Income, education, and Generation Y

[barfbag]

The problem is that we now live in a society where every single child is raised with the notion that they will never amount to anything unless they make it into college at age 18. College acceptance standards have dropped as well and more people are attending college than ever. This leads to nothing more than more people applying for the same jobs because more people are qualified. Doing well in the academic field and doing well in the private sector are two very different things. In today's world we end up with 20 people applying for the same position because the unnecessary amount of people going to college has resulted in more people being qualified. We can't all be doctors. If we were all doctors, then who would be the teachers? Forcing and pressuring everyone to attend college is not what this economy needs. The perfect economy is balanced. There are plenty of people who can make grades in college classrooms but have no chance in the private sector because of how different the worlds are. As long as the notion of people not being able to reach success unless making into college after high school is planted into the brains of our youth, we will continue to have a very educated society accompanied by a low income due to over qualification of trade and non-skilled jobs. The politics of education needs to stop and we need to establish a balanced economy once more.

[barfbag]

Simply because we have so many people going to college and becoming over qualified to do smaller jobs that they won't take or even be able to get lower paying jobs. However, many people aren't cut out for jobs requiring college education because the academic classroom and the real world are often two very different things. This leads to tons of people applying for one position. The others have to look for a different job while not working because they're way over qualified to work at Walmart for example. I'm not trying to be cold, but going to college because you've been taught it's the only way to succeed is not a good reason to go to college. There are plenty of other ways.

[barfbag]

The problem is that we now live in a society where every single child is raised with the notion that they will never amount to anything unless they make it into college at age 18. College acceptance standards have dropped as well and more people are attending college than ever. This leads to nothing more than more people applying for the same jobs because more people are qualified. Doing well in the academic field and doing well in the private sector are two very different things. In today's world we end up with 20 people applying for the same position because the unnecessary amount of people going to college has resulted in more people being qualified. We can't all be doctors. If we were all doctors, then who would be the teachers? Forcing and pressuring everyone to attend college is not what this economy needs. The perfect economy is balanced. There are plenty of people who can make grades in college classrooms but have no chance in the private sector because of how different the worlds are. As long as the notion of people not being able to reach success unless making into college after high school is planted into the brains of our youth, we will continue to have a very educated society accompanied by a low income due to over qualification of trade and non-skilled jobs. The politics of education needs to stop and we need to establish a balanced economy once more.

I suspect that as college becomes more expensive and less a ticket to the Good Life, smart kids will seek alternatives. One will be the skilled trades. Another will be such public services as police work and fire-fighting.  Another is opening and operating businesses that operate in the interstices of the capitalist order in areas that Big Business does not do well or does not want to get involved in.   

Many people now attending college have no reason to be there except to mark time until they get jobs as clerks.     

You are 100% right on the money! That's the generation we're living in. It comes from upbringing. For too long we've been told there's no way to be successful other than to get into college at age 18. Other means of advancement are looked down upon by society other than those who have taken alternative roads and become successful. The perfect economy is balanced and needs a little bit of everything.

[barfbag]

Generation Y is highly "entitled", hates rules/regulations/authority and doesn't like taking responsibility for anything.  Their work-ethic as a whole is horrendous.  Plus, the democrats have successfully used the gay marriage issue and the eight years under George Bush against the GOP. 

The irony of the entitlement of the Millenials, is that they are well on their way to becoming a "Lost Generation" with globalization and technology killing their chances at building careers.  Most aren't smart enough to see the writing on the wall.

1) Technology has eliminated the need for more jobs
2) It's just cheaper to offshore to India and China
3) Gen Y tends to run for the hills when the going gets tough.  American companies do not like these kids; they tend to stay at jobs very short times
4) In terms of a college education, many of these kids do not take their education seriously.  They go and drink, saying "it's college", but they fail to realize that times have changed and that doesn't cut it anymore.  Times have changed.  The supply of global labor > demand.  Companies want people more dedicated who will work 12-14 hour days and for less pay, not for kids who will complain and demand higher salaries/wages
5) The success of the Millenials is largely going to be tied to mom/dad.  If they did okay, you'll have a chance as a Gen Yr.  If you grew up in a struggling or broken family, the odds are against you. As we clearly see, we're becoming as "have vs. have not society" and it's more likely to be a "have not".  More people are falling out of the middle class rather than getting into it or reaching elite status. 
6) This generation has no sense of personal responsibility and no sense of pride or financial planning. They get what they want, when they want it and are told "they're great" to appease them.  Mom/dad aren't parents anymore.  Now, the kids control the households as mom/dad have become figureheads in many households and the number of "stable" households decline.
7) The democratic party suits the personality of this generation far better and politicians only care about getting re-elected.  They don't throw the truth in anyone's face because that will get them thrown out. Plus, socially, the GOP is back in the 80s, which isn't going to attract the Millenials.

Oh yes, I'm 29, a Millenial and I see what a crapfest the generation as a whole is.  I'd say that 2 out of 3 in this generation have absolutely no chance to succeed financially.  Rather, most seem to be content on running themselves into the ground financially, then crying poverty and eventually starting a revolution when the unsustainability finally ends.

We are a very stupid generation; the young and the dumb. If only the rest of us were as informed as you and me.

[barfbag]

Generation Y is highly "entitled", hates rules/regulations/authority and doesn't like taking responsibility for anything.  Their work-ethic as a whole is horrendous.  Plus, the democrats have successfully used the gay marriage issue and the eight years under George Bush against the GOP. 

The irony of the entitlement of the Millenials, is that they are well on their way to becoming a "Lost Generation" with globalization and technology killing their chances at building careers.  Most aren't smart enough to see the writing on the wall.

1) Technology has eliminated the need for more jobs
2) It's just cheaper to offshore to India and China
3) Gen Y tends to run for the hills when the going gets tough.  American companies do not like these kids; they tend to stay at jobs very short times
4) In terms of a college education, many of these kids do not take their education seriously.  They go and drink, saying "it's college", but they fail to realize that times have changed and that doesn't cut it anymore.  Times have changed.  The supply of global labor > demand.  Companies want people more dedicated who will work 12-14 hour days and for less pay, not for kids who will complain and demand higher salaries/wages
5) The success of the Millenials is largely going to be tied to mom/dad.  If they did okay, you'll have a chance as a Gen Yr.  If you grew up in a struggling or broken family, the odds are against you. As we clearly see, we're becoming as "have vs. have not society" and it's more likely to be a "have not".  More people are falling out of the middle class rather than getting into it or reaching elite status. 
6) This generation has no sense of personal responsibility and no sense of pride or financial planning. They get what they want, when they want it and are told "they're great" to appease them.  Mom/dad aren't parents anymore.  Now, the kids control the households as mom/dad have become figureheads in many households and the number of "stable" households decline.
7) The democratic party suits the personality of this generation far better and politicians only care about getting re-elected.  They don't throw the truth in anyone's face because that will get them thrown out. Plus, socially, the GOP is back in the 80s, which isn't going to attract the Millenials.

Oh yes, I'm 29, a Millenial and I see what a crapfest the generation as a whole is.  I'd say that 2 out of 3 in this generation have absolutely no chance to succeed financially.  Rather, most seem to be content on running themselves into the ground financially, then crying poverty and eventually starting a revolution when the unsustainability finally ends.

We are a very stupid generation; the young and the dumb. If only the rest of us were as informed as you and me.

I should say that every generation previous to this one has said this about the next generation; they are "entitled". Every time, the next generation turns out okay.
Frankly, I think the global economy will sort itself out as more Gen. Yers enter the market. Manufacturing will continue to go overseas, while America becomes a hub for new technology and service sectors.

There is also, no reason to call us a dumb generation.

In terms of survival each generation has gotten dumber than the last. Although, you can argue each generation gets better than the last at not having to take care of themselves which is a clever task. If you compare us to people a hundred years ago, we're very lazy. Times are just too different now. We're also less polite than any generation before us. "Turning out fine" is a point of view.

[barfbag]

Generation Y is highly "entitled", hates rules/regulations/authority and doesn't like taking responsibility for anything.  Their work-ethic as a whole is horrendous.  Plus, the democrats have successfully used the gay marriage issue and the eight years under George Bush against the GOP. 

The irony of the entitlement of the Millenials, is that they are well on their way to becoming a "Lost Generation" with globalization and technology killing their chances at building careers.  Most aren't smart enough to see the writing on the wall.

1) Technology has eliminated the need for more jobs
2) It's just cheaper to offshore to India and China
3) Gen Y tends to run for the hills when the going gets tough.  American companies do not like these kids; they tend to stay at jobs very short times
4) In terms of a college education, many of these kids do not take their education seriously.  They go and drink, saying "it's college", but they fail to realize that times have changed and that doesn't cut it anymore.  Times have changed.  The supply of global labor > demand.  Companies want people more dedicated who will work 12-14 hour days and for less pay, not for kids who will complain and demand higher salaries/wages
5) The success of the Millenials is largely going to be tied to mom/dad.  If they did okay, you'll have a chance as a Gen Yr.  If you grew up in a struggling or broken family, the odds are against you. As we clearly see, we're becoming as "have vs. have not society" and it's more likely to be a "have not".  More people are falling out of the middle class rather than getting into it or reaching elite status. 
6) This generation has no sense of personal responsibility and no sense of pride or financial planning. They get what they want, when they want it and are told "they're great" to appease them.  Mom/dad aren't parents anymore.  Now, the kids control the households as mom/dad have become figureheads in many households and the number of "stable" households decline.
7) The democratic party suits the personality of this generation far better and politicians only care about getting re-elected.  They don't throw the truth in anyone's face because that will get them thrown out. Plus, socially, the GOP is back in the 80s, which isn't going to attract the Millenials.

Oh yes, I'm 29, a Millenial and I see what a crapfest the generation as a whole is.  I'd say that 2 out of 3 in this generation have absolutely no chance to succeed financially.  Rather, most seem to be content on running themselves into the ground financially, then crying poverty and eventually starting a revolution when the unsustainability finally ends.

Well if that's the case, then f**k those companies and the people who run them, because they're awful pieces of garbage who want to literally enslave the human race so that they can turn a profit. I'm glad my generation isn't likely to put up with this business as usual bullsh**t that says we need to work longer hours for less pay. If every person in this country said to hell with that, we aren't going to work more than say six hours a day, and we won't be paid less than $15 an hour, the whole country would be better for it. Companies who can't pay those kind of wages don't need to be in business anyway. They're leeches and predators who need to go out of business, 'mom and pop' or not.

Your attitude speaks volumes about young people today.

[barfbag]

I think barfbag and sg want us to go back to the good ol' days, when people worked 12-14 hour days, child labor was rampant in the coal mines and garment industries, workers who protested were blacklisted, the majority of corporations were hegemonal monopolies a la Standard Oil, and when Triangle Shirtwaist fires were everyday occurences.

I am a dumb and entitled millenial because I think barfbag and sg's good ol' days were bad ol' days for regular people, and because I and other millenials don't want it to happen again.

Have you been here long enough to read my bill proposals in the political debate forums or are you just a partisan hack who quotes their party line?

[barfbag]

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TNF put it almost exactly right. sg made ridiculous assumptions to explain why millenials are "dumb" and "entitled" (really, is there ANYONE willing to work 12-14 hours a day; are you REALLY holding that against the current generation). TNF rightly exposes the problem; and you go ahead and blame him for it, dismissing him as just another one of those silly and dumb millenials. If you are not willing to engage in substantive debate (as you have most certainly FAILED to do; I don't think any one can deny that) on this subject, only to proclaim nostalgia about the American will 100 years ago, and to make silly assumptions ("In terms of survival; each generation has gotten dumber than the last") that literally mean NOTHING, do not complain.

I gave you an entire post about why the whole "millenials are lazy and dumb; therefore they will be the Lost Generation" mindset is ridiculous. You have not commented on it. Have you not read it? I will requote it for you.

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If you want to see the greatest example of rampant, unchecked mass consumerism and moral degradation, I give you the 1920's.

If you want to see the greatest example of the younger generation mas rebelling against the perceived confines of the older generation, I present to you the 1960's.

Whatever the case is, your dismissal of the millenial's unwillingness to regress to the "good ol'" early 20th century should be a testament to the current generation, symbolizing their unwillingness to go back to a time when the average worker was worth less than the dirt he worked on.

What exactly are you trying to say? What does this generation need to do to meet your requirements?

[barfbag]

The current generation literally has to do NOTHING different to be a completely average generation in my opinion. I am not the one calling the current generation "lazy" and "entitled", or at least any more lazy and entitled that mankind has always been.

This is not to say this generation is perfect, but I do not see it as being much different from the boomers, or Gen X.

Each generation is unique in its own way based on the difference of the times.

[barfbag]

I don't question that. However, the millennial generation is NOT dumber than its predecessors, and almost certainly not more lazy.

We have always had a very cushy lifestyle in our generation.

[barfbag]

I don't question that. However, the millennial generation is NOT dumber than its predecessors, and almost certainly not more lazy.

We have always had a very cushy lifestyle in our generation.

And there you go again making some random generalization without any factual evidence to back it up.

We may have a more comfortable lifestyle, but that may be because the US is the richest country. If you want to change that, you won't find much success at the ballot box.

What people want is a nation who works for what it has. You realize we've run up our debt so college students can have $20 a day meal plans and luxurious dorms? Are you going to pay for it or are you going to pass the debt onto your grandchildren? Taxing the rich won't help either as heard in Democratic campaign talking points because if we were all taxed at 100% for 20 years, we still couldn't afford to pay off our debt. Have fun while it lasts.

[barfbag]

I don't question that. However, the millennial generation is NOT dumber than its predecessors, and almost certainly not more lazy.

We have always had a very cushy lifestyle in our generation.

And there you go again making some random generalization without any factual evidence to back it up.

We may have a more comfortable lifestyle, but that may be because the US is the richest country. If you want to change that, you won't find much success at the ballot box.

The lifestyle was much cushier in the past than it is today, guys.  You're simply extrapolating too much from 1) TV shows, and 2) your own atypical upper-middle class existence.  Overall the US population is much poorer and living much worse than it did in 1980.

What people want is a nation who works for what it has. You realize we've run up our debt so college students can have $20 a day meal plans and luxurious dorms? Are you going to pay for it or are you going to pass the debt onto your grandchildren? Taxing the rich won't help either as heard in Democratic campaign talking points because if we were all taxed at 100% for 20 years, we still couldn't afford to pay off our debt. Have fun while it lasts.

BB, the debt is caused solely by the rich.

You guys are totally

The debt is caused by voters and politicians spending more money than they have. Term limits and balanced budget amendments would take care of that. Look at individual states. Most require a balanced budget. There is something to be said for our lifestyles being cushier a generation ago. It was easier to find work and livable income. Now the economy is much different and more people are going to college becoming overqualified for lower paying jobs. Debt is accumulated with little means of paying it off because there are only so many high paying jobs out there and a dangerous number of people who are qualified for such opportunities. People are also spending more than they have in greater numbers resulting in an inability to pay off debt and resulting in a lifestyle of struggles. Technology on the other hand has somewhat compensated for some of the hardships. Nowadays people can text each other instead of calling or walking to a friend's house. Most families have at least two cars. There's truths supporting both arguments that this generation has it easier or harder than generations prior.

[barfbag]

I really hate it when conservatives whine about the budget deficit.

The deficit for budget year 2009 (which was 1/3rd in the Bush Administration) was $1.4 trillion. That was the highest deficit ever.

Projections are that the deficit will be somewhere between $600-800 billion (depending on whether you look at CBO or Obama Administration data.)
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/11/us-budget-surplus_n_3581160.html

In other words, the deficit has shrunk by 50% since 2009. This also does not include a large part of the sequester. Once the sequester comes into full effect, the deficit will be all but gone.

http://www.usdebtclock.org/
As you can see on the debt clock, the deficit is continually shrinking at a very fast rate. When I checked this meter about this time last year, it was growing.

There are ample reasons for why there should be a reasonable federal debt. See Hamilton, Alexander. The theory is that if creditors have a substantial stake in a country, they will go to great lengths to keep that country from reverting to bankruptcy, or else the creditors lose their money. The debt does not need to be paid off anytime soon; at most a deficit should be eliminated, and inflation will take care of the rest.

Ever since WWII debt has been a staple part of American economics. Reagan himself tripled the deficit IIRC.

EDIT: I accidentally posted this as a new topic because my account timed out. I don't know if a mod wants to delete it...

Glenn Beck had a debt clock too. If you go by liberal sources then of course you'll get all kinds of great news for Democrats. What else upsets you? Come on we're listening. Let it out buddy. Vent! Vent!

[barfbag]

I really hate it when conservatives whine about the budget deficit.

The deficit for budget year 2009 (which was 1/3rd in the Bush Administration) was $1.4 trillion. That was the highest deficit ever.

Projections are that the deficit will be somewhere between $600-800 billion (depending on whether you look at CBO or Obama Administration data.)
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/07/11/us-budget-surplus_n_3581160.html

In other words, the deficit has shrunk by 50% since 2009. This also does not include a large part of the sequester. Once the sequester comes into full effect, the deficit will be all but gone.

http://www.usdebtclock.org/
As you can see on the debt clock, the deficit is continually shrinking at a very fast rate. When I checked this meter about this time last year, it was growing.

There are ample reasons for why there should be a reasonable federal debt. See Hamilton, Alexander. The theory is that if creditors have a substantial stake in a country, they will go to great lengths to keep that country from reverting to bankruptcy, or else the creditors lose their money. The debt does not need to be paid off anytime soon; at most a deficit should be eliminated, and inflation will take care of the rest.

Ever since WWII debt has been a staple part of American economics. Reagan himself tripled the deficit IIRC.

EDIT: I accidentally posted this as a new topic because my account timed out. I don't know if a mod wants to delete it...

Glenn Beck had a debt clock too. If you go by liberal sources then of course you'll get all kinds of great news for Democrats. What else upsets you? Come on we're listening. Let it out buddy. Vent! Vent!

I cited the CBO saying that the deficit will be 670 billion dollars. The U.S. Debt clock is nonpartisan. Who do you cite? Glenn beck!
I think we have a pretty good idea of who the hack is.

I was comparing your numbers with Glenn Beck to say that there's a lot of different numbers out there. What I know is that if you or I were in that much debt, we'd be in a lot more trouble than politicians in D.C. Politicians are paying for their mistakes on the backs of you and me. It's up to us to take over when the government becomes too oppressive like our founding fathers before us.