Populares Convention, April 2010

[Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl]

Strongly strongly opposed. Then like a dictator the EC would have been able to invalidate NiK's perfectly valid vote from the last election. Hell no.

[CatoMinor]

 agree with Gio, it sounds nice but until there are some protections against abuse of power, I oppose it.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

unofficial results

Chair: 16 Mint, 1 NOTA
Vice-Chair: 16 Hantheguitarman, 1 NOTA
Whip: 10 Libertas, 6 Sewer Socialist, 1 Mechaman (Write-in)
Secretary: 13 SvenssonRS, 4 Silent Spade
Chief Director: 13 Jbrase, 4 W E Dodge

(I didn't include Nik's vote, which would not change who wins)

[Mechaman]

I agree with JBrase and Giovanni, sounds good on paper but I can't vote for it unless there are safeguards against abuses of power.

[CatoMinor]

(4) If there are ethical concerns on the status of a Popularis’ vote, the Election Clerk will invalidate them pending the approval of at least 2 out of 3 from the Chairman, Whip, and Secretary. If 10 current (meaning a member at the time the vote ends) members petition taking issue with the invalidation then the vote will be counted.


How is this?

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

(4) If there are ethical concerns on the status of a Popularis’ vote, the Election Clerk will invalidate them pending the approval of at least 2 out of 3 from the Chairman, Whip, and Secretary. If 5 current (meaning a member at the time the vote ends) members petition taking issue with the invalidation then the vote will be counted.


How is this?

that would mean a small minority of members could make an otherwise invalid vote be counted

[Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl]

(4) If there are ethical concerns on the status of a Popularis’ vote, the Election Clerk will invalidate them pending the approval of at least 2 out of 3 from the Chairman, Whip, and Secretary. If 5 current (meaning a member at the time the vote ends) members petition taking issue with the invalidation then the vote will be counted.


How is this?

I am opposed to any amendment, but anyway, party officers are Chairman, Vice Chairman, and Whip, so why would we have the secretary rather than the Vice Chairman?

[President Mitt]

(4) If there are ethical concerns on the status of a Popularis’ vote, the Election Clerk will invalidate them pending the approval of at least 2 out of 3 from the Chairman, Whip, and Secretary. If 5 current (meaning a member at the time the vote ends) members petition taking issue with the invalidation then the vote will be counted.


How is this?

I'd say make it 10 or somewhere in-between 7 and 10, if a EC is blatantly abusing power, there should be enough support to overturn it.

[CatoMinor]

I'd say make it 10 or somewhere in-between 7 and 10, if a EC is blatantly abusing power, there should be enough support to overturn it.

Done

party officers are Chairman, Vice Chairman, and Whip, so why would we have the secretary rather than the Vice Chairman?

I was using the 2 main officers and a random 3rd one

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

(4) If there are ethical concerns on the status of a Popularis’ vote, the Election Clerk will invalidate them pending the approval of at least 2 out of 3 from the Chairman, Whip, and Secretary. If 5 current (meaning a member at the time the vote ends) members petition taking issue with the invalidation then the vote will be counted.


How is this?

I'd say make it 10 or somewhere in-between 7 and 10, if a EC is blatantly abusing power, there should be enough support to overturn it.

I'd suggest the election clerk should be able to declare a vote valid or invalid, but that this vote can be restored by a vote of a majority of elected officers (or 3 out of 5 Chair, Vice Chair, Whip, Secretary and Cheif Director) or with a petition by a majority of members whose votes are not in question.

[Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl]

Granting any number of people the power to vote out votes they disagree with is a bad idea. Having an election within an election is really unnecessary.

[#CriminalizeSobriety]

Well, in light of the discussion after the alloted time for dialogue, I will be tabling the vote until there has been sufficient debate.

[🐒Gods of Prosperity🔱🐲💸]

one thing we could do is to define what conditions there are in order for a vote to count. for example, that a voter must be a party member for the full period of the vote, or at least until the end.
i'll be out in the boondocks this weekend. i've given a few of my ideas so i'm sure you'll be able to come up with something sensible in my absence.

[President Mitt]

How about a counter proposal, one that wouldn't put the outcome of somebody's vote in the hands of a potentially Dictatorial Election Clerk.

(4). An Atlasian must have been a member of the Popular Party for at least one week prior to, to participate in the Popular Party Leadership elections.

[segwaystyle2012]

How about we just ban the trolls from our party?

[Sewer]

How about we just ban the trolls from our party?

Why do you wish to be kicked out?

[#CriminalizeSobriety]

How about a counter proposal, one that wouldn't put the outcome of somebody's vote in the hands of a potentially Dictatorial Election Clerk.

(4). An Atlasian must have been a member of the Popular Party for at least one week prior to, to participate in the Popular Party Leadership elections.

I like Giovanni's proposal. Unless there are any objections, I will be putting it to a vote sometime tomorrow afternoon.

I will be allowing maximum time for voting on it, since it is serious business.

[Obnoxiously Slutty Girly Girl]

I am opposed to all of the proposed amendments that would undermine the foundation upon which this party was built.

[Uncle Albert/Admiral Halsey]

How about a counter proposal, one that wouldn't put the outcome of somebody's vote in the hands of a potentially Dictatorial Election Clerk.

(4). An Atlasian must have been a member of the Popular Party for at least one week prior to, to participate in the Popular Party Leadership elections.

It sounds good but then if you got somebody to commit vote fraud before a Populares election and you knew when the election was being held, then you could just get that somebody to register with the Populares Party a week before the election. I am new to Atlasian politics, so maybe this scenario is implausible, but that's just a thought.

[President Mitt]

I am opposed to all of the proposed amendments that would undermine the foundation upon which this party was built.

What principles are being violated by the amendment?

Under the status quo, it would be incredibly simple for a group of Atlasians to switch parties (even if only for 7 minutes) to drastically alter party affairs for malicious intent.

[#CriminalizeSobriety]

How about a counter proposal, one that wouldn't put the outcome of somebody's vote in the hands of a potentially Dictatorial Election Clerk.

(4). An Atlasian must have been a member of the Popular Party for at least one week prior to, to participate in the Popular Party Leadership elections.

It sounds good but then if you got somebody to commit vote fraud before a Populares election and you knew when the election was being held, then you could just get that somebody to register with the Populares Party a week before the election. I am new to Atlasian politics, so maybe this scenario is implausible, but that's just a thought.

If a voter is suspect, we can merely bump the previous convention thread and hold an expulsion vote, in such a scenario.

[#CriminalizeSobriety]

(4). An Atlasian must have been a member of the Popular Party for at least one week prior to, to participate in the Popular Party Leadership elections.

Vote aye or nay. This vote will close Monday, 9:00 PM, Atlas time.

[President Mitt]

Aye

[Uncle Albert/Admiral Halsey]

Aye

[CatoMinor]

aye