Bernie wins Clark county NV convention vote

[Joe Republic]

I'm sitting right here, and the results were about 2200 for Hillary and 2900 for Bernie.

I'll post more when I know more.

[Joe Republic]

Just got home.  I left early because... ugh, what a mess.  Seven straight hours of standing and sitting around will test anybody's patience.

Both campaigns were enthusiastic, but my god the Bernie supporters are intense.  To the point of borderline terrifying.

At one point a man was running up and down the aisle screaming that two Bernie supporters had been arrested for catching some Hillary operatives apparently reallocating Bernie delegates as Hillary delegates.  His evidence for this came from a YouTube video that he had not himself seen.

Then as I was leaving, along with hundreds of other tired delegates from both sides, a teenager with a megaphone was begging the Bernie supporters to turn around and go back inside, because the remaining Hillary delegates were going to overturn the results and declare a Hillary victory.

[Joe Republic]

At one point a man was running up and down the aisle screaming that two Bernie supporters had been arrested for catching some Hillary operatives apparently reallocating Bernie delegates as Hillary delegates.  His evidence for this came from a YouTube video that he had not himself seen.

Can anybody explain to me how it makes sense to arrest Bernie supporters for catching Hillary supporters committing voter fraud?

Exactly.  The paranoid crazy was out in force.

[Joe Republic]

The will of the voters who didn't bother to show up?

The voters showed up on February 20th, which they had understood would be the day on which Nevadans would decide on the presidential nominee.  The arcane procedures that followed are hardly the hallmark of a free, fair and open democracy, as evidenced today.

[Joe Republic]

Let's be clear on this: How exactly did a Clinton win turn into a Sanders win here? My understanding is that of the many delegates chosen at the initial caucuses, a lot failed to come out to the county conventions. Then, because more Sanders delegates (and alternates) showed up than Clinton delegates, Sanders was able to take the lead. Now, how is it that Clinton delegates failing to show up for the event they were chosen to attend represents anything other than a failure on the part of the Clinton campaign in turning out responsible delegates? Please correct me if I'm wrong (I may very well be since I'm not too familiar with caucus rules), but isn't this a Sanders win simply because more of his delegates actually showed up?

This shouldn't have to be a test of endurance, to see how many days of events taking up several hours (half of which spent standing outside in the sun) each candidate's supporters can survive.

[Joe Republic]

Oh I completely agree that these caucus rules are horrible, I'm just trying to figure out what people are talking about with Sanders shenanigans when it seems the only fault comes from the rules of the caucus itself and the lack in number of Clinton delegates.

I'm not calling shenanigans.  The Sanders people won today's vote fair and square; my complaint is this system that allowed for it in the first place.

[Joe Republic]

Based on the fact that the Nevada Delegate Selection Plan calls the Feb 20 vote non-binding, and Section 7.a. therein, I'm led to believe that the May 14 vote is independent of today's vote, as today's vote was independent of the Feb 20 vote.

That's what I've been saying. It's a 3 tier process. This was the 2nd tier. The 3rd tier is the one who actually choose the national convention delegates. So while it's looking good for Bernie, things aren't set in stone until the state convention.

So you're ok with Bernie potentially coming away with more national delegates, even though more voters showed up to vote for Hillary in the first stage?

(Don't sidetrack this by bringing up superdelegate skewing in other states; I agree they need to go.)

[Joe Republic]

BTW question for the Nevadans who attended today's Clark county convention, did they break delegates  down by congressional district or just county wide?

The entire convention hall remained as one group of county-wide delegates.

[Joe Republic]

So you're ok with Bernie potentially coming away with more national delegates, even though more voters showed up to vote for Hillary in the first stage?

The first-round caucuses are like voting for Representatives to the House. They represent the will of the people, however imperfectly. If a Congressman is absent (like Marco Rubio apparently), then he does not get a voice. The Hillary-supporting county delegates should have shown up.

No, don't try and argue that this system is fair or makes any sense.

[Joe Republic]

I'm not a fan of caucuses, but let's not get all silly here. Everything went according to peculiar rules the caucuses are operating under and all conspiracy talk is just stupid.

Also, I wish some people would have as much intellectual integrity to remember about supedelegates while condemning caucuses as undemocratic. Both thing are. But I guess it's OK when it's benefit your candidate...

Who is calling this a conspiracy?  The only conspiracy accusations I witnessed yesterday firsthand came from the Bernie side, and not one of them was verified or made any sense.

Who has argued in favor of superdelegates here?

[Joe Republic]

Interesting insight into the debacle:  http://letstalknevada.com/convention-catastrophe-election-2016-special-report/?fb_ref=1326fc2bd4fe48eeb4fd4e9839a22b1b-Facebook