to be kept up at night by some anecdote based on multi-decade-old confirmation bias corrupted memory of a few physics professors or whatever whining about the assault on gender.

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Are you really being pedantic over the word "transphobia"? Disregarding this, if respecting a trivial request that obviously matters a lot to the student is something you're unwilling to even consider, then you shouldn't be a teacher.