Talk Elections

Presidential Elections - Analysis and Discussion => Past Election What-ifs (US) => Topic started by: Kaine for Senate '18 on November 14, 2008, 10:13:27 pm



Title: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Kaine for Senate '18 on November 14, 2008, 10:13:27 pm
Republicans:
Senator John McCain (Arizona)
Governor Tim Pawlenty (Minnesota)

Democrats:
Fmr. Governor Mark Warner (Virginia)
Governor Bill Richardson (New Mexico)


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: The Populist on November 15, 2008, 06:34:02 pm
I think Warner does much worse than Obama, but still wins the election, 298-240:
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Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Nixon in '80 on November 17, 2008, 04:26:46 am
I think Warner does much worse than Obama, but still wins the election, 298-240:
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Flip NH, maybe CO, but probably not.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Kaine for Senate '18 on November 18, 2008, 05:52:21 pm
With the economy being such a major issue, Warner's record of managing Virginia, and his business experience, leads him to an even bigger landslide than Obama's.
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Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: CultureKing on November 18, 2008, 06:19:15 pm
With the economy being such a major issue, Warner's record of managing Virginia, and his business experience, leads him to an even bigger landslide than Obama's.
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Flip Nevada, Montana, Nebraska-2, and Indiana and I agree. Though I think Warner might have had a chance in Kentucky and perhaps Tennessee.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Ronnie on November 18, 2008, 06:23:18 pm
With the economy being such a major issue, Warner's record of managing Virginia, and his business experience, leads him to an even bigger landslide than Obama's.
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You have to understand someone's campaign ability versus someone's record.  McCain had a long list of accomplishments in the US senate, but did not project them well to the public.  On the other hand, Obama has campaigned absolutely flawlessly, but has accomplished near to nothing.

You have to understand that Mark Warner would not have had nearly as many grassroots efforts, nor as much charisma as Obama.  He may have a decent record, but if you actually think he would have done as well (or better, as you seem to believe), you are living in a pipe dream.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: War on Want on November 18, 2008, 09:17:11 pm
With the economy being such a major issue, Warner's record of managing Virginia, and his business experience, leads him to an even bigger landslide than Obama's.
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You have to understand someone's campaign ability versus someone's record.  McCain had a long list of accomplishments in the US senate, but did not project them well to the public.  On the other hand, Obama has campaigned absolutely flawlessly, but has accomplished near to nothing.

You have to understand that Mark Warner would not have had nearly as many grassroots efforts, nor as much charisma as Obama.  He may have a decent record, but if you actually think he would have done as well (or better, as you seem to believe), you are living in a pipe dream.
Obama's campaigning ability doesn't have that much to do with the landslide, it has everything to do with the economy.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Ronnie on November 18, 2008, 09:26:43 pm
With the economy being such a major issue, Warner's record of managing Virginia, and his business experience, leads him to an even bigger landslide than Obama's.
()

You have to understand someone's campaign ability versus someone's record.  McCain had a long list of accomplishments in the US senate, but did not project them well to the public.  On the other hand, Obama has campaigned absolutely flawlessly, but has accomplished near to nothing.

You have to understand that Mark Warner would not have had nearly as many grassroots efforts, nor as much charisma as Obama.  He may have a decent record, but if you actually think he would have done as well (or better, as you seem to believe), you are living in a pipe dream.
Obama's campaigning ability doesn't have that much to do with the landslide, it has everything to do with the economy.

Obviously, the economy had a lot to do with the presidential outcome, but Obama was very talented in his campaign ability, which allowed him to win over many voters.  I don't think that Mark Warner would have enough grassroots and GOTV motivation to pull out as large of an electoral college victory as Obama.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Wherever you want to go, you can't go there! on November 18, 2008, 09:31:48 pm
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Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: bhouston79 on November 19, 2008, 12:12:40 am
I don't really see the results being too much different.  Indiana,  and NE Cong. Dist. 2 may not have went for the Dems, but those loses would have probably been offset by a win in Missouri.  West Virginia would have been a tossup.  Kentucky, Tennessee, and Arkansas would have been much more competitive, but I doubt that they would have flipped.  Georgia would probably not been as competitive since the Africian American population in that state would not have been nearly as excitited about voting for another White Southern Governor.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Хahar 🤔 on November 21, 2008, 06:09:22 pm
I think Warner does much worse than Obama, but still wins the election, 298-240:
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Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: DanielX on November 21, 2008, 11:38:10 pm
Assuming similar economic conditions, Warner 297-241. Take The Populist's map, award West Virginia to McCain and New Hampshire to Warner.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Matt Damon™ on November 25, 2008, 10:17:21 am
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Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Robespierre's Jaw on November 25, 2008, 05:06:57 pm
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Mark R. Warner/William B. Richardson III (D): 314 EV
John S. McCain III/Timothy J. Pawlenty (R): 224 EV

Mark Warner, like Barack Obama manages to defeat John McCain comfortably in the General Election, but his victory is much shorter than Obama's record breaking victory in RL. Warner, unlike Obama picks up Missouri and Arkansas, whilst losing Nevada, Colorado, Indiana, Florida, North Carolina and Nebraska's Second Congressional District.

one thing that we all have to learn about Ben is that anytime Warner is on the democratic ticket, then it is a democratic landslide.

Folks, one thing we all have learnt about Garrison since joining the Atlas Forum in August 2006 is that anytime Ronald Reagan is heading the Republican ticket, in numerous What-If scenarios, such as "No 22th Amendment - Reagan Runs in 1988", it is always a Republican landslide. And when the person in question is criticised, you are labelled a "hack". Food for thought.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Kaine for Senate '18 on November 27, 2008, 11:57:20 am
With the economy being such a major issue, Warner's record of managing Virginia, and his business experience, leads him to an even bigger landslide than Obama's.
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one thing that we all have to learn about Ben is that anytime Warner is on the democratic ticket, then it is a democratic landslide.

Garrison, all I did was take Obama's victory, and give him Montana, Missouri, Arkansas, and West Virginia.  Hardly unlikely.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Kaine for Senate '18 on November 27, 2008, 12:19:44 pm
With the economy being such a major issue, Warner's record of managing Virginia, and his business experience, leads him to an even bigger landslide than Obama's.
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one thing that we all have to learn about Ben is that anytime Warner is on the democratic ticket, then it is a democratic landslide.

Garrison, all I did was take Obama's victory, and give him Montana, Missouri, Arkansas, and West Virginia.  Hardly unlikely.
west virgnia would be a stretch for any democrat at this point. Arkansas would also be a stretch except for a Clinton.

and, what I said is true.

No, Garrison, it isn't.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Kaine for Senate '18 on November 27, 2008, 12:24:55 pm
With the economy being such a major issue, Warner's record of managing Virginia, and his business experience, leads him to an even bigger landslide than Obama's.
()
one thing that we all have to learn about Ben is that anytime Warner is on the democratic ticket, then it is a democratic landslide.

Garrison, all I did was take Obama's victory, and give him Montana, Missouri, Arkansas, and West Virginia.  Hardly unlikely.
west virgnia would be a stretch for any democrat at this point. Arkansas would also be a stretch except for a Clinton.

and, what I said is true.

No, Garrison, it isn't.
it is very true, you can't deny it.

Yes, Garrison, I can.  I just did, as a matter of fact.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Хahar 🤔 on December 02, 2008, 03:39:59 pm
Fail. Warner isn't charismatic, etc.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Blazers93 on December 09, 2008, 05:11:27 pm
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Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Carapace Clavicle Moundshroud on December 10, 2008, 03:01:34 am
I'm getting very sick of this Warner lovefest. I wonder if some people on this board don't have pictures of him they carry around in their wallets.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Kaine for Senate '18 on December 10, 2008, 06:53:56 pm
I'm getting very sick of this Warner lovefest. I wonder if some people on this board don't have pictures of him they carry around in their wallets.

This may shock some people, but I don't have a picture of Warner is my wallet.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: PBrunsel on December 11, 2008, 02:49:18 pm
This is a very interesting scenario, as neither of these candidates are in any way exceptional public speakers. In this day and age, a person has to be a good public speaker to win the White House, so the American people would face an interesting predicament with Governor Warner and Senator McCain squaring off. I would give the win to the governor, however, as I feel he could connect with the Middle Class voter better than Senator McCain. In the end, Warner wins in a walk.

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Mark Warner/Bill Richardson (D): 356 EV;53.4% of the PV
John McCain/Tim Pawlenty (R): 182 EV; 46.1% of the PV
Others (Libertarian, Constitution, etc.): 0 EV; 0.5% of the PV

Governor Pawlenty would become the "heir apparent" for the 2012 GOP Pesidential nomination, as he has a more positive Fall Campaign than the media allowed Governor Palin to have. All in all, an interesting scenario. I also would have probably voted for the Democatic Ticket as it seems like the most qualifed ticket since Johnson/Humphrey in 1964.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: RIP Robert H Bork on December 15, 2008, 01:49:57 am
I would not see Warner selecting Richardson. Biden is more like it.

Anyway, he wins in a landslide. Pawlenty would not be able to win his own state.

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Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Scam of God on December 15, 2008, 06:33:28 am
In this day and age, a person has to be a good public speaker to win the White House

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Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Matt Damon™ on December 15, 2008, 09:46:39 am
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Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Psychic Octopus on December 19, 2008, 06:22:17 pm
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Governor Warner is able to defeat Senator McCain in a rout,
360-178


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: PBrunsel on December 19, 2008, 07:44:02 pm
In this day and age, a person has to be a good public speaker to win the White House

Bush photo

Einzige,

A point well taken, but even President Bush is not that terrible of a public speaker. His way of speaking is his own tpye of "folsky", and that obviosly worked in two (or at least one) national election.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Psychic Octopus on December 20, 2008, 01:38:20 am
In this day and age, a person has to be a good public speaker to win the White House

Bush photo

Einzige,

A point well taken, but even President Bush is not that terrible of a public speaker. His way of speaking is his own tpye of "folsky", and that obviosly worked in two (or at least one) national election.

yes I agree, Bush isn't that bad a piblic speaker. Just well, seen as one now.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Oh Jeremy Corbyn! on December 20, 2008, 01:47:34 am
Warner wouldn't have done better than Obama.


Title: Re: 2008: Warner v. McCain
Post by: Scam of God on December 30, 2008, 08:55:11 pm
In this day and age, a person has to be a good public speaker to win the White House

Bush photo

Einzige,

A point well taken, but even President Bush is not that terrible of a public speaker. His way of speaking is his own tpye of "folsky", and that obviosly worked in two (or at least one) national election.

Alright, then.

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(For the record, I actually like G.H.W. much better than either his immediate predecessor or his  son, but you can't say the man was anything but a lackadaisical public speaker, at best. For that matter, I'd question the attractiveness of a 'folksy' style of speaking to anybody other than a certain species of Southerner - one which, in the context of this thread, would probably see the same thing in Warner they saw in Dubya.)