Association Football 2023/2024 Discussion Thread

[DavidB.]

The Champions League draw was today:

Salzburg vs Bayern
City vs Sporting
Benfica vs Ajax
Chelsea vs Lille
Atletico vs United
Villareal vs Juventus
Inter vs Liverpool
PSG vs Real Madrid

Well, Lille, Salzburg and Sporting are "toasted". But there will be good matches like the the Madrid-PSG, or the Atletico vs United.

Also, props for UEFA for botching up the game draw.

Just booked my ticket to Lisbon. #letsgo

Going to be two tough games though. Benfica to me seems much more of a defending side than Sporting, who play much more attractive football. I watched the PSV-Benfica CL qualifier earlier this season on tv and while it is true that Benfica kind of had to defend there given that they received a red card early in the game, it wasn't fun to watch at all. And Ajax don't tend to perform well against sides that "park the bus" and don't want to attack. At the same time, Inter, Ajax' original opponent, probably does the same thing but with better players. Still, on the betting market, the odds seem to be way too optimistic for Ajax. Looking forward to a fun awayday though (if I get in at all given Covid regulations and all that). My last one was Dortmund-Ajax in November, which was amazing.

[DavidB.]

Africa Cup being Africa Cup: the ref for Tunisia-Mali blew the final whistle in the 85th minute already, let the game continue after protests, gave a completely unwarranted red card, and then ended the game again in the 89th minute

Ajax brought back Brian Brobbey on loan from RB Leipzig.

Dumbest transfer ever. By the end of the season Haller is probably leaving and Ajax will have no choice but to buy back Brobbey (#BBB) for like 10 million euros while he had walked off to Leipzig for naught after being in the Ajax academy for like his whole life. He f**ked up Ajax really well, but he's also really stupid and the real bad guy in the story is his agent Mino Raiola.

Ajax also sold off David Neres to Shakhtar Donetsk for 16 million and is looking to buy or loan Steven Bergwijn from Tottenham Hotspur. He's likely to be the most expensive player Ajax ever bought. Big question is: where is he even going to play? He's not going to replace Tadic, Haller or Antony.

[DavidB.]

So annoyed by people claiming Real Madrid were "lucky". You don't eliminate PSG, Chelsea, Manchester City (probably the most difficult path to the final imaginable, and often with amazing comebacks) - and then win the CL vs. Liverpool with sheer luck. That's actually world class quality.

[DavidB.]

Man United just bought Ajax winger Antony for € 100 million.

[DavidB.]

My final verdict:

UEFA Champions League Group Stage draw is done.

Group A: Liverpool, Ajax, Napoli, Rangers
Group B: FC Porto, Bayer Leverkusen, Atletico Madrid, Club Brugge
Group C: Bayern Munich, Barcelona, Inter Milan, Viktora Plzen
Group D:  Eintracht Frankfurt, Tottenham Hotspur, Sporting CP, Marseille
Group E: AC Milan, Chelsea, RB Salzburg, Dinamo Zagreb
Group F: Real Madrid, RB Leipzig, Shaktar Donetsk, Celtics
Group G:  Manchester City, Sevilla, Borussia Dortmund, FC Copenhagen
Group H: PSG, Juventus, Benfica, Maccabi Haifa

A:
Liverpool
Napoli
Ajax
Rangers

Ajax potentially better than last year with exciting new players, but so many aren't used to playing together and the schedule doesn't help... Napoli have a really exciting squad this year, with Kvartskhelia added. Will get interesting between place 2-3-4.

B:
Atletico
Porto
Club
Leverkusen

Leverkusen have a really bad start. With Yaremchuk in and Lang staying, Club have a decent squad.

C:
Bayern
Inter
Barcelona
Plzen

Group of death. Hoping Barcelona don't qualify for the knockout stage. Has become a dirty club.

D:
Spurs
Marseille
Frankfurt
Sporting

Sporting and Frankfurt lack quality. Marseille dangerous and underestimated.

E:
Milan
Chelsea
Salzburg
Zagreb

Chelsea bad start.

F:
Real Madrid
Leipzig
Celtic
Shakhtar

Poor Shakhtar lost all their good players.

G:
City
Sevilla
Dortmund
Copenhagen

Both Sevilla and Dortmund lack quality. Copenhagen upset unlikely but not impossible.

H:
PSG
Juventus
Benfica
Haifa

Wouldn't rule out Benfica upset.

The Europa League Group Stage draw is done.

Group A: Arsenal, PSV, Bodo/Glimt, FC Zurich
Group B: Dyanmo Kyiv, Rennes, Fenerbache, AEK Lacarna
Group C: Roma, Ludogorets Razgrad, Real Betis, HJK Helsinki
Group D: Braga, Malmo, Union Berlin, Union Saint-Gilliose
Group E: Manchester United, Real Sociadad, Sherrif Tiraspol, Athletic Club Onomia Nicosia
Group F: Lazio, Feyernood, Midtylland, Strum Graz
Group G: Olympiacos, Qarabag, Freiburg, Nantes
Group H: Red Star Belgrade, Monaco, Ferencvaros, Trabzonspor

A:
Arsenal
PSV
Bodo
Zürich

Boring group.

B:
Rennes
Fenerbahce
Kyiv
Larnaca

Interesting group.

C:
Roma
Betis
Ludogorets Razgrad
HJK Helsinki

D:
Union Berlin
Braga
RUSG
Malmö

Interesting group. Difficult to predict RUSG.

E:
United
Sociedad
Sheriff
Omonoia Nicosia

F:
Lazio
Feyenoord
Sturm Graz
Midtjylland

Midtjylland have become incredibly poor.

G:
Freiburg
Nantes
Qarabag
Olympiakos

Interesting group.

H:
Monaco
Red Star
Trabzonspor
Ferencvaros

Group of death.

The UECL group stage:
Group A: İstanbul Başakşehir, Fiorentina, Heart of Midlothian, RFS
Group B: West Ham United, FCSB, Anderlecht, Silkeborg
Group C: Villarreal, Hapoel Be'er Sheva, Austria Wien, Lech Poznań
Group D: Partizan, FC Köln, Nice, Slovácko
Group E: AZ Alkmaar, Apollon Limassol, Vaduz, Dnipro-1
Group F: Gent, Molde, Shamrock Rovers, Djurgårdens IF
Group G: Slavia Prague, CFR Cluj, Sivasspor, Ballkani
Group H: Basel, Slovan Bratislava, Žalgiris, Pyunik

A:
Fiorentina
Istanbul
Hearts
RFS

B:
West Ham
Anderlecht
Steaua
Silkeborg

C:
Villarreal
Beer Sheva
Austria Wien
Lech Poznan

D:
Köln
Nice
Partizan
Slovacko

E:
AZ
Apollon
Dnipro
Vaduz

F:
Molde
Gent
Djurgardens
Shamrock Rovers

G:
Slavia Prague
Sivasspor
Cluj
Ballkani

H:
Basel
Zalgris
Slovan
Pyunik

[DavidB.]

Arsenal's perfect start got upended by Manchester United 3-1. Gabriel Martinelli's wrongly disallowed goal by VAR changed the course of the game.

Nah. Obvious foul on Eriksen.

[DavidB.]

Absolutely loved Dinamo's fighting spirit tonight. For me, the result of the night, however, is Shakhtar winning 4 to 1 against Germany's least appealing side: Red Bull FC. After the hell Shakhtar have been through, after the mass exodus of foreign players, they still managed to win a CL game. Football is beautiful.

[DavidB.]

Is RB Leipzig that unlikeable, though? Yes, they are a bit plastic, but they develop young players and being owned by a tacky energy drink company is surely not worse than being owned by an oil emirate or a shady billionaire?

At least Chelsea/City/PSG were actual football clubs before they were taken over by emirates/billionaires. Leipzig was literally founded in 2009 by Red Bull, which means the club has no soul whatsoever and is the epitome of everything wrong with modern football, even though I admit their playing philosophy itself isn't bad.

[DavidB.]

Napoli pulls off a pretty impressive upset, demolishes Liverpool 4-1.

Not sure what happened to Liverpool. 4-1 was merciful to them. Absolutely brutal.

I thought the battle between spots 2-3-4 would become tight in this group, but it seems like the real battle is between 1-2-3. Rangers were absolutely atrocious against Ajax with an xG of 0.09. I still think they should be able to get at least some points at Ibrox, but with Ajax as former most likely potential contender for spot 3 and this goal difference, I think it is overwhelmingly likely Rangers will end up fourth.

Hoping for an Ajax upset at Anfield next week.

[DavidB.]

I have to wonder, if following Ellzabeth II's death, the the British Clubs still taking part in European Football (Liverpool, Rangers, Tottenham Hotspur, Chelsea, Celtic, Manchester City, Arsenal, Manchester United, Heart of Midlothian, West Ham United) will continue in their respective competitions, or if they will withdraw.

They will play, UEFA confirmed it yesterday. Other sports associations in the UK don't even cancel their games this weekend; they will honor the Queen before the games.

And some of these clubs don't have any love lost for the Queen in the first place. Unfortunately, I expect a "minute of silence" filled with intense booing at Anfield, and it would have been the same if Celtic were to play at home.

[DavidB.]

Why at Anfield? I know the whole story with Celtic, but what would Liverpool have against the Queen even if it's a leftwing city?

The whole "we're not English, we're Scouse" thing + the sentiment that the Royal Family didn't pay sufficient attention to the victims of the Hillsborough Disaster + the city's general left-wing bent as you mentioned (in a rather different way than in a city like Manchester, due to their different identity - see point 1).

Just have a look at the quote tweets for Liverpool's tweet on the Queen's passing, which came a lot later than the other PL clubs' response and has reactions turned off for a reason.

[DavidB.]

Want to pick with the big boys?

https://atlasafterdark.freeforums.net/thread/12256

Wrong type of football.

[DavidB.]

Sad week. Didn't want to believe my prediction here would come true, but it seems likely at this point. Napoli's shock win over Liverpool screwed up Ajax' chances from the start. Liverpool were always going to bounce back. Ajax fans are really angry now, but I can't blame the squad for losing 2-1 in one of the final minutes against a team like Liverpool. Based on the game, 5-0 wouldn't have been undeserved either (that, however, would be something to be angry about).

I don't know to be honest. The team was already in a bad place and the situation is now even more complicated after Sérgio Conceição's car, with his family and young kids inside, was attacked and vandalized with stones as he was leaving the stadium.

That's really sad to hear and unacceptable... do you think this is the reason Francisco Conceiçao is absent at Ajax again? He's missed quite a few games already, flying back and forth for family-related stuff. Also, do you know why he wanted to leave Porto in the first place? And why are Benfica and Sporting fans making jokes about him and swimming pools?

Sherrif Tiraspol fails to capture last year's magic, loses to Manchester United 2-0 in yesterday's Europa League action.

Crazy to see a player like Ronaldo in the UEL. Painful to watch, and I'm not even a fan.

[DavidB.]

Ajax - Union Berlin is tasty, reckon Mayor Halsema will follow her Belgian counterpart and try to ban all Germans from Amsterdam for that.

Why? Will be trying to go to the away game. Hope they wouldn't reciprocate a move like that.

A week after Lazio defied all expectations and won handily in Bergamo without Immobile, they are complete exposed at home by Salernitana who catapult themselves into ninth (!) in Serie A.

No idea what the deal with them is, this season. Got kicked out of the Europa League after a shameful campaign. Now winning against Roma again.

[DavidB.]

It's the latest trend amongst certain mayors to ban any fanscene that is remotely a bit on the rough side. Leuvens mayor saw their UEFA van and banned not just them from the stadium but the whole city and gave orders to the police to interrogate Germans. Halsema is capable of similar...see also : her ban of PSV fans for ... reasons...

As a football fan I am obviously opposed to nonsensical bans, but Halsema's 'reasons' to ban PSV fans were quite solid. In every Ajax-PSV game since 2017 they had chanted antisemitic songs and they had been warned countless times. I obviously don't think there should be a blanket ban on PSV supporters visiting the Arena from now on (just like I disagree with the blanket ban on Feyenoord and Ajax supporters visiting the Klassieker away games), but the ban for this game was completely reasonable. (Wish there had been a ban on organizing the game itself, but that's a different story...)

[DavidB.]

One Hag
Two Hag
Three Hag, Four Hag, Five Hag
Six Hag
Seven Hag
Eight Hag, Nine Hag, Ten Hag (Ten Hag)
Etc

[DavidB.]

Arsenal are actually going to lose the title. Incredible.

[DavidB.]

Has Manchester United done enough to make the Champions League? They beat Aston Villa 1-0 at Old Trafford, and now have a seven point lead over fifth-placed Liverpool with a game in hand (and two in hand over both Tottenham and Aston Villa, sitting nine points back in sixth and seventh respectively).

Manchester United ends the season @ Brighton and Hove Albion, @ West Ham United, vs Wolverhampton Wanderers, @ AFC Bournemouth, vs Chelsea, @ Fulham, all (except maybe Chelsea) expected to be easy wins for Manchester United.

If Liverpool win all of their last five games, they have 71 points. United are now at 63, so they need 9 more to get there for sure (one more than Liverpool, who have a better goal difference) out of 18 possible points. Winning only vs. West Ham, Wolves, and Bournemouth would already be enough. United have also played one game fewer than Newcastle, so they have a bigger chance of finishing 3rd than finishing 5th. I'd say they have a 85% chance of entering the CL by now.

I think United will end with about the same number of points (74) as in 20/21 under Solskjaer when they finished second, maybe even a few more. Actually a very decent result given the troubles that they've had.

[DavidB.]

Now official: Napoli are the Italian champions. This squad is already legendary. Only a shame they couldn't go all the way in the UCL too.

[DavidB.]

Unbelievable how United screwed up. Their massive problem is they don't have a proper finisher. I love Weghorst to bits, but he's not Manchester United starting XI material - and neither is Martial.

Ten Hag really needs to clean up the house this summer, particularly attack and defense - too mediocre. Only Shaw (except tonight...), Martinez, Varane, Casemiro, Eriksen, Fred (unexpectedly) and Bruno Fernandes have truly proven their worth this year. Dalot out, Maguire out, McTominay out, Martial out, and last chance for Sancho, Malacia, Antony, Weghorst, Wan-Bissaka, and De Gea. Varane replacement in (injured 75% of the year; Min-Jae Kim?), striker in (Kane would be a safe choice), and some positions that require more depth on the bench.

[DavidB.]

Dear God...

https://twitter.com/vsports_pt/status/1655297741117898765

Also a fail:
https://twitter.com/VideoEredivisie/status/1654936065919049728