Margaret Thatcher dies at 87

[BluegrassBlueVote]

She was a political giant that the world hasn't quite seen since, so my respect for her character will never waver. However, as a politician, I hope this day won't cause some of her terrible policies from being whitewashed by American condolences.

[BluegrassBlueVote]

Tweed already posted the Greenwald piece which is very important. It is very damaging for supporters of a deceased politician to write hagiographies, rewrite history by propagandizing him/her, and exploit his/her death to push their own ideologies, while at the same time denying opponents the opportunity to critique under the guise of "respect for the dead."

But I'm glad that the "terrorist" Mandela outlived her at least.

Completely agree with both this and the piece. When am I, as a critic of her, allowed to speak ill of her policies again? Is there an official waiting period I'm supposed to adhere to unless I open myself to calls of insensitivity? Is it tomorrow, a week from now, or even a month?

[BluegrassBlueVote]

Tweed already posted the Greenwald piece which is very important. It is very damaging for supporters of a deceased politician to write hagiographies, rewrite history by propagandizing him/her, and exploit his/her death to push their own ideologies, while at the same time denying opponents the opportunity to critique under the guise of "respect for the dead."

But I'm glad that the "terrorist" Mandela outlived her at least.

Completely agree with both this and the piece. When am I, as a critic of her, allowed to speak ill of her policies again? Is there an official waiting period I'm supposed to adhere to unless I open myself to calls of insensitivity? Is it tomorrow, a week from now, or even a month?

Not official, but after the funeral would be polite, I'd say.

So every (respectful) column that criticizes her premiership is allowed to be filed the minute after she's lowered into the ground?

The kind of walls our societies try to put between thoughtful dialogue and death is very troublesome. Political leaders are incredibly controversial individuals for the entirety of their careers, and I don't believe some artificial safeguard should be raised during their passing that somehow canonizes them. The children among the detractors should be rightfully criticized, but her poll tax is still as awful today as it was yesterday and it's not the worst thing in the world if someone brings that up.

[BluegrassBlueVote]

I guess it all comes down to how you show your disagreements. As long as you're respectful, there's no problem with putting your opinion forward.

Plus, admit many people love her and her legacy, and this will not change. Conservatives better hope she doesn't become a Reagan-like ghost, to whom all members of the party will be compared.

Thatcher is nowhere near as idolized in Britain as Reagan still is in America. Reagan's policies have been rightfully repudiated by the left here, but there is nothing close to the vitriol for the man as Thatcherism faces across the pond. At worst, he's characterized as the napper-in-chief, not as a divisive monster.

[BluegrassBlueVote]

I posted this at the end of last year and stand by it:

Thatcher defined large sections of British society as her personal enemies and shaped government policy accordingly. Worse, she didn't even bother to disguise that fact. This is not something that normally happens in democracies.

This is (still) a good point and quite central when you compare her legacy to Reagans, since there is no way you can say the same about him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welfare_queen

[BluegrassBlueVote]

I posted this at the end of last year and stand by it:

Thatcher defined large sections of British society as her personal enemies and shaped government policy accordingly. Worse, she didn't even bother to disguise that fact. This is not something that normally happens in democracies.

This is (still) a good point and quite central when you compare her legacy to Reagan's, since there is no way you can say the same about him.

http://en.wiped.org/Viki/Welfare_queen

Reagan used scapegoats in his rhetoric, but he didn't define them as enemies in the same way.

Instilling them subliminally and deliberately fostering racial conflict is so much better, you're right.

All Reagan's team did was play the game differently.

[BluegrassBlueVote]

"Manchester United announced that they would not be honouring the former PM with a minute's silence prior to their match against rivals Manchester City at Old Trafford"

http://sidespin.kinja.com/margaret-thatcher-and-her-attempts-to-destroy-english-f-471243555?utm_campaign=socialflow_deadspin_twitter&utm_source=deadspin_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow

An Argentine player (Aguero) ended up scoring the winning goal. Heh.

Awesome.

[BluegrassBlueVote]

I will be moderating this thread HEAVILY. Be warned.

Thank You, Alfleitch. Thank you.

I cried today. That is all I can say. I cried. I am devastated by the loss of the woman I admired more than any other.

How is this even possible for an American? How old are you?

[BluegrassBlueVote]

I will be moderating this thread HEAVILY. Be warned.

Thank You, Alfleitch. Thank you.

I cried today. That is all I can say. I cried. I am devastated by the loss of the woman I admired more than any other.

How is this even possible for an American? How old are you?

When you admire someone, and view them as an inspiration of what leadership is, is it not a natural reaction?

It's a woman you've only read about from a different continent. I guess I just can't relate that to anything.

[BluegrassBlueVote]

I would concede that point if those were suitable comparisons.

[BluegrassBlueVote]

My point was centered around ChairmanSanchez (assumedly) not being old enough to observe any of Thatcher's premiership firsthand as much as it was his nationality. I doubt any Brits from this generation cry when watching the clip of JFK's head exploding.

This is a silly thing to argue about either way, as they're another man's emotions, not mine. I just couldn't help but sense the embellishment.

[BluegrassBlueVote]

My point was centered around ChairmanSanchez (assumedly) not being old enough to observe any of Thatcher's premiership firsthand as much as it was his nationality. I doubt any Brits from this generation cry when watching the clip of JFK's head exploding.

This is a silly thing to argue about either way, as they're another man's emotions, not mine. I just couldn't help but sense the embellishment.

Should liberals not admire FDR for his actions, even if they were born forty years after he died? Was JFK alive when any of the Brits from this generation were alive?

I was talking about you literally, physically shedding tears over this, not your admiration for her. There is a huge difference between the two. The woman lived a grand life and you've probably only read about her premiership without actually experiencing a single day of it.

If anything, I would think this could serve as a celebration of her legacy and policies for her supporters.

[BluegrassBlueVote]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XDtClJYJBj8

I loved the shout "we can't take it" from the Tory bench. Hard to take the truth indeed.

And the Speaker's reaction to fake outrage, priceless.

Tremendous.

Getting a good laugh out of these tributes I'm reading that place Thatcher's name alongside Attlee's and Churchill's. Hilarious.