Civil War in Syria

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Rebel caught on video eating heart of dead soldier: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-22523804 (not a link to the actual video)

Surprised nobody posted it... not.

But I'm SURE he's just a single bad apple sullying the reputation of otherwise noble rebel forces, right? Right??

Actually from the article:

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Disturbing but not exactly a war crime in my view anyway, biting the heart of someone who's already dead doesn't hurt the dead person any more than they already are.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Well if the Koran forbids it, that's just evidence AGAINST someone being a radical Islamist.

Regardless it's a lot of debate over one person. I'm sure you could find more than a few cases of Assad's forces desecrating the dead.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Trying to portray the people who started this in a sympathetic manner is pretty vile. The article says "The price of loyalty"...yeah loyalty to a murderous brutal dictator.

If I was an Alawite in Syria, I'd just convert out of it. No way I want to be on the side of a brutal murderer like Assad.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Trying to portray the people who started this in a sympathetic manner is pretty vile. The article says "The price of loyalty"...yeah loyalty to a murderous brutal dictator.

If I was an Alawite in Syria, I'd just convert out of it. No way I want to be on the side of a brutal murderer like Assad.

lol BRTD

yes yes I know, no one outside the US EVER converts and it's impossible for Hispanics to be Lutherans. Because CULTURE OMG!

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I agree it's unlikely that Assad is truly a sincere Alawite (no one would be surprised if it was revealed he has hordes of whiskey and scotch stashes in the presidential palace), but that just provides more of a point against that Alawites are "forced" to support him. I mean if I lived in a country where a nominally Christian dictator (obviously not really Christian of course) was carrying out such a brutal campaign of repression against non-Christians, I'd obviously renounce membership in whatever church he had if it was supporting him. I could still be a Christian independent of that obviously.

And once again, just about all troop estimates show that no more than 20% of the anti-Assad forces are Islamist. Remember in 2011 how we kept hearing how all of the Libyan rebels were radical Islamists with all the "evidence" that the regime was providing to back up its claim? It's amusing how many folks were willing to parrot Gaddafi's propaganda.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Trying to portray the people who started this in a sympathetic manner is pretty vile. The article says "The price of loyalty"...yeah loyalty to a murderous brutal dictator.

If I was an Alawite in Syria, I'd just convert out of it. No way I want to be on the side of a brutal murderer like Assad.

lol BRTD

yes yes I know, no one outside the US EVER converts and it's impossible for Hispanics to be Lutherans. Because CULTURE OMG!

Well no, you actually offer a valid example of conversion, under the threat of force.

The force here isn't for belonging to some psuedo-Islamic offshoot but for supporting a brutal dictator. As Beet pointed out one does not need to support a murderous to dictator to continue to claim to believe in this fake version of Islam.

I find it odd though you'll cite under force to be a "valid" example of conversion, but somehow a Hispanic in the US becoming a Protestant entirely of their own decision isn't?

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

I agree with the view of most Muslim groups (and Xahar) that Alawites are too divergent from Islam to be considered Muslim. Now mind you that as I am not Muslim I don't consider this a negative, since I don't consider real Muslims to be any more correct than the Alawites are. It's like if a Muslim or an atheist was saying Mormons aren't Christian.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Yeah because it's not like the guy was a pro-Assad collaborationist or anything like that.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Yeah because it's not like the guy was a pro-Assad collaborationist or anything like that.

WTF. You are seriously defending their actions based on the chance that he worked with the regime?

Is your hate for catholics that strong?

It doesn't have anything to do with him being Catholic or not. Basically see Max's post. But I'm not going to believe the description on a video uploaded to YouTube by an account that posts only pro-Assad propaganda and is obviously a tool of the regime that rebels go around killing Catholic priests for no reason, and is mostly just being promoted now by right wing sources (I mean seriously, The Daily Mail) that love to parrot the Assad regime's propaganda because they prefer Assad to Obama.

And actually from a more neutral source: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-23138679

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Obviously if the guy was killed by jihadists and he was not an Assad collaborationist, it is a horrible crime (though not carried out by the people Obama is arming.) But we conclude that whoever it is on that video was indeed an Assad supporter.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

So he was shot by Islamists during an attack on a monastery instead of beheaded? That makes me feel better

Given Assad's deplorable record and the rebels' questionable backgrounds, neutrality should be our policy here.

I said above that this is obviously a horrible crime if he was not actually an Assad collaborationist. However the responsible group is Jubhat al-Nusra, not the Free Syrian Army, which Obama is arming.

Furthermore, let's look at the events timeline:

-Fighters in Syria capture and behead two members of Assad's Shabiha paramilitary.
-Jihadists not directly linked to the main Syrian rebel forces attack the monastery in late June killing the priest.
-A video is uploaded to YouTube by an account that only uploads pro-Assad propaganda videos and is obviously a mouthpiece of the regime claiming the priest is beheaded in it.
-All sorts of right wing sources run with it screaming about how the rebels are all barbarians and this is who Obama is arming.

It was an Assad propaganda ploy and you fell for it hook, line and sinker. This article here sums it all up: http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/articles/485700/20130702/syria-catholic-priest-beheading-video-murad.htm

Basically confirmation that the video occurred several months ago, the two individuals being executed were Assad loyalists and it was 120km from where the monastery was attacked.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Well now people can shut up about all rebels being Islamists or al-Qaeda.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/07/12/us-syria-crisis-idUSBRE96B08A20130712

FSA (moderate rebels) declare war on Islamist rebels.

On a (tangentially) related note, how many historical examples are there of true three-way wars (that is, a war in which all three belligerents are at war with each other)?

The most obvious example is Bosnia before the Bosniaks and Croats managed to forge a cease-fire agreement.

But as Morden pointed out this was already basically a three-way war, since the Kurdish fighters obviously don't like Assad, but don't really like the FSA either (read they don't like any non-Kurdish government controlling the whole country including their region.) Right now they have kind of an unofficial agreement with the FSA to leave them alone and let them fight Assad on their own terms, but I understand there have been a few skirmishes between the FSA and Kurds.

Africa has also had quite a few civil wars where the sides were basically government (corrupt, incompetent and quite thuggish) and rebels (far more thuggish, absolutely savage, and not incompetent in the sense that they were more capable and efficient at killing people than the government) and as a result lots of villages and regions set up their own militias all about protecting their own area and keeping both the government and rebels out. But they weren't really allied or a "side" per se.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

That's flat out false. By all estimates Islamists make up no more than 20% of rebel forces. Plus the main rebels have been killing more Islamists than Assad's forces lately. I still hold all Assad supporters to be bloodthirsty thugs.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

So then what about people who supported Franco and Pinochet because of "OMG COMMUNISM!!!11!!!"

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Actually the French played the main role in wiping out Gaddafi's air force, and that part of the operation went incredibly easy.

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Let me get out the world's smallest violin...

[I spent the winter writing songs about getting better]

Let me get out the world's smallest violin...

Those 80+ troops are part of a force which defend several hundred thousands civilians from ISIS.

Who have killed just as many, and spend more time fighting the main people who actually fight ISIS than ISIS themselves.