VA: Public Policy Polling: Obama leads all Republicans (user search)
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  VA: Public Policy Polling: Obama leads all Republicans (search mode)
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Author Topic: VA: Public Policy Polling: Obama leads all Republicans  (Read 6452 times)
Alcon
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« on: December 15, 2011, 11:02:27 PM »

"Statistical tie", also known as a "50/50 chance" .

Not how statistics work
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Alcon
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« Reply #1 on: December 16, 2011, 01:20:16 AM »
« Edited: December 16, 2011, 01:28:53 AM by Alcon »

A statistical tie is a question of the margin of error.

It's a dumb term -- just because you're not 95% sure it isn't a tie doesn't mean it should be treated as likely 50/50.

But that is roughly how probability works if if one can't determine the difference between a 57-43 chance and a 43-57 chance. At this stage one can't make so easy a distinction. A few days from Election Day we will see far more states that look as if they are in the margin of error clearly show which side of 50-50.  

That...what?  The fact that preferences are more fluid now, and likely voters more concrete, has nothing to do with this statistical calculation.

An exact tie looks much like a 50-50 chance. Statistical ties close to even, especially if they are poll numbers bouncing around exact ties, look like 50-50 chances. When the numbers quit bouncing, then one has something other than a 50-50 chance.

Again, just because we can't be more than 95% sure there isn't a tie, doesn't mean a 94% chance should be assumed to be a tie.  "Statistical tie" is a dumb, dumb term.

In the end there are no statistical ties except absolutely-even counts. Dubya won Florida by 537 votes in 2000, and we define that as a victory for Dubya because such is how the law is set for determining who wins the election. Barack Obama ended up with a few more than 28K votes more than John McCain in Indiana, and by definition that was a win for Barack Obama even if it was a statistical tie (a 0.03% difference).

I don't even understand how you're apply MoE to what's supposed to be a population, not a sample, and cannot realistically be a representative sample if you're treating it as a population (e.g., if you claim there are improperly uncounted ballots or something.)
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Alcon
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« Reply #2 on: December 16, 2011, 08:10:19 PM »

It's a probabilistic model. What it lacks in precision it makes up for in simplicity. It shows no significance in the difference between winning 270 electoral votes and winning 370 electoral votes.  The difference between winning 268 and 270 electoral votes is what matters in the end. The point spread does not matter so much as does whether the President can have Congressional majorities.

MoE applies to an individual poll. If the President is up by 2% in even one "must-win" state against even one candidate in every poll in one state (let us say Virginia) then the Republican nominee who absolutely must win Ohio is in deep trouble no matter how well he might be doing in Arizona, Florida, Missouri, North Carolina, and Virginia at the time. Before the campaign is really underway, a 2% lead for the President in such a state as Virginia means little. In mid-October a consistent set of small leads for the President in Ohio is much more definitive.

So far we have generally seen the President ahead in one state that the Republicans must win rather consistently. Last month it was Ohio. This month it may be Virginia.  Next month it could be Florida.  

Do you realize that your response has nothing to do with my post?
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