Snowden thread

[Okay, maybe Mike Johnson is a competent parliamentarian.]

Not to the point of grounding a head of state's plane over a suspicion without evidence regarding a victimless if irritating crime, I should hope.

Well, yeah, that's obviously ridiculous.

So we agree at least that Morales was treated badly?

[Tender Branson]

Meanwhile, Bolivia "declared war" on Austria, France, Italy, Portugal and the US of course.

They "declared war on us" because we searched their plane for Snowden (which of course is understandable and a necessary check, considering that a guy who could impact relations with the US might come here) and Morales actually agreed that the plane is searched:

(Reuters) - Bolivia accused Austria of an act of aggression by searching President Evo Morales' plane on Wednesday and blamed Washington for its forced landing in Vienna over suspicions that former U.S. spy agency contractor Edward Snowden was on board.

...

Bolivia has now officially said that this was a mistake: Austria was not "keeping Morales hostage on behalf of the US" and that "the search of the plane was not an act of aggression".

"There is no problem regarding Austria, in fact we are happy that we could land there."

"The anger of Bolivia is directed against the US and other countries that forced us to land there."

http://derstandard.at/1371171637073/Bolivien-Kein-Problem-mit-Oesterreich

I think Morales had a talk with his ambassador and told him he should shut the f**k up.

[© tweed]

Maduro offers asylum to Snowden.

[Lief 🗽]

Times like this make me wish Chavez were still alive. He would have loved this.

[Silent Hunter]

He didn't hurt anyone. Other countries aren't acting like this over Roman Polanski who did something far worse.

The US still has a standing extradition order on him.

[Tender Branson]

Pollster is one of the 2 that do the election projections on election day:



58-35 against.

[Franknburger]

Pollster is one of the 2 that do the election projections on election day:



58-35 against.

The other two questions are equally interesting:

1.) Merkel needs to protest stronger against the US (spying on Germany): 78 yes, 19 no.

2.) German government is not able to protect us from being spied upon: 67 yes, 30 no.

Pretty bad for a government facing election, and running primarily on its foreign policy (i.e. Euro-Crisis) credentials.
Also quite a disaster for US foreign policy.

[politicus]

As a curiosity Birgitta Jonsdottir, chairman of the Left Greens, tried to get the Icelandic parliament to grant Snowden Icelandic citizenship, but the speaker denied her request to put the motion on the agenda before the summer break - Althinget doesn't reconvene until 10/9. Anyway with the present centre-right governmet this was always a no-go.

[Tender Branson]

Funny side note:

The Austrian Pirates put up a headline on their website a few days ago: "Pirate Party to unveil new front-runner for federal election @ press conference."

Media was like "oh wow, what ? we thought they already picked their frontrunner ?"

Then the Pirates announced that the new frontrunner is Edward Snowden.

A joke it was and the press conference was called off a few days later.

Also a way to attract some attention ...

[politicus]

Maduro has now declared Venezuela is willing to give Snowden asylum.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/southamerica/venezuela/10163819/President-Nicolas-Maduro-offers-Edward-Snowden-asylum.html

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

Now that Venezuela and Bolivia are open to granting him asylum he better jump on an Aeroflot flight before Putin sends him back here.

There is no way we are going to interdict a Russian passenger plane.......too risky to raise the tension level that high.

[Tender Branson]

Snowden has sent an asylum request to Venezuela, Maduro has confirmed:

Venezuela receives official asylum request from Snowden

Venezuelan President, Nicolas Maduro, has confirmed that the South American nation has received an official request for asylum from US fugitive Edward Snowden. After announcing last week that he would offer asylum to Snowden, Maduro told reporters in Caracas, the former security contractor would have to arrange the details of his flight from Moscow to Venezuela.

"We received an application letter for asylum from Snowden. He will need to decide when to fly here, if he definitely wants to fly here. Latin America is probably the only region as a collective of several countries, to offer humanitarian asylum or collective political asylum." "The United Statesdoes not govern the world nor does it govern us. We are a free and sovereign country and no one else but the Venezuelan people, the legitimate government elected by the people, governs us." said Nicolas Maduro.

Snowden was charged by the US government with three counts of felony after he disclosed a highly-classified surveillance program, which intercepts the e-mails and phone conversations of millions of people.

http://www.ecns.cn/2013/07-09/72262.shtml

The question now is: How does he get from Russia to Venezuela with a revoked US passport and without being intercepted by US fighter jets when passing near the US border ?

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

The question now is: How does he get from Russia to Venezuela with a revoked US passport and without being intercepted by US fighter jets when passing near the US border ?

The US is NOT going to interdict a Russian airliner.....period.

[Tender Branson]

The question now is: How does he get from Russia to Venezuela with a revoked US passport and without being intercepted by US fighter jets when passing near the US border ?

The US is NOT going to interdict a Russian airliner.....period.

And if another nation sends a plane to escort him to Venezuela ?

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

The question now is: How does he get from Russia to Venezuela with a revoked US passport and without being intercepted by US fighter jets when passing near the US border ?

The US is NOT going to interdict a Russian airliner.....period.

And if another nation sends a plane to escort him to Venezuela ?

Venezuela or another nation may give him a travel document but he's got to fly Aeroflot if he wants to make it to Venezuela without going directly to jail.  Do you think he's crazy enough to take a flight other than on a Russian plane?

[Tender Branson]

The question now is: How does he get from Russia to Venezuela with a revoked US passport and without being intercepted by US fighter jets when passing near the US border ?

The US is NOT going to interdict a Russian airliner.....period.

And if another nation sends a plane to escort him to Venezuela ?

Venezuela or another nation may give him a travel document but he's got to fly Aeroflot if he wants to make it to Venezuela without going directly to jail.  Do you think he's crazy enough to take a flight other than on a Russian plane?

I think the best way for him would either be the Russian plane or the Venezuela-sent plane with the President Maduro on it. Do you think the US or another country would then risk grounding the plane or interdict it and force a search on the plane or a forceful removal of Snowden from the plane ?

I think if Hugo Chavez were still amongst us and healthy, he would have personally went to Moscow, asked the Venezuelan embassy there to escort Snowden to his gate with a car and fly him to Venezuela, just to show the middle-finger to the US.

[Tender Branson]

Anyway, what do you think are the best routes for Snowden to fly to Venezuela ?

Moscow -> Teheran, Iran (no extradition-treaty with US) -> some West African country (almost no country there has an extradition-treaty with US) -> Venezuela.

[Middle-aged Europe]

Does Venezuela have any subs?

They could send a submarine to Murmansk and pick them up there.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

The question now is: How does he get from Russia to Venezuela with a revoked US passport and without being intercepted by US fighter jets when passing near the US border ?

The US is NOT going to interdict a Russian airliner.....period.

And if another nation sends a plane to escort him to Venezuela ?

Venezuela or another nation may give him a travel document but he's got to fly Aeroflot if he wants to make it to Venezuela without going directly to jail.  Do you think he's crazy enough to take a flight other than on a Russian plane?

I think the best way for him would either be the Russian plane or the Venezuela-sent plane with the President Maduro on it. Do you think the US or another country would then risk grounding the plane or interdict it and force a search on the plane or a forceful removal of Snowden from the plane ?

I think if Hugo Chavez were still amongst us and healthy, he would have personally went to Moscow, asked the Venezuelan embassy there to escort Snowden to his gate with a car and fly him to Venezuela, just to show the middle-finger to the US.

They would never inderdict a plane with Maduro on it.....the pissant from Bolivia was bad enough, but not Maduro's plane.  They won't f[inks] with a Russian jet either....too risky.  Your alternate route summary is plausable.

[Tender Branson]

Does Venezuela have any subs?

They could send a submarine to Murmansk and pick them up there.

They actually have 2 German ones:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_209_submarine

But there are conflicting reports about how far they can go. Some page I've found said that they are not for the sea or long-range, Wikipedia says they can reach 20.000 km.

I frankly have no clue about submarines ...

[Silent Hunter]

The US is NOT going to interdict a Russian airliner.....period.

It wouldn't be US responsibility; it would be that of any NATO country he passes over and they interdict Russian military aircraft all the time. OK, those ones are just doing it for the LOLs, but still.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

The US is NOT going to interdict a Russian airliner.....period.

It wouldn't be US responsibility; it would be that of any NATO country he passes over and they interdict Russian military aircraft all the time. OK, those ones are just doing it for the LOLs, but still.

A passenger jet is off limits, my friend and NATO is not messing with one.

[Grumpier Than Uncle Joe]

Well, he's applied for temporary asylum in Russia.......I'm sure they'll grant it.