Fight Night (The Debates): C-SPAN: CO GOV LIVE, HI GOV, IL GOV, NH SEN + AK SEN

[cinyc]

But will it get higher ratings than Parker/Spitzer?  The odds are good.

[cinyc]

The only good part was when O'Donnell started floundering with the evolution question.

The rape and incest abortion thing I don't think will go over well in Delaware either.

She answered the evolution question just fine by stating that her personal views are irrelevant - What I said now and said then is that is should be up to the local school boards to decide what to teach, not dictated from up above.

Anyway, it's the economy, stupid.  Most voters don't care about evolution or abortion or other social issues this cycle.  Conservatives who care would have voted for her regardless.  Liberals who disagree wouldn't be voting for her regardless.

O'Donnell wasn't the best, but blew far past the low expectations Democrats inexplicably set for her.  To me, Coons came across as an arrogant, condescending prick.  And the moderators were largely on Coons' side.

[cinyc]

She gave a horrible answer to the Evolution question.  The fact she thinks its ok for schools to teach Creationism along with Evolution is just absurd.  This is Delaware, now Texas, that crap won't fly.

Very few voters care about evolution in most election cycles.  Nobody really cares this cycle, when the economy is front-and-center.  It's a non-issue.

And Sussex County, Delaware is a lot like Texas, in some ways.

[cinyc]

Do you any Democrats not come off that way to you?

Off the top of my head, just from our local area politicians, Gillibrand doesn't.  Lieberman doesn't.  Paterson doesn't.   Senator Moynihan never did.  I don't see the NJ Senators enough to really form an opinion, but Corey Booker usually doesn't come across as an arrogant prick, either.  None of them are Chuck Schumer.  

Coons just came across as arrogant in the debate, continually claiming that there was no way he could respond to all of O'Donnell's points and talking down to her.  Saying that once would be one thing, but repeating the same canned crap after practically every one of her responses just became grating.

[cinyc]

The economy is most important, but voters don't want kooks either..  Believing Evolution is a myth and schools should be able to teach Creationism along with Evolution as equally valid is a kooky position to have.  Sussex County might be like Texas, but its 21% of the state.

Believing that local school boards should decide curriculum is hardly a controversial position.  Moreover, you are greatly overestimating the percentage of Americans who care about a politician's views on evolution - and what Americans actually think about evolution, for that matter.  Americans who believe the conventional scientific view of evolution due to natural processes are actually in the MINORITY - 32%, per Pew in 2009.  22% believe in evolution guided by a supreme being - more or less intelligent design.  And 31% believe humans existed in their present form since the beginning of time - more or less creationism.  

[cinyc]

Not being able to answer a question about the Supreme Court Decisions she disagreed with was pretty pathetic.

That's a trick question used primarily against conservatives to make them look stupid.  The question was what RECENT decisions do you disagree with, not all decisions.  It's a conservative court, and conservatives agree with almost all of the Supreme Court's most recent decisions.  Therefore, they have to think a lot before responding - probably back to Kelo, which is the only recent decision that jumps out to me.  Most of the decisions conservatives don't like are older, like Roe v. Wade, which was beyond the bounds of the question.

Note that the moderators didn't try to force Coons to name another decision he disagreed with when he mentioned the same Citizens United decision that was brought up in a previous question.  The moderators were so biased and out to burn the witch at the stake that it wasn't close to fair.

[cinyc]

Oh please, what a load of hackish crap.  The moderators asked a perfectly fair question, Coons was able to answer O'Donnell could not.  They were fair throughout.

That question is as loaded as asking a candidate which recent positions of Barack Obama you disagree with.  A Republican would come up with multiple, easy answers.  A Democrat would have a much tougher time answering it because he agrees with much of the Obama agenda.

Conservatives agree with a majority of the recent Supreme Court jurisprudence because it has been conservative.  Our beef is usually with insane lower court decisions, especially from the Ninth Circuit.  I can't think of another recent Supreme Court decision that conservatives usually disagree with other than Kelo and perhaps some of the campaign finance decisions for not going far enough.

But my guess is this will be the soundbite the lamestream media harps on, since it makes O'Donnell look stupid.

[cinyc]

I'm far from the only one who thought Coons came across as condescending:

"Coons can can barely contain his disdain for his opponent," noted Gloria Borger, a senior political analyst for CNN.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/10/13/odonnell.debate.performance/

[cinyc]

Why is C-SPAN taking up 1/3 of the screen with a graphic telling us what we're seeing?  Does C-Span not have transparent graphics?

[cinyc]

I can't watch this drivel.

Yeah, they are both pretty boring.  The moderator is tanner than Boehner, though.

[cinyc]

She just said "There You Go Again."

Both seem to be referencing Mr. Reagan a lot.

I guess the Republican and Democratic internals finally agree on one thing - Nevadans like President Reagan.

[cinyc]

As did I. I think she won the last impression battle. I missed too much of the debate to know how she did on the questions. Who would you all say won?

Reid was boring.  Angle was boring.  Since Reid needed Angle to look totally unhinged, I guess she won.  But the real loser was sellers of sleeping pills in Nevada.

[cinyc]

The irritating thing is that, really, since McCain/Palin debate performances and the tidal wave of crazy things Republican candidates have said and done in the last year, debates have become nearly impossible to lose anymore if you're a Republican as far out there as Angle.

Unless you approach Jan Brewer-levels of complete insanity, the standards have been set so pitifully low for Republicans in debate-style settings that anything short of a complete and utter breakdown on camera is considered a "win."

Perhaps the lesson is that Democratic candidates should stop lowering expectations for candidates who are supposedly "far out there" by incessantly calling (or having their surrogates call) them things like nuts, crazy, unhinged and extreme.  You can't win the expectations game if you set expectations extremely low.

[cinyc]

More C-SPAN stuff tonight including debates in two Senate races that the Democrats have already lost and the Vermont Gubernatorial debate (which is the most interesting to me out of the three).

The NY Senate (Special) debate between Gillibrand and DioGuardi is being livestreamed on 7online.com at 2PM and taped for air on WABC Sunday morning when nobody will watch.

[cinyc]

The irritating thing is that, really, since McCain/Palin debate performances and the tidal wave of crazy things Republican candidates have said and done in the last year, debates have become nearly impossible to lose anymore if you're a Republican as far out there as Angle.

Unless you approach Jan Brewer-levels of complete insanity, the standards have been set so pitifully low for Republicans in debate-style settings that anything short of a complete and utter breakdown on camera is considered a "win."

Perhaps the lesson is that Democratic candidates should stop lowering expectations for candidates who are supposedly "far out there" by incessantly calling (or having their surrogates call) them things like nuts, crazy, unhinged and extreme.  You can't win the expectations game if you set expectations extremely low.

Excuse me but what exactly should Angle have done to "persuade" the voters that she is a lunatic?
Start frothing from the mouth and speaking in tongues?

These two candidates are so well known and completely defined that only a huge gaffe could possibly change something. After all, you admitted that Blumenthal did poorly at his debates, yet his numbers didn't budge at all.

Also, it'd be much more interesting to have a snap poll of people who watched the debate. I still remember how the pundits declared almost unanimously that McCain won his third debate with Obama but the polls and target groups had a very different opinion.

I said nothing of the sort about Blumenthal's debate performances.  I've consistently said that while his speech patterns may have come across as halting and boring to those not used to him, Connecticut residents in the Hartford market have seen a lot of similar performances from him and still like him a lot.  I personally don't find Blumenthal all that impressive, but the Connecticut debates were still Lincoln-Douglas affairs when compared to Nevada.

Politicians make a huge mistake when they demean their opponents by calling them nuts, insane or unhinged.  If they do, they should duck debates.  Otherwise, they have set the bar so low that almost anyone will surpass it.   Expectations Management 101.

[cinyc]

Anyone know if there's going to be a debate for Alaska senate? That would be entertaining.

Various groups have held a few candidates forums with some or all of the candidates in Alaska, which are smaller, but much like debates.  I haven't heard if KTUU or another TV station is sponsoring one.

[cinyc]

I'll put this question out again. Because Angle had a relatively good performance, perhaps even beating Reid, from what I've heard (I didn't see enough to have a clear opinion in that regard). If so, because Nevadans really really  don't like Reid, could we start to see Angle pull away (in relative terms, of course)?

Reid had a couple very bad moments in the debate - not answering two simple yes or no questions with a yes or no, and for one of the answers, copping out by claiming something that's simply not true, and shuffling papers at the end of the debate to find his closing remarks.  He also at one point told Angle didn't understand what was going on in Washington - which I think Angle would agree with and think is the main problem with Washington - the people don't understand what the heck is going on there.  That could be turned into a commercial.

Harry Reid was very monotone and sleepy - but so was Angle for most of the debate (she picked it up a little near the end, after she told Harry to man up and admit Social Security has a funding issue).   Angle hit her low point when she asked the moderator to repeat a question, albeit after Reid had gone off on a tangent that had nothing to do with the original question.

By the way, I actually caught a bit of the New York debate over lunch.  In contrast to Nevada's debate, it was actually pretty lively and fast-paced, with the moderator trying to get the candidates to actually answer the questions.

[cinyc]

Besides the fact that I don't remember Reid calling Angle "nuts" or "insane", having extreme ideas doesn't necessarily means that you can't be personable or even charming.

Crazy juice, anyone?

http://www.alan.com/2010/10/06/harry-reids-new-ad-painting-sharron-angle-as-a-nutball-crazy-juice/

[cinyc]

Besides the fact that I don't remember Reid calling Angle "nuts" or "insane", having extreme ideas doesn't necessarily means that you can't be personable or even charming.

Crazy juice, anyone?

http://www.alan.com/2010/10/06/harry-reids-new-ad-painting-sharron-angle-as-a-nutball-crazy-juice/

That's an ad. I meant Reid himself saying anything of the kind.

And to be honest, Angle's Republicans opponents didn't exactly shower her with praise during primary season.

It's Reid's ad.  It does not matter if Reid tries to paint Angle as "nuts" "crazy", etc. directly by saying it himself, through his ads or indirectly through his Democratic surrogates.  All have the effect of painting his opponent as something that, once she opens her mouth in something like a debate, cannot live up to the negative hype.

[cinyc]

And Republican ads paint Reid as a corrupt baby killer that wants to steal your money.
Did he live up to that hype?

Please provide a link to that ad.

Reid is a sitting Senator and known quantity who has been representing Nevada for years.  Angle is not.  The general election brings a different set of voters, only some of whom had been paying attention to the primaries.

This debate will backfire on Reid - partially due to his own inept performance, but mainly due to Democrats' insistent demonization of Republican conservatives as crazy, extreme, unhinged, etc., thereby setting low expectations that anyone could surpass.   Nevada has gone from a true toss-up to leaning Republican.

Why do you think Senator DeMint is ducking a debate with Alvin Greene?  There's simply no way he could win it even if he blows Greene away on the technical merits.  Expectations for Greene would be far, far too low.

[cinyc]

Question: Do you guys think I should start a separate thread for gubernatorial and other non-congressional races on the other board or is this a good thread for everything? (I expect this thread will be overrun by comments on the Cuomo-Paladino debate when that happens.)

Also, did anyone watch the NY Senate Special debate? I didn't get a chance.

I don't think the Cuomo-Paladino-Spitzer's Mistress-Black Power Guy-Random Nobodies debate is going to be on C-SPAN.  It's a local cable TV exclusive.  They might make it available on the Internet.  Hopefully, the non-Cablevison networks carrying it make it available to non-Cablevision subscribers.   Cablevision holds their local news networks and Newsday hostage behind a pay wall for the rest of us.  They may or may not here, too.  If Cablevision were smart, they'd treat it as an ad for their news personalities, who are moderating the debate.  But Cablevision is rarely smart.

[cinyc]

Manchin and Raese are having their only debate at 8 PM. It'll be broadcast on C-SPAN. I'd imagine that one could get pretty ugly.

Also, the Cuomo v. Paladino v. a bunch of other crazy people awesomeness is tonight! Unfortunately, it looks like it'll only be on local news stations in NY.

The Cuomo v. Paladino v. Spitzer's Madam v. the former Black Panther v. the Rent is Too Damn High Guy starts at 7.  It should be live streamed on NY1.com, news12.com and Newsday.com among others - in theory.  None of these sites has a link up yet, and since Cablevision holds its sites hostage behind a pay wall, maybe not.

[cinyc]

Manchin and Raese are having their only debate at 8 PM. It'll be broadcast on C-SPAN. I'd imagine that one could get pretty ugly.

Also, the Cuomo v. Paladino v. a bunch of other crazy people awesomeness is tonight! Unfortunately, it looks like it'll only be on local news stations in NY.

The Cuomo v. Paladino v. Spitzer's Madam v. the former Black Panther v. the Rent is Too Damn High Guy starts at 7.  It should be live streamed on NY1.com, news12.com and Newsday.com among others - in theory.  None of these sites has a link up yet, and since Cablevision holds its sites hostage behind a pay wall, maybe not.

Newsday is behind a pay wall, but News 12 is not

http://www.news12.com/index.jsp

News 12 is behind a pay wall for those who do not use Cablevision or certain other cable companies as their ISP.

[cinyc]

It was at one time,  don't think it is anymore.   I have Verizon Fios.

It still is for me - but I've never been a Cablevision subscriber.  You might have some old cookies on your computer or something if you had Cablevision or one of the other eligible cable services.  It theoretically is available for certain cable subscribers no matter what network their computers are on. 

[cinyc]

It was at one time,  don't think it is anymore.   I have Verizon Fios.

It still is for me - but I've never been a Cablevision subscriber.  You might have some old cookies on your computer or something if you had Cablevision or one of the other eligible cable services.  It theoretically is available for cable subscribers no matter what network their computers are on.

Nope.  Last time I had Cablevision was a few years ago when I was still living with my parents ( I think 07, but could have been 06).   At that time they switched to Verizon Fios, and when I moved into my Apartment last year I got Fios right away.  I got my laptop a few months later.

All I can tell you is that I cannot access the news12.com website from my computer or cell phone.  I get a message saying that you must be a Cablevision, Time Warner, Comcast or Service Electric subscriber.