SB 107-02: Hospitals Act (Rejected)

[WD]

What about this bill is “literal communism”? What do you think communism is?

[Mad Deadly Worldwide Communist Gangster Computer God]

I encourage people to educate themselves on how AtlasCare works and note how it is very different from the OTL American healthcare system. See the AtlasCare page for benefits currently covered since we've expanded it.

[OBD]

yeah i don't really want to f!ck with atlascare guys, lol

[OSR stands with Israel]

Nay

[Schiff for Senate]

What about this bill is “literal communism”? What do you think communism is?

Since you don't seem to know the meaning of communism, this Wikipedia page should help, particularly this quote (the bolded should be particularly helpful):

[Communism is] a socioeconomic order structured upon the ideas of common ownership of the means of production [in this case, the healthcare industry] and the absence of social classes [everyone would be forced into the same healthcare regardless of their social class], money, and the state.

If this isn't helpful in your understanding the definition of communism, try Google.

[Schiff for Senate]

By my count, one more nay vote will kill the amendment. Who wants that (dis)honour?

[WD]

What about this bill is “literal communism”? What do you think communism is?

Since you don't seem to know the meaning of communism, this Wikipedia page should help, particularly this quote (the bolded should be particularly helpful):

[Communism is] a socioeconomic order structured upon the ideas of common ownership of the means of production [in this case, the healthcare industry] and the absence of social classes [everyone would be forced into the same healthcare regardless of their social class], money, and the state.

If this isn't helpful in your understanding the definition of communism, try Google.

This bill works towards none of that. And I know what communism is, thank you very much.

[Schiff for Senate]

What about this bill is “literal communism”? What do you think communism is?

Since you don't seem to know the meaning of communism, this Wikipedia page should help, particularly this quote (the bolded should be particularly helpful):

[Communism is] a socioeconomic order structured upon the ideas of common ownership of the means of production [in this case, the healthcare industry] and the absence of social classes [everyone would be forced into the same healthcare regardless of their social class], money, and the state.

If this isn't helpful in your understanding the definition of communism, try Google.

This bill works towards none of that. And I know what communism is, thank you very much.

Actually, it does, since it intends to allow public (i.e., common) ownership of the entire healthcare industry (not exactly a means of production, but in essence the same point). It will destroy an entire industry and make it 'publicly owned' and will in fact blunten (though not actually remove) social class by forcing everyone regardless of whether they can afford better healthcare or not into the same healthcare.

[Deep Dixieland Senator, Muad'dib (OSR MSR)]

Abstain

[WD]

What about this bill is “literal communism”? What do you think communism is?

Since you don't seem to know the meaning of communism, this Wikipedia page should help, particularly this quote (the bolded should be particularly helpful):

[Communism is] a socioeconomic order structured upon the ideas of common ownership of the means of production [in this case, the healthcare industry] and the absence of social classes [everyone would be forced into the same healthcare regardless of their social class], money, and the state.

If this isn't helpful in your understanding the definition of communism, try Google.

This bill works towards none of that. And I know what communism is, thank you very much.

Actually, it does, since it intends to allow public (i.e., common) ownership of the entire healthcare industry (not exactly a means of production, but in essence the same point). It will destroy an entire industry and make it 'publicly owned' and will in fact blunten (though not actually remove) social class by forcing everyone regardless of whether they can afford better healthcare or not into the same healthcare.

Social class will exist regardless of the ownership status of the healthcare industry.

[Schiff for Senate]

What about this bill is “literal communism”? What do you think communism is?

Since you don't seem to know the meaning of communism, this Wikipedia page should help, particularly this quote (the bolded should be particularly helpful):

[Communism is] a socioeconomic order structured upon the ideas of common ownership of the means of production [in this case, the healthcare industry] and the absence of social classes [everyone would be forced into the same healthcare regardless of their social class], money, and the state.

If this isn't helpful in your understanding the definition of communism, try Google.

This bill works towards none of that. And I know what communism is, thank you very much.

Actually, it does, since it intends to allow public (i.e., common) ownership of the entire healthcare industry (not exactly a means of production, but in essence the same point). It will destroy an entire industry and make it 'publicly owned' and will in fact blunten (though not actually remove) social class by forcing everyone regardless of whether they can afford better healthcare or not into the same healthcare.

Social class will exist regardless of the ownership status of the healthcare industry.

That's fair, but what I consider more relevant is the part of public ownership of an entire industry. So if this isn't literal communism, it is the biggest parts of communism without some of the comparatively less important details.

[Schiff for Senate]

Also, hasn't my amendment failed? If not, when will that happen? (I mean, I want it to pass but it's clearly not happening at this point, so technically, at what point would all hope of its passage fail?)

[Saint Milei]

Nay

[WD]

Vote on the amendment:

Aye (3): CentristRepublican, S019, Ishan

Nay (8 : Western Democrat, Discovolante, Kuumo, West Midlander, OBD, Dabbing Santa, Old School Republican, DeadPrez

Abstain (1): Muad’dib

Not voting (6): North Carolina Yankee, Joseph Cao, MB, Tack, Pericles, Spark

Amendment is rejected, debate resumes.

[West_Midlander]

I broadly agree with CR's comments. The communist ideal of a classless society has never been achieved but heavy or total state control of the economy is characteristic of repressive, authoritarian regimes during the 20th century which considered themselves true communists.

This bill nationalizes the hospital industry in a country that has already been so badly wracked by nationalization. Industry, by industry, we are on the road toward communism.

However, as far as I understand it, the AtlasCare law is an appropriate, well-intentioned piece of legislation worthy of defending. Truly, there are no changes needed in this area, especially when further nationalization is the "solution."

[Continential]

What about this bill is “literal communism”? What do you think communism is?

Since you don't seem to know the meaning of communism, this Wikipedia page should help, particularly this quote (the bolded should be particularly helpful):

[Communism is] a socioeconomic order structured upon the ideas of common ownership of the means of production [in this case, the healthcare industry] and the absence of social classes [everyone would be forced into the same healthcare regardless of their social class], money, and the state.

If this isn't helpful in your understanding the definition of communism, try Google.

This bill works towards none of that. And I know what communism is, thank you very much.

Actually, it does, since it intends to allow public (i.e., common) ownership of the entire healthcare industry (not exactly a means of production, but in essence the same point). It will destroy an entire industry and make it 'publicly owned' and will in fact blunten (though not actually remove) social class by forcing everyone regardless of whether they can afford better healthcare or not into the same healthcare.

Would you say that nationalization of Rail, an industry which were nationalized in the UK for 40 years destroyed rail?

[Schiff for Senate]

What about this bill is “literal communism”? What do you think communism is?

Since you don't seem to know the meaning of communism, this Wikipedia page should help, particularly this quote (the bolded should be particularly helpful):

[Communism is] a socioeconomic order structured upon the ideas of common ownership of the means of production [in this case, the healthcare industry] and the absence of social classes [everyone would be forced into the same healthcare regardless of their social class], money, and the state.

If this isn't helpful in your understanding the definition of communism, try Google.

This bill works towards none of that. And I know what communism is, thank you very much.

Actually, it does, since it intends to allow public (i.e., common) ownership of the entire healthcare industry (not exactly a means of production, but in essence the same point). It will destroy an entire industry and make it 'publicly owned' and will in fact blunten (though not actually remove) social class by forcing everyone regardless of whether they can afford better healthcare or not into the same healthcare.

Would you say that nationalization of Rail, an industry which were nationalized in the UK for 40 years destroyed rail?

Not all cases of nationalization are created equal. That seems apparent.


Anyway, I appreciate that you were one of just 2 senators other than me to support this amendment, but now that it was struck down, I will definitely oppose this bill (not that it matters since the president plans to veto the bill anyway).

[Joseph Cao]

I object.

Frankly, all you are doing is either delaying things further (basically fillibustering) or you are actually opposing something that will allow for a public option of sorts.

For the record, CR, I broadly agree with the thrust of your amendment (and would've voted Aye if the vote hadn't closed early, since it is a step in the right direction) but it has been a longstanding tradition to treat objections as a way of getting the entire body to weigh in on an amendment. I've done so many times and allowed many others. If I were in Westy's position I would have objected too.

Why was the vote closed early, anyway? We hadn't reached a majority threshold against.

[WD]

I object.

Frankly, all you are doing is either delaying things further (basically fillibustering) or you are actually opposing something that will allow for a public option of sorts.

Why was the vote closed early, anyway? We hadn't reached a majority threshold against.

No particular reason. I’ll take care to keep votes open longer going forward.

[WD]

Opening a final vote in 24 hours.

[Schiff for Senate]

I intend to oppose the bill because my amendment failed.

[Joseph Cao]

We have a perfectly serviceable healthcare system in AtlasCare – I don't believe there is a need to build a Tower of Babel to replace it. Debates about what is and isn't communism are not relevant to that main point of contention.

[WD]

Hospitals Act

1. All hospitals, clinics, hospice facilities, and nursing homes within the boundaries and under the legal jurisdiction of the Republic of Atlasia shall become property of the Republic of Atlasia effective January 1, 2023.
    1a. The owners of said properties shall be fairly compensated under all relevant law concerning the purchase of said properties.
2. All persons currently employed in the facilities mentioned in Section 1 shall become employees of the Republic of Atlasia effective January 1, 2023.
    2a. Employees covered by this Act shall elect a works council tasked with the day to day operations of the firm in question.
3. $1,000,000,000,000 will be allocated toward the construction of new hospitals, clinics, hospice facilities, and nursing homes over a period of five years, effective January 1, 2023.
4. Upon the passage of this legislation, no privately owned hospital, clinic, hospice facility, or nursing home may be built or opened in the Republic of Atlasia or in any area subject to its jurisdiction.
5. The AtlasCare program shall end on January 1, 2023.
6. Effective January 1, 2023, private hospital companies, insurance agencies, hospice care companies, and nursing home companies shall be placed under public ownership.
    5a. The owners of said properties shall be fairly compensated for any losses incurred as a result of said purchase of facilities.

A final vote is now open. Senators, please vote Aye, Nay, or Abstain.

[Continential]

aye

[OSR stands with Israel]

Nay