WV - Trump up 32% (60%-28%) in Garin-Hart-Yang Research Group Poll (500 LV) (user search)
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  WV - Trump up 32% (60%-28%) in Garin-Hart-Yang Research Group Poll (500 LV) (search mode)
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Author Topic: WV - Trump up 32% (60%-28%) in Garin-Hart-Yang Research Group Poll (500 LV)  (Read 3982 times)
NOVA Green
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« on: October 06, 2016, 05:18:18 PM »

So looks like a Dem internal that shows Dems leading for Gov, and slightly ahead for AG?

I can see Clinton getting slaughtered electorally in WV, considering not only the national party positions on Coal and global warming, but more importantly personally disrespecting many West Virgianians in a few major gaffes. The number still seems a bit extreme and I don't believe that Trump will win WV by over 2:1, although he'll likely win by 25 points.
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NOVA Green
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« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2016, 11:00:12 PM »

Clinton has done an amazing job in terms of ceding New Deal Democratic voters to the insanity of Trumpism...

West Virginia would be much more excited with a Biden or Bernie than a Clinton....

Democratic centrism a la DLC is a cold corpse, that might happily feed many of the Democratic hacks on this forum, but the price of power will be a decrepit corpse based upon a handful of suburban voters, where the party gradually shrinks back to urban and suburban coffins while the House and Senate are lost forever.

Ok--- little bit of goth doom and gloom, but most of y'all on this forum has never lived or experienced actual life in small town America, and apparently it is amusing to once again pick on the "Rednecks" and "Hicks", while at the same time not realizing why Democratic support has collapsed in many formerly Democratic parts of rural and small town America over the past 24 years.

Big tent or small tent... your choice.

Tired of the Redneck stereotypes, so any of y'all want to keep promoting that, good luck.

The Senate and House and most Governorships will be Republican forever....
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NOVA Green
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« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2016, 03:09:16 PM »

A smarter idea would be to keep telling them that coal's dead and help massively subsidize vocational/trade schools for those that want it to get them set up in other jobs and actually be able to do something else.

Agreed with the last part...

We went through this in Oregon back in the 1980s and 1990s, when entire communities of rural and small town Oregon were hit massively by the inevitable decline in the timber industry driven by decades of over-harvesting of timber on public lands.

As part of the compromise worked out under the Bill Clinton administration, there was significant Federal monies invested in job retraining, support to school districts that were heavily dependent on timber dollars, promotion of "eco-tourism", and other means of mitigating the social impact caused by the dramatic permanent collapse of one of the key pillars of the state's economy.

I see no reason why a similar approach in coal dependent communities would not only be the ethical and right thing to do, since coal is essentially dying as a long term industry mainly as a result of free-market economic forces, and to a lesser extent the growth of renewable energy sources and also be something that in theory Republicans should support but won't, because they are in the pockets of Big Coal and the Koch brothers.

Granted Clinton did talk about this during the WV primaries to some extent, but it was overshadowed by what appeared to many in WV (And Appalachia in general) as extremely insensitive comments.
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NOVA Green
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« Reply #3 on: October 07, 2016, 05:22:49 PM »

A smarter idea would be to keep telling them that coal's dead and help massively subsidize vocational/trade schools for those that want it to get them set up in other jobs and actually be able to do something else.

Except they've tried to do just that, and it's utterly failed. My Dad used to work for Joy Global, got laid off in February. Best job he could find to replace forced him to take an almost $10 paycut, even with the fact he has an associates. Same with my brother in law, who went from a well paying job checking local waters for mine run off to being forced to work for a cable company (He's got a bachelors). So please, do enlighten me as to how this is supposed to work, because just saying so doesn't form a coherent strategy. For the record millions has been put for former coal workers to get more education, the simple fact of the matter is that there aren't any quality jobs to replace coal and most lack the money to move elsewhere.

And for the record Red Avatars, do continue calling people like my father who's worked for 30 years in the coal industry and served 12 years in the Military "Hillbilly Trash". It's that elitism which has insured you won't win Appalachia anytime soon.

Epic--- for the record don't throw the baby out with the bathwater, because I never have, nor ever will  disrespect the proud history of Coal Miners in America. I've stood up against some of the suburban kids on the forum that have a kneejerk response to anything involving WV or Coal Country in general. There are some jerks on this forum that continue to ply on Appalachian stereotypes that have no experience or reality, but simply have whatever axes to grind with nothing to back it up.

Growing up in a timber dependent state, I know first-hand how entire communities can be destroyed almost overnight as a result of a dramatic collapse of good paying union jobs in the forests and the timber mills.

When I was in college in Ohio back in the early '90s I brought the UMWA to my college campus to speak shortly after the Pittston Coal Strike, when there were subsequent industrial actions against "double breasting" and union busting tactics. I still have a camouflage T-Shirt with a proud UMWA '93 on the front that the union rep gave me, that I wear proudly. Smiley

Agreed that there needs to be a more comprehensive approach to Coal Country, which has been neglected by both major political parties .

As the son of a Coal Miner, I'm sure you're already well aware of the struggles in the 1990s, but posting this basic article at least for some of the others on the forum that don't have the attention for more detailed analysis, to at least provide a slight starting point on this issue.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pittston_Coal_strike
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NOVA Green
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« Reply #4 on: October 07, 2016, 05:41:55 PM »

And for those "Democrats" on the forum that don't have a clue and still continue to treat Coal Miners and Appalachian-Americans as a bunch of "racist hillbillies", there has been almost 150 years of the Operators bringing successive waves of European immigrants to work in the mines, speaking many different native languages, the use of scabs trying to pit "White" miners against "Black" miners all in an attempt to bust the union.

They lost in that attempt.... but unfortunately Post WW II a Democratic President led a direct assault on the Miners and "Taft-Hartley" (Truman) followed up by assaults under successive Democratic and Republican administrations alike that were beholden to the power of Big Coal.

Video of the Pittston strike from the voices of the Miners....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_EQm2MZ8I-Q

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