WE'RE GOING TO THE BEACH in February!!! Convention (Bylaws Discussion)

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

FEDERALIST WINTER BLAST

Virginia Beach, VA

February 2015

Image to Be Found Soon

Itinerary:
Sign-on (Saturday-Monday)
Speeches
Endorsements
Bylaw and Platform Amendments
Leadership Election
Selecting June's Locations

Member Sign In:
NC Yankee
Goldwater
Lumine
JCL
Potus2036
Jack Enderman
TJ in Cleve
DKrolga
Cris
JoMCar
Jerseyrules
Rooney
Dereich
CelticEmpire
Cassius
Anton Kreitzer
Devin
RGN
Smilo
Foucalf

I am changing up the design here some.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Federalists!!!

Are we going to have a Party?


I CAN'T HEAR YOU!!!!


LOUDER!!!!!!

We gonna have such god damn big party that all the police in Virginia aren't gonna be a enough. We gonna party so hard those hippes way out in San Francisco are gonna make tracks east. We gonna take this party so high they are going to need Space X to bring it back down to earth.

For two years we have had these boring mundane affairs that no one pays attention to and little if anything ever gets done. This is going to be different. This time we are going to either take this party to moon or to the insane asylum and yall's acoming with me because my evil dark side Crazy Yankee is in the driver's seat.

Now Who Wants to Join In? The Water is Just Fine!!!

X NC Yankee

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

FEDERALISTS!!!!

I WELCOME YOU TO VIRGINIA BEACH!!! applause

I look out at this crowd and I see a good mix. Old friends and new faces who will one day be old friends as well. I see the history of this Party and the bright future that we will make for it together both old and new. This party has been through a lot and it is easy to say enough's enough and give up for greener pastures. Some have have taken that road and yet many have not. Some of those who have left have left the game entirely and we miss our departed friends dearly and wish for them the very best.

We must commit to ourselves and to our Party the effort and creativity that will restore the Party to a position of strength as a leader of Atlasia's right and as a governing party that can command both the respect and support of Atlasians both right and center, and respect of all Atlasian's as a serious governing Party that can be trusted with the reigns of power. As a Party we have missed opportunities in the past year and we have failed to fully take advantage of the opportunity to present ourselves as an alternative. We concerned ourselves so much with previous disappointments and past actions that we didn't see the path in front of us. We do have to learn from our past but we have to be ready to lead when the moment comes as well if we want to succeed.

I must confess that recently I have been weighing heavily my future. Considering whether or not Atlasia had a place for old Yankee beyond the coming season or two. I have felt fully brunt of having to juggle a physically demanding job whilst also remaining an active part on this site and though my expectation was for a repeat of when I was in school I must say I was in for a rude awakening in that regard. Needless to say I have made my decision. I am going to run for reelection to the Senate.

I encourage other members of the Party to come forward now and make speeches on behalf of our Party and also on behalf of the Potus/Maxwell ticket. Riley is a smart guy who has the potential to be a great President with the strategic ability to not only formulate but also implement a right of center policy agenda. Maxwell has proven in many capacities from turning around the Midwest, to serving as Senator and our former Chairman, to ruling the IDS as Emperor (and I take great pride in calling him that ), and also to nearly handing me my head last June. He will make a great Vice President and once that can help restore the office in the wake of its primary tasks being remoeved a few months back.

Thanks for coming to our beach bash. Now lets PARTY!!!!

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I must confess that recently I have been weighing heavily my future. Considering whether or not Atlasia had a place for old Yankee beyond the coming season or two. I have felt fully brunt of having to juggle a physically demanding job whilst also remaining an active part on this site and though my expectation was for a repeat of when I was in school I must say I was in for a rude awakening in that regard. Needless to say I have made my decision. I am going to run for reelection to the Senate.

Best of luck! I know maybe you hate me for going at it, but I think the region will be in decent hands whatever happens.

Cheers.

No I don't hate you. If I did, it would be for ditching the Party whilst I lacked internet access (applies to Duke as well), but I couldn't bring myself to do it then, so definately not now. I was SPC's strongest chearleader my first year in Atlasia but he changed parties and then challenged me in October 2010. I still love SPC and wish he hadn't deregistered.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I would like to move for a vote to disband the Federalist Party.

I was a fool to thing that I could revive this party through sheer force of my own will. That isn't possible. We can revive this Party, I cannot.

I have seen efforts of people who are willing to save this Party and I would rather see this party shrink down to just those members who are concerned and lose those are are ready to give up, then watch as another Party gets demolished under my feet.

If you think this Party is a lost cause then I recommend determining your party affilitation through your own personal volition, and leave us to decide freely whether to push ahead or do likewise.

I will hear no more of this nonesense.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I don't believe in dissolution. I think it seeks to collectively determine the personal decision an individual makes. A 51% majority should not seek to alter the registration of the other 49%. I deeply regret to this day giving into pressure and allowing the dissolution of the RPP to proceed in 2012 I will be damned if I another group of idiots seeks to determine mine or anyone else's registration on their behalf.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I would like to move for a vote to disband the Federalist Party.

I was a fool to thing that I could revive this party through sheer force of my own will. That isn't possible. We can revive this Party, I cannot.

I have seen efforts of people who are willing to save this Party and I would rather see this party shrink down to just those members who are concerned and lose those are are ready to give up, then watch as another Party gets demolished under my feet.

If you think this Party is a lost cause then I recommend determining your party affilitation through your own personal volition, and leave us to decide freely whether to push ahead or do likewise.

I will hear no more of this nonesense.

Yank, I don't want to leave the party. The Federalist Party has been my home since I joined this game. Many people are just like me. They support the Federalist Party, don't want to leave the Feds, but they recognize that it is ineffective and beyond salvage.

If the members of this party wish to preserve the part and give re-invigoration go, they should have the opportunity to. If the party wishes to disband and make way for new parties on the right, I believe they should have their wishes granted.

A straight up-or-down vote on dissolution is all this would take.

We came within inches of having a working majority in the Senate in conjunction with the Presidency. We could have had Cris as an incumbent going into December, but we lost that election. Maybe we would have been more effective if I had hung you by your heels to make a point about the impact of defections (rather blatant in that case), but that is not me and not my style. I believe in freedom of choice. It should be noted that if the energy employed by various people over many months in actions that undermined the Party had worked collaboratively to build it up, the situation would be far less dire now. And if this Party is dissolved, is some of group of them going to suddenly form another part(ies)? If so that begs th question, where was that energy and enegagement when they were here?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

You guys will have an endorsement vote for President. As former Chairman of this party, I would like to speak my piece in favor of endorsing Maxwell/Dallasfan65.

Dallasfan and I are dedicated to the economic principles set forth by Federalists. We wish to be ever more vigilant in those ideas. I will be as strong as a President as we need to be to fight off the continual movement toward bigger government and weaker individuals.

But even on those things we don't agree on. I'm not a man who is unwilling to listen. I will hear out your concerns, because this isn't just me, this is the seat chosen by the people. I will be unveiling a more broad platform in the next couple of days, and I hope you can join me in this rapid and wonderful journey to the White House.

Thank you for hearing me out.

Barring more speeches, we will probably start that process tomorrow or Friday. I am heavily leaning towards voting for you guys and probably will absent another unexpected shakeup.

I think on most areas we do agree when it comes to the majority of policies before the Federal Gov't.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Regardless of what anyone thinks of the state of the party and of the benefits or costs of dissolution, I think we should agree that RIGHT NOW is not the best time for it. We're a week away from a major election and just about the WORST thing I can think of is for a massive split in the right to occur when what we need to focus on is electing Federalists. So can we please table this discussion until after the election?

Indeed, concern about the state of the Party should be focused on improving such during the times when stuff is possible to be done. Namely, during the elections cycle.

Also more then just a Party, we have an obligation as a Party of the right to advance the interests and objectives of a Conservative movement and even if we no longer have a candidate in this election, that includes electing the most Conservative President practical improving the right's position in the Senate.

This Party has always lacked as far back as 2013 a coherent set of motivations for winning elections, beyond just defeating the left. We divided on many issues in that year and that set us down the road to decline ever since. Unity of opinion since then on the major issues has at the same time failed to yieled the proper level of motivation, the same thing I tried to instill late last year. The basics are as easy as can be. Economic formulas that don't stifle growth, a balanced foreign policy, preserving regional influence in as many areas as possible and reforms that serve a purpose and don't cause more harm that good. If you agree with all or most of these basic tenets, but are bored or discouraged then its time to posit ideas on how to better advance them and then put them into action.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Chairman Yankee,

How about a complete reform overhaul including name change? TBH I would never support a disbandment, but it is true that we need to save face. I'd say need to rethink how we do everything. We need a new face. We need a new name. A new party. Saving spirit, but saving face. We need for everyone to come back together. We need to reinvent ourselves. Shave the ideas that we've already tried and form a completely new coalition. From the far right, to the left of centre. In order to change the game, we need to change ourselves.

Thank you.

I think you may be right about an overhaul but I would caution that when the RPP reached its lowest point the road to near ruin began with a divisive name change vote. We must therefore keep that in mind and try to seek a broad consensus on a potential new name. Federalist Party just like Regional Protection Party is a name that avoids references to real life parties and real life ideologies and that some members may take issue with. Libertarians with Conservative Party, Democratic and Indy members with Republican etc etc.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Why don't you just call it the Regional Protection Party, then? Its core tenet would be something that everyone in the party could get behind and might actually serve to unify a group that is sometimes TOO ideologically diverse. Refocus and unify around something real. Makes sense to me.

Theoretically, Federalism should have served the same purpose, or at least I thought it could. It incorporates regional protection but into a broader understanding and focus.

The irony about this party is that it has no bad history to overcome and no scandals to make up for. Some of the things the RPP did back in the day were downright dirty, but that made fixing it easier (Duke and I dumped Mr. Clean all over the place). This party is held back by collective perceptions of failure and the vicious cycle such creates when played out through the actions of people motivated by such perceptions forming a self-fulfilling prophesy. Taken from a distance, it is all rather pathetic and stupid when compared to the dire straits past parties have faced.

Duke would kill me.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Of all the parties in Atlasia, the only one that comes close to supporting regional rights is the Federalists. I joined the party for that reason. But this farce going on at the Convention is ridiculous.

Its got nothing on this:
https://uselectionatlas.org/FORUM/index.php?topic=103165.0

No one in this party wants to organize it. A lot has been thrown at Yankee from time to time, but he is the only person trying to lead an organized campaign of any sort. A new party will not solve anything if no one will put in the time to be a leader.

It's time for party stalwarts to man up and take some responsibility upon themselves.

Part of the problem was that the "Stalwarts" spent much of 2013 fighting each other behind the scenes in several concentric circles of opposition over different issues. Conservatives against Duke, Regionalists against Duke, Tmth and Maxwell, and so on and so forth. It is not surprising that some ended up leaving, though one would anticipate one side winning and the other losing, virtually all have left.

New people have to take their place and that can be intimidating. Many have done well like Cris, JoMCar and so forth. But we need more of them and then more lateral communication and collaboration.

I would recommend reviewing past Parties and past actions. Public campaigning, caucuses, and intriguing conventions were part of the norm. Most every Federalist convention has been boring even when the Party was doing well.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Leave the RPP to rest in peace. This party will never be the RPP. The closest thing to it was The People's Party's first run. The RPP had something special about it that hasn't really been replicated since.

The problem with the federalists is lack of engagement. I was a member for a while and I really felt like Yankee and I were the only two people in the party. In private avenues for communication, Yankee and I would talk and no one else would participate. He can't save this party alone. He needs help. The great thing about the RPP was it was full of active members who cared and wanted to make it better.

This party has held the white house for three terms and failed to accomplish anything in those terms. I was almost thrown out rather than being embraced, and I wrote my own bills and did everything separate from the Federalist Party, and while I can't really speak for lumine, but I haven't seen a big federalist engagement with his presidency either. Granted, having like 2 senate seats doesn't help either.

But if this party wants to continue, help Yankee. He seems to be the only one with the passion to keep it going, and I know he can't do it alone.

You objective with the TPP in its first run may have been so, but only engulfing the right would have made it so and that didn't happen. The RPP was never any thing but a right of center Party and the TPP has always acclaimed to be centrist far more like the NLC and DA then the RPP.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I think the suggestion was that a name change occur as part of a broader restructuring and overhaul not a whole affair on its own, in which case yes, it would solve nothing obviously.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

You are not the first one to suggest expunging the Social Conservatives, Hagrid. Way back in December 2010, I had a long exchange with Afleitch that basically produced the same recommendation. The problem is, it doesn't work mathematically especially with a firmly emplaced centrist Party like the TPP occupying that section of the spectrum. Back then it would have required the centrist JCPers to join the RPP and turn the party essentially into what the TPP is now, and chances are regionalism would have been sacrificed in the process as well. Which leads me to another point, some of the most fervent regionalists are your diehard social conservatives. If you go firmly anti-consolidation, and expel the social conservatives, you are slicing yourself too thin to compete.

Think of who helped to lead the opposition to consolidation back in 2013 (He was among the first to depart ). The most committed anti-consolidationist in the Party is arguably JCL. I would hazard that 75% of the regionalists are socially conservative.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

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Unless I am mistaken, we have a primary in the Midwest as well, correct?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

You guys can't see the forest for the trees. I've been trying to give you good advice for ages, but you just refuse to accept it because of a "different dynamic" that supposedly applies to one side and not the other. At any rate, the current problem with the Federalists is that you have a Chair that's not doing much of anything, that hasn't done anything for months, and that's likely going to lose historically what is considered the safest seat in the game (so much for rejecting "different dynamics", eh?).

Get a new Chair, and do it soon, before my party has no one left to rationally oppose.

Actually, I have managed to do quite a lot in spite of immense obstacles obviously. Of course a lot of it was behind the scenes, and I cannot be on 24/7 to keep up with every shift and turn like I used to so the impression may be that I am asleep at the wheel but I am not as clueless as I may appear to be.

The problem with beating Hagrid is that he covers a lot of the same bases that I cover and thus it would be hard to be beat him in any circumstances.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

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Did I miss anything here?

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Yankee, I don't mean kicking the social conservatives out, because I agree that they're a necessary element. I just mean reaching an agreement that they remain 100% silent on those issues. And the party could likewise adopt a zero tolerance policy. Griffin is good at what he does, and... no offense, but I don't dispute his current suggestion... but he does miss the dynamic of this party. It needs to be a place where a very diverse group of people can all feel welcome. And when one segment of the group espouses the "devinely ordained" belief that another segment of the group is unclean sinners doomed to hell (and should subsequently have less rights as a result), "community" doesn't happen. When the numbers are such that bi-monthly bills to severely restrict a woman's right to choose undercut the compassionate message of the party, there's a problem too.

I realize the existence of TPP makes it more challenging, but extreme conservatism will always be scarier to the moderates like Polnut than extreme leftism. We've seen it before. There needs to be a change, and the social conservatives need to be in the headspace that understands why this sacrifice is necessary.

If that is what you intended to say, then we would agree to a large extent. However, this is what you said yesterday and one can easily miscontrue it:

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[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Perhaps I misunderstand some of the points that have been made but in general it strikes me as a bad idea to form a new party based on the premise that large segments of its base are supposed to keep their mouths shut about an issue that is important to them. Let's be frank, gay issues are settled so the most prominent topic is abortion. Obviously, there absolutely must be room for pro-life members in a center-right party; pro-life views aren't even limited to the "right" in the first place. You'll find pro-lifers all across the political spectrum and in every Atlasian party.

To me, the main problem appears to be that the Federalist Party is widely perceived as wishy washy. In the eyes of many the party has failed to present a coherent alternative to the far-left proposals dominating the political discourse in the Senate. As I already stated on numerous occasions during Duke's presidency the Federalists are going to render themselves irrelevant in the long run if they content themselves with the role of trying to moderate proposals that could have been taken right out of the communist manifesto. Instead, officeholders of the main center-right party in the game should vehemently oppose such ideas and passionately defend their own vision of a free-market based society.

(I thought this was an important point to be made. Sorry for interrupting.)

It is hard to exercise flexibility when the fear of losing the next election could lead to drastic changes that would be just as if not more devastating to the right then being rendered impotent slowly over time. The early part of last year presented us this dual trap of not only having the White House but also the desperate need to remain at parity lest we lose by default.

You are right, but we did get to move the needle significantly in some areas though. The biggest success was in the area of healthcare. I think what is lacking is a sense of purpose not because of any intentional act, but rather a concession on a large number of people that the situation is hopeless (which breads defeat, leading to more discouragement). It is a cycle and in order to advocate for a robust alternative, you need not only the willingness but the motivation to try in spite of long odds. It is far less painful to go indy, but doing so leaves newer and less connected Conservatives at a disadvantage.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Yankee has put the final nail in the coffin, so to speak, by effectively disappearing (whether he admits it or not). This occurred almost from the onset of his tenure. Extenuating reasons aside, every single attribute - party recruitment, candidate cultivation, regional organization, all of it - has been neglected.

Regional Organization requires regional leaders, Candidate cultivation requires wins. I would get somebody to lead a region or lined up for an office (Secretary) only to have them slip away become inactive or jump ship after weeks of toil and labor (pun intended ). I would line up candidates  for winnable races only to watch in agony as they were screwed from within by someone deciding it was their turn to rage against the machine. I made over a dozen recruitment contacts in just in the Spring period alone. From February to August, I exerted every effort on each of those fronts only to find I was pumping air into blown tire. You are right though that from August until October, I was absent with no internet access from home and again over Christmas because of illness and most of January because I was moving. 

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Engagement with other members was a problem with my tenure, yes, and I feel like I didn't do enough to get people in at the regional level. I was too focused on Senate elections and Presidential elections when it turned out to not matter that much if you don't have good people on the ground floor. That was a rookie mistake. And yes, I can attest that Hagrid's influence in the party by my chairmanship was minimal, though ZuWo and Yankee had a much stronger influence, which is where a lot of the power struggles came from.

I think I've always been better in offices than in the party organization.

It's so fun to dig up old corpses and find out what went wrong! (referring to my tenure)

Actually, I felt rather isolated in the party until the latter period of 2013 and part of that was because I kept myself aloof for much the same reason as Duke said about the name earlier, "This is not the RPP" and also I was not thrilled with someone changing my registration for me for the second time (I opposed the merger remember). I never had any desire to lead this party until I began to feel Hagrid was making a mistake regarding the events of 2013 and the effects of the game would be terrible. Even then I figured someone else and maybe Hagrid hismelf would realize this and take a better. I thought your did a good job as a chairman, and yes you had rookie mistakes but your mistake was not in making mistakes but staying in office too short a time to identify, correct and learn from them. You did a hell of a good job in December 2013, I thought.

The problem was that of the big leaders, so many had come to view the others as operating on a different wave length on different sets of issues. THe end result is that most all of them are now no longer Federalists. Typically a split leads to one group leaving whilst the other claims control, here, everyone ended up leaving because the disagreements were over different things. Undrmining each other became the sport of the party and became a regular occurence over the course of 2014. That needs to stop.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Get a new Chair, and do it soon, before my party has no one left to rationally oppose.

They do not seem interested in this, and I say this with considerable certainty.

How many people are interested in doing it all themselves? Literally the only thing you can claim I failed at doing was that I did not effectively substitute myself for 100% of the other members. Any party that is structured to run like that is doomed to failure as soon as no one takes up the mantle of leadership, which is quite often because you get burnout and real life contingencies getting in the way.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

Numbers do permit though, because any number of candidates running to be president will still trigger a vote, per the earlier section in the text with regard to the presidency. I am almost sure we put this in.

And Duke, you were our candidate the first time in spite of the fact that you were an Independent. I thought the only reason you joined was because you felt pressed to make some demonstration of goodwill to the party for the base.

Either way, I've said a million times that someone should really gut the by-laws I wrote. They proved to be cripplingly specific. But I guess it's a bed I don't have to sleep in anymore, so to speak. So best of luck.

Yea its time to do just that. Last summer we focused on the platform and October just wasn't practical. I hope that it can be addressed after the election is over in this convention thread.

[Southern Senator North Carolina Yankee]

I was searchin on a one way street, I was looking for a chance to meet...

I was trying to find out why the former clause stipulating specifically for Presidential elections was deleted from the bylaws but I could find nothing in the June 2013 convention about this so I am still at a loss as to how to approach this issue.

I think the best solution here is to go with the Federalists automatically receiving our endorsements but I can really see an argument either way and my preference would be to respect the will of the Party. Some part of me just wants to endorse no one as the safe bet, like Hagrid did for the June 2013 Pacific Senate election but that was a different circumstances. Regardless, of what result I hand down, we have got to have a new bylaw package, particularly on elections and most specifically, we need to have a section for Presidential elections. This set seems heavily designed for Senate obviously to the exclusion of the other races. This shall be our post election priority, to throw out the bylaws and redo them. I will go into my detail later on, but I would like to encourage if not incorporate the caucuses and go after regional level organization (and yes I need leaders willing to stand up in each region).

Anyway without further ado:
President:
JCL ( 5 ): Devin, JoMCar, CelticEmpire, Cassius, JCL
Maxwell ( 7  ): Dkrolga, Cathcon, Foucaulf, Goldwater, SMilo, Pessimistic Antineutrino, Dereich

JCL endorsed as Federalist, I guess


Midwest Senate:
Dereich ( 9 ): Devin, dkrolga, Cathcon, Dereich, Goldwater, SMilo, Pessimistic Antineutrino, Dereich, JoMCar
Cassius ( 3 ): CelticEmpire, Cassius, JCL

Dereich is endorsed for Midwest Senate

Cinyc:
Yes (10): Devin, dkrolga, Cathcon, Goldwater, SMilo, Pessimistic Antineutrino, JoMCar, CelticEmpire, Cassius, JCL
No (2): Foucaulf, Dereich

Cinyc endorsed.


Endorsements:
President - JCL/Devin
Mideast Senate - None
Midwest Senate - Dereich
Northeast Senate - Cinyc
Pacific Senate - None
Southeast Senate - NC Yankee