Do you think "cross-family conversions" are OK? (user search)
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  Do you think "cross-family conversions" are OK? (search mode)
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Poll
Question: Do you think "cross-family conversions" are OK?
#1
Yes, as is any religious conversion that isn't done by coercion or force
 
#2
Yes, but converting to something outside of your family's background entirely is not OK
 
#3
It depends entirely on the reason for it
 
#4
No
 
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Partisan results

Total Voters: 31

Author Topic: Do you think "cross-family conversions" are OK?  (Read 1153 times)
I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
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« on: March 14, 2022, 05:03:22 PM »

What I'm referring to doesn't really have a name but it's quite common, so I'll have to describe it here.

Basically imagine a mixed marriage: Parent A belongs to religion/denomination X, Parent B belongs to religion/denomination Y. Parents have kids. They agree to raise them in one parent's religion (usually the mother's honestly.) So we'll assume that Parent A is the mother and Parent B is the father. Child is raised in religion/denomination X.

Then the child grows up and decides based on their experiences they prefer the father (Parent B)'s religions/denomination Y for whatever reason. So they just basically "convert" very casually, they simply stop affiliating or associating with religion/denomination X entirely and identify as Y. They may not be a very active or practicing member, possibly even just a "Christmas/Easter" type (using Christian examples for familiarity purpose), but they obviously weren't an active or practicing member of X, basically just shifting their nominal affiliation based on whatever grounds. Let's also assume those grounds are somewhat trivial, or what many people here consider trivial, like politics or preferring the music of Y or because they had some disagreement with a doctrine of X they don't even want to bother trying to work around, etc. etc.

I bring this up because I remember once someone in Dischord or IRC saying something like "if you're any religion other than your parents' or perhaps your spouse, that's not good", in this case you technically are of one of your parents' but not whatever you were raised in...anyway this happens all the time in the Midwest and isn't even particularly controversial, probably because we have so many mixed marriages to begin with but probably isn't as common elsewhere.

But let's use more specific examples: Parent A (mother) is Catholic and Parent B (father) is Episcopalian...kids are brought up Catholic, but then one becomes a teenager and thinks "Wait my dad's church is so much better, it's basically the same thing except it's fine with gays and has female priests, so I'm just going to be that instead" and then completely sheds all vestiges of their Catholic identity and just tell their parents they're going to say they're Episcopalian from now on....even if the father was a purely nominal and non-practicing Episcopalian to begin with, it's the politics and fitting their identity that attracted them, not the "culture" or whatever. Because I know THAT reason gets some people here really triggered for who knows what reason (and as I've noted this is like the one place on the Internet where that's the case, it's completely alien to Reddit and I can't even find it on the ultimate cesspool of hot takes: Twitter), so is it OK in this example because they have some family and ethnic background regardless? And if it's OK is it also OK for someone from a fully Catholic family to do this?

Also let's flip the scenario: the raised Episcopalian kid decides to just identify as Catholic, either because they're more socially conservative and find their social mores more in touch with Catholicism or because they prefer the culture and history of Catholicism or whatever. Does that change the answer?

My answer is obvious: It's totally fine, as is converting even if neither of your parents are that, and any reason you give is totally justifiable as well, (that obviously doesn't mean that I'll approve of or endorse said conversion like in the second flipped scenario but it's also not up to me to say if it's right), but I'm far more conversion-friendly and supportive of "church shopping" than almost anyone else here.
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I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 113,437
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2022, 06:56:58 PM »

Voted for Option 3, but I wouldn't base my opinion of someone's religious conversion on how it relates to their parents' religions. The only way I'd have a problem with it is if I had a problem with the religion itself or if it was a cult or something. Or if, say, they converted to Catholicism because they hate gay people (whereas someone converting to Catholicism for aesthetic reasons, I would have more respect for).

I didn't know that anyone had this specific hangup. Are these religious people that have this problem, or non-religious people?
If by "this specific hangup" you mean "conversion is bad" mostly non-religious here actually.
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I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 113,437
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2022, 09:13:08 AM »

Anyone can practice any religion for any reason. (believes in freedom)
It's kind of bizarre that such a basic and obvious point is missed by so many people here (especially if they're from Ireland.)
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I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 113,437
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2022, 11:31:29 AM »

For the record my favorite example of this was mentioning in IRC/Discord something about a Jewish Minnesota DFL State Representative who actually converted to Judaism even though she has no type of Jewish background at all (her last name is pretty Jewish but only because it's her married name and she converted before she met her now husband) who is kind of notable because she represents an area with a bit of an unfortunate history of anti-Semitism in the 50s and 60s. And someone was like "what the hell? You can't convert to Judaism." And it was pointed out the obvious that people can convert to Judaism, they just don't actively seek converts. And then "But that doesn't make sense, why would someone with no cultural background in Judaism convert?" and it was obvious the idea of someone converting to a religion that doesn't match their ethnic background broke their mind and they couldn't comprehend it...which is rather surreal. Also noticed this crowd also finds it strange when there are Catholics from a sort of WASPy background and has even said they aren't "real Catholics" for a near verbatim quote here. Very strange.
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I spent the winter writing songs about getting better
BRTD
Atlas Prophet
*****
Posts: 113,437
Ukraine


Political Matrix
E: -6.50, S: -6.67

P P
« Reply #4 on: March 19, 2022, 11:50:19 PM »

But let's use more specific examples: Parent A (mother) is Catholic and Parent B (father) is Episcopalian...kids are brought up Catholic, but then one becomes a teenager and thinks "Wait my dad's church is so much better, it's basically the same thing except it's fine with gays and has female priests, so I'm just going to be that instead" and then completely sheds all vestiges of their Catholic identity and just tell their parents they're going to say they're Episcopalian from now on....even if the father was a purely nominal and non-practicing Episcopalian to begin with, it's the politics and fitting their identity that attracted them, not the "culture" or whatever. Because I know THAT reason gets some people here really triggered for who knows what reason (and as I've noted this is like the one place on the Internet where that's the case, it's completely alien to Reddit and I can't even find it on the ultimate cesspool of hot takes: Twitter), so is it OK in this example because they have some family and ethnic background regardless? And if it's OK is it also OK for someone from a fully Catholic family to do this?
Liberal Catholics converting to ECUSA is a widely accepted tenet of cultural Catholicism.

That said, your scenario here doesn't really make any sense — it is always, at some level, about the culture. That's why you get Catholics specifically converting to the Episcopal Church, it's a place that is culturally (and liturgically, etc) comfortable for Catholics to a degree that many other denominations are not.
But what about the many ex-Catholics at my church (and many others like it)? Which is about as opposite of Catholicism as you can get in Christianity.
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