House passes farm bill, eliminating Food Stamps

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If we get rid of the future costs of Obamacare, we'd be able to afford more food stamps and feed more people.

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If we get rid of the future costs of Obamacare, we'd be able to afford more food stamps and feed more people.

Are we still clinging to that?  How many years has been since the OMB showed that Obamacare is deficit-reducing?

There's been a lot of studies. No one believes it's deficit reducing because OMB is wrong very often. I predict it to cost 14 trillion before we have to eliminate it due to a crisis caused from it.

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Fact: the military is the biggest welfare program around.

Please explain to us in depth detail how the military is a welfare program. What would we do without a military? They sacrifice their lives so we can cut their budget and then they get called a welfare program.

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And yet again, a thread that proves that if you've got a blue avatar on the Atlas Forum, you're probably a bad person. Not 100% true in all cases (King is an exception to this rule), but a good rule of thumb.

All you're saying is someone is a horrible person for disagreeing with you. Please stop the partisanship everyone.

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Business subsidies are the most corrupt and inefficient way of promoting a strong economy.

I agree especially when it comes to things like the auto bailout. It sounds like a lot of things were in the bill that shouldn't have been. Bills more than a few pages shouldn't be voted on. The best way to promote agriculture is to provide tax incentives for small farms. Prices of products would decline and food stamps would be less expensive for our nation or they'd buy more at the same amount.

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Business subsidies are the most corrupt and inefficient way of promoting a strong economy.

I think subsidies and tax incentives for small farmers would help our country as long as we don't over subsidize.

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http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2021413860_foodstampsxml.html

$526 on food spent on 3 people in 2 weeks. $12 per person per day.


These food stampers must be eating like kings.



Amazing how the taxpayer is expected to shell out $80 billion for a fatso who is, err, too, uncomfortable to cook.

I wouldn't call it eating like kings. $12 a day will keep you from starving, but it's not going to buy a feast for every meal. People can be very bad with their money, but my point is $12 a day for food isn't eating like a king.

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Hasn't it been rather conclusively shown that by stimulating spending food stamps ultimately make money for the government -- that is to say, more tax revenue as a result of food stamps comes in than is spent on food stamps? Or am I confusing this with something else?

It's a similar concept to tax cuts. If people have more money in their pockets, then more money is spent on the economy which creates jobs and makes things better for the average person. The difference is that we don't actually borrow money or even use money that we have to pay for food stamps because the money used by congress belongs the people. Basically, instead of lowering taxes, you're only giving money to the less fortunate so they can eat and the money is only spent on food. I think people have the right not to starve and it helps the food and agriculture industries. I hope neither party takes me out of context by thinking I'm a socialist or suggesting something I'm not.

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BTW, I fixed krazen's broken link in the quote below:

http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2021413860_foodstampsxml.html

$526 on food spent on 3 people in 2 weeks. $12 per person per day.


These food stampers must be eating like kings.

Somehow, I doubt that all the food they eat is consumed on the last day that food is purchased.  If like most people, they make weekly shopping trips, then that $526 dollars is lasting three weeks, not two.

But even $12 a day is not eating like a king.  If you think that is the case, you must not be the one who does the grocery shopping in your household.  At $8/day (over three weeks if one takes a reasonable inference from the story of how long she makes the benefit last instead of your hyperbolic one) or $6/day (over four weeks, which the person in the article says she could do if she didn't include items like fresh veggies in her family's diet) the resulting diet is even less kingly.  As noted in the article, she doesn't have full access to a kitchen of her own, so even if she had the time, cooking every meal from scratch isn't an option.

I have the space to buy food on sale for later use and the time and facilities to cook it myself and yet despite living in area that has a lower cost of living than both Tacoma and where you live krazen, I doubt I could fix myself a healthy diet on $6/day.  I could make it stretch if I dumped things like fruit and veggies from my diet and subsisted on 88¢ Banquet frozen dinners every supper. (As an occasional small meal, they're acceptable, but I shudder to think about anyone forced to eat one of them or the equivalent every day.  The sodium alone would likely kill them and if not that, then the fat would.) [Note: 88¢ is the sale price on them.  Usually they're in the $1 to $1.25 range depending on the store.]

Food at the local Tacoma safeway costs far less than $12 a day for anyone who isn't a 400 lb hog. Cereal + milk costs roughly $.33 per serving according to the posted prices.

It is astonishing and highly amusing to claim that 3 unemployed adult or near adult women cannot boil $1 pasta + $1 sauce for a $2 meal for 3 folks. If not 4.

The safeway in question is .4 miles away from Tacoma's Hilltop neighborhood.

For the record, eating highly expensive frozen dinners is what they are doing with the taxpayer's dollars. How nice of them. Shame those types aren't so uncomfortable with dumping taxpayer funds in a foolish manner.

Not everyone in a household might qualify though. Let's say the husband has been laid off and works part time while the wife also works part time. The husband collects unemployment which is enough to pay for the mortgage and therefore can't collect food stamps while the wife qualifies and uses the money to pay for food for both of them. Or what if they have kids? If it were a single adult living on their own, then I could see $12 a day from the government being a little high, but it's not always the case.

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Hasn't it been rather conclusively shown that by stimulating spending food stamps ultimately make money for the government -- that is to say, more tax revenue as a result of food stamps comes in than is spent on food stamps? Or am I confusing this with something else?

It's a similar concept to tax cuts. If people have more money in their pockets, then more money is spent on the economy which creates jobs and makes things better for the average person. The difference is that we don't actually borrow money or even use money that we have to pay for food stamps because the money used by congress belongs the people. Basically, instead of lowering taxes, you're only giving money to the less fortunate so they can eat and the money is only spent on food. I think people have the right not to starve and it helps the food and agriculture industries. I hope neither party takes me out of context by thinking I'm a socialist or suggesting something I'm not.

Hey, that's actually really reasonable. I apologize for my earlier comment, and applaud yours.

And come join us so-called "socialists", the water's fine over here!

I tend to take the middle ground on welfare and poverty issues. I'm not saying the government should provide people with free pizza delivery or three Thanksgiving dinners a day, but enough to eat a modest and healthy diet.

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BTW, I fixed krazen's broken link in the quote below:

http://seattletimes.com/html/localnews/2021413860_foodstampsxml.html

$526 on food spent on 3 people in 2 weeks. $12 per person per day.


These food stampers must be eating like kings.

Somehow, I doubt that all the food they eat is consumed on the last day that food is purchased.  If like most people, they make weekly shopping trips, then that $526 dollars is lasting three weeks, not two.

But even $12 a day is not eating like a king.  If you think that is the case, you must not be the one who does the grocery shopping in your household.  At $8/day (over three weeks if one takes a reasonable inference from the story of how long she makes the benefit last instead of your hyperbolic one) or $6/day (over four weeks, which the person in the article says she could do if she didn't include items like fresh veggies in her family's diet) the resulting diet is even less kingly.  As noted in the article, she doesn't have full access to a kitchen of her own, so even if she had the time, cooking every meal from scratch isn't an option.

I have the space to buy food on sale for later use and the time and facilities to cook it myself and yet despite living in area that has a lower cost of living than both Tacoma and where you live krazen, I doubt I could fix myself a healthy diet on $6/day.  I could make it stretch if I dumped things like fruit and veggies from my diet and subsisted on 88¢ Banquet frozen dinners every supper. (As an occasional small meal, they're acceptable, but I shudder to think about anyone forced to eat one of them or the equivalent every day.  The sodium alone would likely kill them and if not that, then the fat would.) [Note: 88¢ is the sale price on them.  Usually they're in the $1 to $1.25 range depending on the store.]

Food at the local Tacoma safeway costs far less than $12 a day for anyone who isn't a 400 lb hog. Cereal + milk costs roughly $.33 per serving according to the posted prices.

It is astonishing and highly amusing to claim that 3 unemployed adult or near adult women cannot boil $1 pasta + $1 sauce for a $2 meal for 3 folks. If not 4.

The safeway in question is .4 miles away from Tacoma's Hilltop neighborhood.

For the record, eating highly expensive frozen dinners is what they are doing with the taxpayer's dollars. How nice of them. Shame those types aren't so uncomfortable with dumping taxpayer funds in a foolish manner.

Some people do abuse food stamps and I know because I work in a grocery store and know several people who are on food stamps. If people buy bigger brands and spend more with their food stamps though, then corporations such as Tyson, Banquet, Michaellina's, Marie Callendar, Smuckers, Totino's, and Minute Maid benefit which helps the food and grocery industry leading to job growth. Then those who are unemployed or underemployed can be hired when jobs are created.

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Food at the local Tacoma safeway costs far less than $12 a day for anyone who isn't a 400 lb hog. Cereal + milk costs roughly $.33 per serving according to the posted prices.

And what fruit or other sides are you including to make it a balanced breakfast?  Or do you think because fruit grows on trees, it is free?

You must be logged in to read this quote.

What is astonishing and highly amusing is your pretense that a balanced diet does not include fresh fruits and vegetables.  But perhaps you think that because they are poor they should be relegated to malnutrition?  You also have conveniently ignored my point that last shopping day does not equal last eating day and the fact that her current living situation does not afford her the chance for proper kitchen facilities.  Or are you in favor of seeing to it that she is assured of an adequate place to live that would enable her to spend less on food?  That is indeed one of the tragedies of poverty.  Inadequacies of one resource often leads to inefficient usage of other resources.

I was told the jobless don't have time to prepare proper meals and that a proper meal took more than 20 minutes to prepare.

Well, if all the woman in question was doing was sitting around her rented rooms with her two kids, she'd have the time, but I doubt you or krazen want her to be doing just that. She certainly doesn't.  And you try fixing something more nutritious than pasta and sauce from scratch in under 20 minutes, including prep time and cleanup.

Fresh fruits are $1.79 per pound. Bread is $1.49 a loaf. Chicken is $1.29 a pound.


The article in question states that she has at the minimum a microwave and a freezer, and that said individual is 'uncomfortable' cooking food like normal americans do, not that she doesn't have whatever you deem to be a proper kitchen. In order for your point to be accurate, the individual in question must be able to store excess food in some pantry like apparatus, which of course implies you do have something resembling a kitchen.

Of course, the individual in question has a secondary supply of food from those food banks and still churns through $526 in 2 weeks.

You'd be hard pressed to churn through such sums at safeway unless you are buying ribeye steak.

In the article you mentioned, there might be a problem with what they're receiving. However, a good point was made about how poor people may not be able to afford what's necessary to cook with so they are trapped into buying prepared foods which cost $7.99/lb. Also, if corporations are benefiting from food stamps, then there's a higher chance those who are part of the program now will find jobs at places that sell, serve, distribute, or package foods. The food industry is pretty important. Articles such as the one you provided shouldn't be taken lightly either. I've worked in different grocery stores for several years and I've seen people use their food stamp card to buy groceries and then break a $100 bill to buy a case of beer, candy items from the checkout lines, and those spinning wheels that glow in the dark. America has problems with financial responsibility and I'm sure no one on this forum is perfect with money either.

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I will mention that I've worked in the supermarket industry and you would not believe how many people pay with an EBT card and then walk to their brand-new car.  Several people had Mercedes-Benzes, BMWs, Cadillacs etc.

Or have a $200 outfit on.

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I will mention that I've worked in the supermarket industry and you would not believe how many people pay with an EBT card and then walk to their brand-new car.  Several people had Mercedes-Benzes, BMWs, Cadillacs etc.

Or have a $200 outfit on.

Tell us more about how you evaluate the clothing costs of SNAP recipients.

You aren't able to tell how much clothes cost by looking at them? I've been trained by my security job to read people based on the way they wear their hair, tie their shoes, hold their phones, walk, laugh, smile, stand, use arm gesture, and several other ways. You're saying you can't tell how much an article of clothing or outfit costs by looking at it? If you're able to see the color, you can tell how much it costs. I'm not being mean either, I'm referring to very basic knowledge. I doubt the job training I've had from security work is a hidden or special talent unique to me or my coworkers. Also, I read another response below and I feel I'm extremely generous when it comes to food stamps. People have the right not to starve and those who are poor tend to not have as many successful means to cook with. I'm not saying we should provide three Thanksgiving meals a day for everyone below a certain income, but $12 a day per person isn't a lot in every situation especially when kids are involved and other expenses need to be paid too. I'm pretty sure I mentioned though that there are abusers of food stamps. As a cashier I witnessed several food stamp users max out their EBT cards, then purchase a second order of junk food, soda, chips, ice cream, cookies, frozen dog treats, gum, candy, and cheap toys that will break before they get home. I've seen other food stamp users max out their EBT cards and then break a $100 bill to buy a case of beer. People shouldn't starve and I don't feel $12 a day is extreme in every case as I mentioned before. Food stamps also benefit the food industry which is very important.

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I wasn't aware that opening a can of soup counted as from scratch.  As for fruit juice, that's barely better than soda whether fresh squeezed or from a container.  It's still sugar water, just without the carbonation and a few vitamins.

OTOH, I will agree that without an excessive amount of time or effort, tho certainly more than merely 4 minutes, soups and stews could be made that would be far healthier than the sodium saturated canned variety, assuming she has access to a slow cooker and a place to let it sit without being a fire hazard.

Why must things be "made from scratch"?  Sure, I'd agree that everything else being equal, "made from scratch" is better, but most people, those on SNAP or not, don't have the time (or knowledge) for that.  You can eat healthy and cheaply making things that aren't made from scratch.

But nevermind all that, what do you want everybody to drink?  Does that need to be made from scratch too?  Does every meal need to be made from scratch to meet your approval?  Can lunch or breakfast be something fast and easy or should every meal in the day take 3 hours to prepare?  Do you have a "made from scratch" meal everyday?  3 a day?  Who makes them for you?  Do you expect everybody else to do it too?  Are you disappointed when you find out your friends and family don't live up to your, frankly, outrageous expectations?

My dad's family ate every meal from scratch when he was growing up and all clothes were made from scratch and handed down to the younger children. They had one car and all pulled together to do household chores. As a result, my father became a professional engineer and his brothers became an accountant, school principal, and a tax attorney. His sister married a doctor. Their family was an example of what could ideally be every household in America. Most people would be shocked to hear that my grandfather was the dean of science and engineering at a private college, a successful businessman who ran his own engineering company, was on the township board as their engineer, very active within his church, had his own woodshop in the basement, raced formula V cars, was the president of AAA in their country, and benefited from his timeshare in Florida. The reason I'm saying how he did so much with his life is not only to inspire people, but to point out that simply because a family has money doesn't mean that even they have to live cushy lifestyles. My grandfather was very smart with how he managed his money and raised his family. My father will be 49 next month and I'm now close with my grandmother who is 74. I'm stating their ages to demonstrate that what I've described took place in fairly modern times; 1960-1990.

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If not for food stamps, the store I'm employed by wouldn't exist. In the area I work, almost all of our business comes on the 1st of the month when food stamps go into effect. We get our biggest truck orders on the 1st or 2nd of the month because the trucks come every other day. I don't like the government picking winners and losers, but if an industry or sector is doing poorly enough that it's effecting other sectors, then it doesn't hurt to hold a safety net to keep our economy from collapsing. A poor economy could lead to less tax revenue and result in further deficits. We'd then need to borrow more money just to have a strong military and make ends meet. The line is drawn when government picks winners and losers based on who donated to the party who won the white house. Both parties have gotten worse with this throughout their existence.

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If not for food stamps, the store I'm employed by wouldn't exist. In the area I work, almost all of our business comes on the 1st of the month when food stamps go into effect. We get our biggest truck orders on the 1st or 2nd of the month because the trucks come every other day.

Obviously, without the government, no employment could exist. Those roads the trucks used didn't build themselves either, by the way. It's nice to see a self-described conservative acknowledge his dependence though. Doesn't happen very often.

Without government, we'd have anarchy, but there are private roads built by private contractors. I understand everyone has to go through government in terms of laws and taxes in order to start businesses. The private sector should still be preferred too. We're both right though, food stamps do help the economy and independently create jobs in the private sector. My last job was a security officer at college apartments which weren't part of campus. However, without the state university for students to attend, there wouldn't be any independent colleges. Granted I would've simply been assigned somewhere else like a park, school, or grocery store to do security, but I think everyone sees my point.

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house gop leaders (read: eric cantor) still insisting on southerland amendment to the nutrition title.

hopefully that nonsense wont get out of conference (or pass the senate if it survives conference).  obama has issued veto threats, but i dont trust him.  he would likely sign it and then issue a press release talking about how bad the bill is.

That sounds like Obama without any future elections to answer to.